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[Jack Arnott]

And Dave, you seem to be stuck on the 7th level for a long time.

[Stuart Pendleton]

I miss that junk yard dog (michael,) and Wheels, and Jim Gould and a host of others. We used to have a scorched earth policy when idiots dropped in.

These days we have a kinder/gentler place, but not a better place. It suffers fools too easily. It isn't that we don't have pro members here, but the ratio of them to noise is a LOT higher. Took me years of being on here before I had the courage to post much because I was about 5 ladder rungs below Turbo in terms of knowledge.  Now I am only 4 rungs below.

I find it very discouraging to see DJ and bottom feeder posts on the CLASSIC side. Now I will go back to the Lounge where I belong (at least I know MY place.)

[Scott Raymond]

Stuart Pendleton wrote on Tue, 29 September 2009 09:54

I miss that junk yard dog (michael,) and Wheels, and Jim Gould and a host of others. We used to have a scorched earth policy when idiots dropped in. These days we have a kinder/gentler place, but not a better place. It suffers fools too easily. It isn't that we don't have pro members here, but the ratio of them to noise is a LOT higher. Took me years of being on here before I had the courage to post much because I was about 5 ladder rungs below Turbo in terms of knowledge.  Now I am only 4 rungs below. I find it very discouraging to see DJ and bottom feeder posts on the CLASSIC side. Now I will go back to the Lounge where I belong (at least I know MY place.)

There's close to 21,000 registered here now so we can expect some chaff with the grain.  I don't remember how many there were back in those days, maybe someone else kept track and can tell us.  Another one I remember is Lyndon Dunbar from South Africa.  And now that you mention Wheels, I wonder if he's sailed around the world by now.  He did pop up a year or two ago for a post or two but I haven't noticed anything since then.  Haven't heard anything from Turbo for a while, I expect he's getting up there in goat years.   Lots of good times back through the years!

[Doug Fowler]

Quote:

I miss that junk yard dog (michael,) and Wheels, and Jim Gould and a host of others. We used to have a scorched earth policy when idiots dropped in.

I heard from michael maybe five years ago, out of audio now AFAIK but you never know.  

Quote:

These days we have a kinder/gentler place, but not a better place. It suffers fools too easily. It isn't that we don't have pro members here, but the ratio of them to noise is a LOT higher.

I said for years that sheer numbers would ultimately degrade the S/N to the point where many would choose to not participate.  Reason = way more part-timers than working pros out there, it's just that simple.

Quote:

I find it very discouraging to see DJ and bottom feeder posts on the CLASSIC side.

......

[Charlie Zureki]

Doug Fowler wrote on Tue, 29 September 2009 11:16

[ Quote: quote title=Quote:] These days we have a kinder/gentler place, but not a better place. It suffers fools too easily. It isn't that we don't have pro members here, but the ratio of them to noise is a LOT higher.

 I suppose the "pro members" that are missing are busy making a living (or dead/retired) or... just not too concerned with debating the merits of one Console over another, etc.... And, since it's the Sound System Provider that purchases Consoles and other high-end gear, maybe, that is all that's left to the caliber of "pro members" you might feel to include.

    What is wrong with the ankle-biters and newbies wanting to learn about Sound gear and the operation of the gear?  Everyone has to start somewhere.... VERY FEW people were born into it. These posters may become the "pro members" of which you refer.



I said for years that sheer numbers would ultimately degrade the S/N to the point where many would choose to not participate.  Reason = way more part-timers than working pros out there, it's just that simple.



  I'm trying to understand your point here... Its very easy to skip over a posted thread if one would feel that it didn't interest or pertain to them or their work.
   
   And, there have always been more part-timers than working pros.

  So what's missing that has driven these "pro members" away? In my estimation, anyone making a living from Sound Reinforcement would be considered a Pro. (Of course that doesn't rate their ability).

 Or, do you have another qualifier that I'm not aware of?      

