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Author Topic: Why S6L?  (Read 12037 times)

Brad Harris

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Re: Why S6L?
« Reply #130 on: December 31, 2022, 03:22:33 PM »

Woooo, Its been busy Andy.... but here we go

Please what are the fundamental flaws with the AVID? I genuinely would like to know what they are for you. I know there are some that have been touched with filling, but there's gotta be something more than that!

Most of my replies are Digico related, as that's the other major player console I see everywhere I go, but still other consoles and DAW follow their logic ... just had to redo a 64+ input (64 Madi stream for broadcast... plus many more on the deck) input gig because their guy couldn't remember that he can't stereo Even-Odd .... (and they made and advanced the input list)

Those providing a 112 engine, either their 192's are busy with the other surfaces, or they cheaped out to get into the game.... With one of my artists, I don't need a 192 engine (did with v6.? and under), and it is a tight fit on a 112... output count (it is easier now with the updates to some internal architecture that was engine dependent, but now is universal), but I DO need 2 DSP cards...... The amount of times after the advance of such items and then showing up to a 24C on a 112 engine is very frustrating.

With layouts, you can recall on a snapshot basis (layout 1 only)... But, if you plan for it, have layouts 2-48 l for what you need during the entire show, and the layout 1 for what you need in that snapshot of 48 faders.

My issue with CL layouts, is someone thought it as great to put a bunch of layouts on 1 bank of faders, and only a few on the others, can't link them so 2 banks change with 1 button press, so it's only 8 faders at a time.....

AVID, where would you like that? over there? cool, want to move it, just drag it around.
[size=78%]One could see it as a pink slip, the rest of us, Convenience.[/size]

Templates.... Well you could do them per band (and for those that I tour with, I have them).. But for the most part, I do them per what I'm doing... FOH/Broadcast/MON... They each are a little different, mainly routing.

There are some things that are specific to the S6L that wouldn't apply to other templates that I have for other desks, such as there are things I have setup in other desks that don't apply to a S6L.. mainly architecture

There are many things that are generic to all my preset files regardless of console.... Things like, is everything turned on in the processing? Do the "racks" need to be "powered on" (looking at original/early M7CL firmware.... grrrrr that's bit me once). Are my gates/comps set to something that I generally use, vs the software designers idea of a great all around setting?

I add stereo processing channels (input and output) when available, and upon getting a version of an input list, I'll double assign 2 mono processing channels with a stereo channel... quite often on the lower market, a stereo keyboard rarely is stereo, or that patches aren't balanced LR (let alone levels).

Output channels the same way.... If can only make 8 stereo outputs (auxes only.. not factoring in changing matrixes to act as auxes), cool, there's my 8 IEM mixes for the festival, and I can route the 8 matrix outputs to my 8 wedge mixes.... Cool, next band wants some downstage wedges... Cool, I'll route one of those stereo mixes to all the wedges downstage via the matrix (say matrix 1-4 for 4 wedges downstage... hmm maybe I want to keep some stereo, I can do odd/even or in/out, etc), easy peasy, no hard patching, no drama, no fuss (now... needing 8 stereo mixes and wedges is a different story...)

Same with FOH... Turn everything on, have the PA come out of the matrix (Stereo Main, Stereo Sub, Fill, Delays, record/programetc). Route L/R everywhere, make a stereo aux for Sub send for those that want it (turn off the L/R feed in the Sub matrix, turn on the send from the stereo aux)... It's mono until you pan something.... repeat with fills and other zones that some engineers would like to run it off an aux than the L/R

I've got files from ProMix01's to S6L, SD-xyz (sigh, and S-nfg), M7/LS9,CL... M32 to ????

If I have a need to see a Midas Pro, SoundCraft, A&H, SSL, and many others... Guess what, I'll have rough working one by the end of load in...

They all evolve, usually, it's just the specific console side of things, interactions on the cue busses, pickoff points, other interactions as one learns the platform and adjusts either oneself, or the hardware to suit.

Avid stock plugins... well, they're loaded with a lot more than other consoles (Digico... hmm, only reverbs???) and in quantity, and you can purchase many if you want something different native, or a waves server that nearly all platforms can get in/out of with a lot more or less complications. As you know, I don't use much for plugins, but there are applications where having more than a choice of a few small or big room reverbs is required...

