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[Mike Ferrand]

Hey all,

This is my first post here.

I am in a five piece band.  We generally do our sound from the stage, sometimes we have a sound man.  All of us sing so there are five vocal mics.  I am wondering if we could use a compressor / expander to control how much of the drums and instruments 'leak' into the vocal mix.  Right now it is quite a bit.  We generally play small venues so we are not mic'ing the instruments.

So it would work like this.  When no one is singing the expander is effectively turning down the mic's.  When someone is signing the compression is kicking in.  Is this the best way to deal with this?  Any suggestions on a box that would do this?

Cheers, Mike

[Ben Lawrence]

I think your looking for a gate not an expander or compressor.

[Nils Erickson]

I think your looking for a gate not an expander or compressor.

Well, an expander is a gate... and often they are on the same unit with a compressor.

And, no, I don't think this works all that well personally.  For me, those things work best for controlling things like toms from ringing too long.

But try it out (if you don't have to buy one to do it), you'll get a feel for what I'm talking about quickly.

Cheers,
Nils

[Chris Hindle]

... All of us sing so there are five vocal mics.  ........ to control how much of the drums and instruments 'leak' into the vocal mix.  Right now it is quite a bit.  We generally play small venues so we are not mic'ing the instruments.

Here's the problem. Loudest thing at the mic wins. Period.
No box can solve this. When you move your head away from the mic, the drums - snare and cymbals in particular - will now dominate. and they are probably louder than your vocals were. Gates and expanders can't help here. The only solution is muting mics when no one is singing into them.
- There are options to hiring a sound dude.
Floor mats or optical triggers to turn on the mics come to mind.
Chris.

[Dave Bigelow]

I think your looking for a gate not an expander or compressor.

Well, an expander is a gate... and often they are on the same unit with a compressor.

And, no, I don't think this works all that well personally.  For me, those things work best for controlling things like toms from ringing too long.

But try it out (if you don't have to buy one to do it), you'll get a feel for what I'm talking about quickly.

Cheers,
Nils

No, a gate is a gate and a comp/exp is a comp/exp.

Most decent units (ones that aren't shiny and say "pro" on them) that do one of those do not combine the other with it.

[Robert Weston]

Here's the problem. Loudest thing at the mic wins. Period.
No box can solve this. When you move your head away from the mic, the drums - snare and cymbals in particular - will now dominate. and they are probably louder than your vocals were. Gates and expanders can't help here. The only solution is muting mics when no one is singing into them.
- There are options to hiring a sound dude.
Floor mats or optical triggers to turn on the mics come to mind.
Chris.

Try using a gate with selectable frequency triggers.  Just dial in their vocal frequency range (as close as you can).  It works pretty darn good.  It's better than nothing and beats riding the faders.

[Brian Ehlers]

No, a gate is a gate and a comp/exp is a comp/exp.

A gate is to an expander what a limiter is to a compressor.  The difference is simply a matter of slope:  infinity-to-1 vs, say, 2:1.  Don't you agree?

[John Roberts {JR}]

No, a gate is a gate and a comp/exp is a comp/exp.

A gate is to an expander what a limiter is to a compressor.  The difference is simply a matter of slope:  infinity-to-1 vs, say, 2:1.  Don't you agree?

You say potato, I say tomato.

Gates and expanders do differ by degrees.

and neither will solve stage wash issues.

JR

[Dave Dermont]

This is one of those things where on the surface, the theory seems sound, but the practice is an absolute train wreak.

It seems like a good application for one of those IR optical gates which seem to either not exist or cost way too much, depending on the time of day.

[Patrick Tracy]

No, a gate is a gate and a comp/exp is a comp/exp.

A gate is to an expander what a limiter is to a compressor.  The difference is simply a matter of slope:  infinity-to-1 vs, say, 2:1.  Don't you agree?

Not really. Gates attenuate by a set amount and have controls for response speed. Expanders attenuate by a ratio and tend to be fast/instantaneous acting.

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