 

Quote:

I find it very discouraging to see DJ and bottom feeder posts on the CLASSIC side.

......
[/quote]

 While I have an intense dislike for most DJ's...that's a simple fix... just ask the Moderators to move the post.

 Hammer

[Dave Stevens]

Charlie Zureki wrote on Tue, 29 September 2009 11:39

So what's missing that has driven these "pro members" away? In my estimation, anyone making a living from Sound Reinforcement would be considered a Pro. (Of course that doesn't rate their ability).  Or, do you have another qualifier that I'm not aware of?

There was another qualifier.  In those days there was one thing that determined who posted and who didn't.  Me.  And I took cues from those already established in the community.  It was meant to be a semi exclusive club where all could read but only those with whom we felt could make a positive contribution were allowed to post.

As the owners changed from a traditional dot com/technology based management to a trade media management the audience became more inclusive to enable them to target a wider demographic.  I wasn't a fan of doing the LAB Lounge.  I felt (and still feel) that regardless of the size gigs one does or the frequency there is a minimum standard of what I call professionalism and it has nothing to do with getting paid.  Using the pay metric, I'm a professional race car driver.  But I'm not.  I'm a guy with an expensive hobby.  Much like some part time PA operators.

As for my particular case.  Many of the subjects don't interest me.  They lack depth to keep me engaged and it takes a bit of my time and effort and when the environment gets noisy, I don't find it worth my time.  There is quite a bit of noise but that's more a byproduct of what happens when these sorts of communities get larger.  The things that interest me and my peers are different than what a smaller provider or owner/operator might find useful.  I don't wish to be disrespectful to the current owners or posters  but as the community has changed to be more inclusive the content and demeanor has changed as well.

Dave

[Sean McCormack]

I was quite a heavy frequenter in those days, and thoroughly enjoyed being part of that community. I'm still mixing club gigs and have my fair share of big productions rolling through. And most of all still affording a mortgage with a wife and kid. 4-5 nights a week on average, with 6 this week.
While not in a tour bus, this is my living and I do it to the best of my ability within the constraints I'm given.
Good to see you about Dave, and thanks for the memories and advice I've received over the years.

[Doug Fowler]

Charlie -

I have an answer for all of your points, but you might not like it :-)

"You had to be there".

Sorry, but it's true.  It is impossible to explain the heady atmosphere that existed.

best

-doug

[Lee Brenkman]

Doug Fowler wrote on Tue, 29 September 2009 13:16

Charlie - I have an answer for all of your points, but you might not like it "You had to be there". Sorry, but it's true.  It is impossible to explain the heady atmosphere that existed. best -doug

My discovery, back in the 2600k dial up modem days of the old Compuserve forum and Dave's "version 1" of the LAB were truly "good old days".

I was connected to a group of people outside of my geographic area with similar life/work experiences.

And whether discussing audio or beer the civility level WAS higher.

I've never done any other kind of work for any length of time my entire "adult" life.

I still jump in and participate when a topic interests me professionally or recreationally but I do find myself skipping over many threads without reading them at all.

It's still a great visit but there's more repetition and filler here than in the early days.

[Doug Fowler]

Quote:

My discovery, back in the 2600k dial up modem days of the old Compuserve forum and Dave's "version 1" of the LAB were truly "good old days".

I found the CI$ forum as a complete new guy, and the relationships I made there still serve me well today.  It is a fact I would not be where I am today (wherever the hell that is.... :-) without both the CI$ forum, and the LAB of the 1990s.

For anyone wondering, don't think for a minute that each manufacturer in some capacity, and many of the biggest players in the PA business don't read this thing.  Since I don't moderate nowadays I don't hear from people like I used to, but they read, trust me.

Admittedly that is a bit of a U.S.-centric view, but there are plenty of offshore readers as well, as witnessed by the diversity of those posting here.



p.s. what is 2600K dialup?  I remember 56K :-)  I reckon you Bay Area Internet Fashionistas had it better that us hard-scrabble Missouri types.... :-)