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[Kyle Van Sandt]

With this console using the same pre-amps from the XL4 and Heritages, do you feel that it justifies the ~$2000 premium over the X32?

The fact that they are selling this thing with at re-branded S16 pretty much makes me assume this is actually the same pre-amps that are in the X32, not the pre's that are in the Pro series.  They said the same "XL4" thing with the X32... and it is not the same.  Its good, but is not the same. 

[RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS]

The fact that they are selling this thing with at re-branded S16 pretty much makes me assume this is actually the same pre-amps that are in the X32, not the pre's that are in the Pro series.  They said the same "XL4" thing with the X32... and it is not the same.  Its good, but is not the same.

Have you torn them apart to look?

[Kyle Van Sandt]

Have you torn them apart to look?

Nope... but I have ran both consoles into the same PA with the same inputs and used my ears.

It is not the same sound.  They can call it whatever they want. 

The 48k issue and weird DSP will still be there with this desk.  I doubt it really sounds better.  I think this is 2k worth of paint.  The X32 is a great desk at the price point, not really sure why the felt the need to do this. 

[Darren Scaresbrook]

The fact that they are selling this thing with at re-branded S16 pretty much makes me assume this is actually the same pre-amps that are in the X32, not the pre's that are in the Pro series.  They said the same "XL4" thing with the X32... and it is not the same.  Its good, but is not the same.

How have you done your listening tests of the pre amps?
I presume you must have removed them from the console as that is the only way to get an accurate result so that you are not also hearing the signal as affected by the AD/DA convertors, DSP etc?

There is as much BS out there about pre's as there is about external clocking!
FWIW, all well designed pre's that are run in their linear region will be essentially identical (except for those people who clip the inputs to get "their sound", then, all bets are off. And they should never be allowed behind a console anyway!)

"rant off"

Darren

[Mac Kerr]

With this console using the same pre-amps from the XL4 and Heritages, do you feel that it justifies the ~$2000 premium over the X32?

There is no such thing as an analog console preamp repurposed into a digital console. It is much different getting the fine level control in a digital system rather than an analog gain stage with a knob. There may be parts of the design that are the same, but for those who fixate on the sound of the preamps, they are not and will not be the same.

Since The Music Group has been touting the preamps in the X32 as "Midas designed" I would expect the M32 to be very similar, if not identical.

Mac

[Bob Leonard]

There must be 6 threads on this board about this desk, and every response makes comparison to Behringer. Let's take the "B" word out of the equation for just a minute. First, it appears the board may not be made in China, but if it is I could except that knowing that at least the board is a Midas, not a Behringer design, and utilizes higher grade components all around. I could be wrong, but that's what's being suggested by Midas at this point. That alone will account for an increase in the cost of the board. More importantly though I would like to think that Midas has not copied the X32 and covered it with "2k worth of paint". It just sounds absurd that Midas has abandoned their tradition of high quality and stellar sound and rely on Behringer for THEIR designs. This makes no sense. Midas is a house of quality and I believe they intend to stay a house of quality.

IMO I think what we're seeing is a Midas push into the low cost mixer marketplace. I don't think Midas, or Behringer as it may be, has any intent to misguide the public with an over priced camouflaged X32. IMO, and it is just my opinion, is that Midas has now offered a $5K board with a ton of features, a board that effectively replaces anything from a Venice up to a Pro 1 at a reasonable price. This is a hole in the lineup Midas need to fill, and they've filled it. I see no reason for the buyer to beware-enger.

[Randy Frierson]

I think it makes perfect sense any way you want to spin it...just for the name I'd rather have the badged Midas than behringer, not saying anything bad about the behringer, just saying

There must be 6 threads on this board about this desk, and every response makes comparison to Behringer. Let's take the "B" word out of the equation for just a minute. First, it appears the board may not be made in China, but if it is I could except that knowing that at least the board is a Midas, not a Behringer design, and utilizes higher grade components all around. I could be wrong, but that's what's being suggested by Midas at this point. That alone will account for an increase in the cost of the board. More importantly though I would like to think that Midas has not copied the X32 and covered it with "2k worth of paint". It just sounds absurd that Midas has abandoned their tradition of high quality and stellar sound and rely on Behringer for THEIR designs. This makes no sense. Midas is a house of quality and I believe they intend to stay a house of quality.

IMO I think what we're seeing is a Midas push into the low cost mixer marketplace. I don't think Midas, or Behringer as it may be, has any intent to misguide the public with an over priced camouflaged X32. IMO, and it is just my opinion, is that Midas has now offered a $5K board with a ton of features, a board that effectively replaces anything from a Venice up to a Pro 1 at a reasonable price. This is a hole in the lineup Midas need to fill, and they've filled it. I see no reason for the buyer to beware-enger.

[Josh Hana]

The fact that they are selling this thing with at re-branded S16 pretty much makes me assume this is actually the same pre-amps that are in the X32, not the pre's that are in the Pro series.  They said the same "XL4" thing with the X32... and it is not the same.  Its good, but is not the same.

Did they ever actually say that the X32 were the SAME as the other midas pres? I always thought they were very careful to say "Midas designed" preamps.

But I'm definitely a bit confused by this as well. If I want a cheap console, I'll go for the X32, it's a good board, especially for the price. If I want a premium/professional console, I'll look at the pro series. I guess this is meant to be an in-between, but I don't see a point to it other than trying to push a semi-pro console into the pro market by slapping a midas badge on it

[Steve M Smith]

But I'm definitely a bit confused by this as well. If I want a cheap console, I'll go for the X32, it's a good board, especially for the price. If I want a premium/professional console, I'll look at the pro series. I guess this is meant to be an in-between, but I don't see a point to it other than trying to push a semi-pro console into the pro market by slapping a midas badge on it

It's exactly the same in the photographic world.  You can buy a perfectly good camera with Panasonic written on it or pay half as much again for essentially the same camera with a Leica logo.


Steve.

[Bob Leonard]

Josh,
You could also look at it like this. At age 62 I've spent over 40 years working in the industry in one form or another and about now I'm winding down. I purchased an Expression, not based on price alone, but because I believe in Soundcraft's quality, because the board has a good feature set, and because it fit my needs. Every year from this point on we'll see prices lowered and more affordable (to the masses) boards will appear offering new choices to us all. I had budgeted 10K for a board and spent $2200. If Midas and A&H recent offerings had been available at the time, those boards would have been at the top of my list. So now the question becomes, what constitutes a pro console? The price, or the quality/name?

[ProSoundWeb Community]