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Author Topic: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)  (Read 2733 times)

Roland Clarke

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Re: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)
« Reply #10 on: November 22, 2018, 02:33:23 pm »

Interesting comments above.  Im not going to say where I stand on this debate, but I would recommend anyone who has the facilities, time and inclination to try xy, vs ms, vs slightly spaced, vs wide spaced, vs Glynn Johns technique.  The results are surprising and quite possibly not what you would expect.  Enough said! 😉
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Luke Geis

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Re: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)
« Reply #11 on: November 22, 2018, 03:37:43 pm »

Lately, I have been going with the Glynn John's technique. I used to do XY and widely spaced and found that I need so little overheads anyway that I the middle ground between those two was more preferred. When I had them in XY I got a nice " drum mix ", but too little separation ( width ) for live use. With wide spacing, I got too much cymbals and stage wash, plus one side always had a crap ton of snare while the other side didn't. The Glynn Johns approach is perfect for me. It keeps the kick and snare pretty much up the middle the drum mix as a whole is good and the hi-hat sets to one side a little as I like it. The stereo width is enough and the energy in each mic is fairly equal.

I am using AKG C214's these days for overheads and a Miketek PM5D set for kick toms and snare that has me pretty well tuned in. The PM11's stated frequency response is actually pretty broad and flat despite the deep clicky sound it acquires. I get the feeling that the Audix D6 which sounds close to the PM11 is also relatively flat, but something about them lends to a more tailored sound when on the kick. Perhaps being supercardioid has something to do with it? For me its all about the attack and click. Getting the boom isn't a problem, but without any attack making the kick work is very hard. The PM11 and D6 have plenty of click and getting it out is easy enough if I need a more jazz or 70's rock type sound.
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Patrick Tracy

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Re: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2018, 03:26:08 am »

You can't possibly time align OH to close mics without changing the proximity distance relationships to adjacent mics at the same time.

That's why I place the close mics to reject the adjacent drums using 3:1 rule of thumb and polar pattern.

Jay Barracato

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Re: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)
« Reply #13 on: November 27, 2018, 07:36:14 am »

It's an interesting article for sure.
I do have one (slight) gripe, though. Talking of removing EQ from the chain, and then using an Audix D6, which is one of the most inherently-EQ'd mics I've come across.

I recognise the speaker he used for a subkick and it's certainly an interesting choice - a Tang Band W6-1139SI, which is a 6.5" mini-subwoofer. Long voice coil, lots of linear excursion. I wonder what the reasoning behind that choice was...

Chris
Interesting comments above.  Im not going to say where I stand on this debate, but I would recommend anyone who has the facilities, time and inclination to try xy, vs ms, vs slightly spaced, vs wide spaced, vs Glynn Johns technique.  The results are surprising and quite possibly not what you would expect.  Enough said!
I think stereo in the live setting is simply a way to ensure no two listening positions have the same mix. And a drum kit is essentially a mono source acoustically from any listening positions other than the drum throne.

That is not to mean that stereo drums have no place in modern music but it is an artificial effect, so in my mind, not an every song every set mix setting.

With that said, in any setting with a hard back wall, I am happy with close mics on the ride and hats. If I don't have a back wall, I prefer a single overhead.

After all,  after carefully balancing the position of the overheads to the kick and snare, you are probably going to set it's level according to the ear shattering China saturating everything.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

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Jay Barracato

Patrick Tracy

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Re: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2018, 02:49:44 pm »

I think stereo in the live setting is simply a way to ensure no two listening positions have the same mix.

There's no rule that says you have to pan them in the house (though I often do) and coincident mics are mono compatible. In many of the small narrow venues I've mixed there's no listening position that doesn't get some stereo effect from the PA. In those spaces I'm angling the speakers in a bit to keep the sound off the walls, so you can generally hear the far speaker just fine. Of course in those small rooms I might just have the drums off in the house, but I like to mic them to have the option, or to add reverb.

I frequently record live so I like some amount of stereo image, whether it's realistic or not.

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Re: XY coincidental pair (of overhead drum mics)
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2018, 02:49:44 pm »


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