Current offering is 400 processing slots on the S6L platform.. can't say I've personally used more than 60 on a large arena 23 mix arena tour.... and now with processing updates since that last tour years ago, that number can drop by 23....

[/size]Same modular control surface between all the series!!!!!
ment to say, IN the S6L range...

after converting files in Digico, and each one being different layout wise (1 control strip, what side, how many rows of encoders, where's that dang touch and turn?!?! among other things), or converting between Yamahas.... this one has a high pass encoder, this one does not. Since the M7, Yamaha has mostly gotten scalability control surface wise better than others.

But why did they chose Dante?? Why do they still try to convince everyone that they can gain share like an analog split? grrrrrr.

Digico is closer, but still a wrong turn can screw everyone up..

Avid and Midas has figured out ways to do it that make it really really really really really hard to mess the whole system up.

Picking up the phone/answering emails, I've found quite a few bugs over the years.. mainly all were things on the display (early on, a stereo processing channel would only show the left side dynamics metering.. not accounting for the right side, which could be way off ... see my tidbit on "stereo" patches coming from the stage.... I had a keyboard patch that was light on the left, but awful on the right, I could hear the compression going nuts and squishing it to oblivion, but it wasn't showing it as the right channel was "behaving" properly for the set gain structure.)

But there has been many advances and updates implemented with input, but like many things too, there are lots of input that has been left out of updates too (like things to make it more like the good ole days of monitor consoles... like being able to trim your aux send to your cue bus)

Theres things that I'm sure people don't like on 40-100K systems that others don't find a problem, just like I don't like or understand some decisions on other consoles as well.

Merry Christmas and see you in the New Year!


I know you're just giving it back to me, but really, because it's just a faster system.
I think a really interesting video would be one where 2 or more experts are in a room (or online together) and given their console of choice, zeroed, and then given random configuration changes that they each need to do and see who can do it the quickest. Just for fun.

Hard to max out any console that's at this level, but I understand if you were going to buy a console that can do "everything", you'd take into account it's max input/output capacity. Usually, though, I see the S6L with the 112 engine and the smaller surface.
Which console does that? Not Yamaha. I agree, that's pretty stupid.
Go on... Not sure what you mean there.
I suppose you're speaking of DiGiCo here? What about having to pay for plugins on the Avid?
Huh? I suppose the S6L, but what about the S3? Rivage is like that, but A&H actually does that better than anyone...
Sounds again like a DiGiCo issue. Yamaha, A&H handle this better than anyone.
Not a fan. Too easy to make a mistake IMHO, but I do understand that this is a personal preference.
Not sure what you mean here. Can you change the customer layers layout on snapshot recall on the S6L? Yamaha can.


Except that they can't implement the really important changes due the way the product is designed.

Service is critical. I had a PM5D go down on a show a bunch of years back. Called Yamaha, they aired me the part, step-by-step pictures of how to disassemble and replace the part, and even the TOOL
s needed to get the console apart and some spare screws. Never seen service like that from anyone and I've never forgotten.

Andrew Broughton

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Re: Why S6L?
« Reply #131 on: January 01, 2023, 08:05:38 PM »

Happy New Year, Brad!

Not sure how you wrote your reply or if you were imbibing at the time (fair play if you were), but it seems like you may have been replying to specific things I said but forgot to quote me? I'm not having much luck following it. Maybe have a peek and see if it could use some editing so I can formulate a rational reply to (for me) an interesting discussion!

"Well, my days of not taking you seriously are certainly coming to a middle..."
Saving lives through Digital Audio, Programming and Electronics.

Bharat Bajaj

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Re: Why S6L?
« Reply #132 on: January 20, 2023, 03:55:49 PM »

Hello Sir, Iíve S6L for about 4 years now. Iam very happy with the console due to its simpler interface of finding busses , matrix , patch bay, inserts. And the quality is what it is. Then the avp card helps to connect 2 s6l for foh and monitors. Iam happy at this only. Coming from sc48 to this was a very easy transition for me. But now that Digico is rocking the market, and Iíve operated it a few times with waves server. Few points Iíll share, more space on board , bigger faders , channel strips are bigger.

But in the end it all comes down to what you are comfortable with. Itís just different layout. Sound quality wise I will not like to comment ,but s6l is a top notch board .
Bharat Bajaj

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Why S6L?
¬ę Reply #132 on: January 20, 2023, 03:55:49 PM ¬Ľ

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