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[Alan Bonk]

First off it wouldn't let me post this the first time so if this double posts I am very sorry and will delete it. 

I'll start off with our current set up.  Right now for FOH we have a pair of old peavey sp2's (300w RMS/600w Program). We had an outdoor show where we mic'd the drums and we blew 2 of the woofers. I'm assuming it was just not enough PA for the job. I want to add subs to take some pressure off of the woofers (I have a Yamaha 01v and I plan on running the subs off of an aux with just kick and bass guitar with HPF at 40-50 and LPF somwhere between 80 and 150.)
Is this a viable way of adding subs w/o a crossover?

So basically I can get a sp218 (newest model) used for 425.  The other option is a pair of Peavey Low Rider drivers in custom cabinets for 400.  The cabinets look really nice actually.  They are all plywood with a nice grille that covers the front of them. 

My dad likes the idea of 2 single 18's better than a double 18 for hauling purposes - I tend to think it's the opposite. 

I'm thinking either these custom cabinets are a really good deal or a really bad one. 

Any advice will be greatly appreciated

[Stu McDoniel]

First off it wouldn't let me post this the first time so if this double posts I am very sorry and will delete it. 

I'll start off with our current set up.  Right now for FOH we have a pair of old peavey sp2's (300w RMS/600w Program). We had an outdoor show where we mic'd the drums and we blew 2 of the woofers. I'm assuming it was just not enough PA for the job. I want to add subs to take some pressure off of the woofers (I have a Yamaha 01v and I plan on running the subs off of an aux with just kick and bass guitar with HPF at 40-50 and LPF somwhere between 80 and 150.)
Is this a viable way of adding subs w/o a crossover?

So basically I can get a sp218 (newest model) used for 425.  The other option is a pair of Peavey Low Rider drivers in custom cabinets for 400.  The cabinets look really nice actually.  They are all plywood with a nice grille that covers the front of them. 

My dad likes the idea of 2 single 18's better than a double 18 for hauling purposes - I tend to think it's the opposite. 

I'm thinking either these custom cabinets are a really good deal or a really bad one. 

Any advice will be greatly appreciated

When you say custom you mean they were made by someone right? Do you know for sure the cabs are made to fit the Thiele Small Parameters of the 18" loudspeakers then I would definitely go with the factory dual 18".  I personally would stay away from custom cabs (homemade) for many reasons.  I am not saying custom cabs are not great here but if they are not right then you have boat anchors.
  A dual factory 18" would work well anyways considering your bass
will be coming from a point source.  It looks like that dual 18" takes 1200RMS. Recommend a power amp 1800watts-2400watts to drive it.   
But, here is the caveat with that Peavey dual 18" cab. The spec shows 3db down @ 51hz and that seems a bit high to me.
There is no way to tell what the the specs are for your custom cabs.
As an example the Yamaha SW218V is 3db down at 30hz and that is a big difference.
You would actually have to test the 18"s in the custom cabs to know what specs you are looking
at with that cab/speaker combo.    I looked up a single Peavey 18" sub cab loaded with the lowrider and it looks like 800watts rms and the it is 3db down at 47hz.

The single JBL SRX718S 18" sub is 3db down at 34hz.

Actually for a couple hundred bucks more you can get a new Yamaha SW218V dual 18" cab
and it will give you better low end.

Its all your call Alan.

[Alan Bonk]

Those Yamaha's do look nice.  The one thing I notice is that those are particle board cabinet whereas the sp218's are plywood.  Is that much of a difference? Also the peavey's are a little more sensitive (100db at 1w/1m vs 98 on the yamaha's) and have double the power handling.  Is that enough to outweigh the higher frequency cutoff?

Also I'm also wondering about placement if I get 1 double 18 sub?  should i just put it in the center in front of the band?

[Stu McDoniel]

Those Yamaha's do look nice.  The one thing I notice is that those are particle board cabinet whereas the sp218's are plywood.  Is that much of a difference? Also the peavey's are a little more sensitive (100db at 1w/1m vs 98 on the yamaha's) and have double the power handling.  Is that enough to outweigh the higher frequency cutoff?

Also I'm also wondering about placement if I get 1 double 18 sub?  should i just put it in the center in front of the band?

Hey Dave Rat has a great video on youtube on sub placement that might be useful for you.
If possible yes in front of the band center if you are up on stage.

Everything is a tradeoff here for the money you have to spend.

I personally would not purchase a sub that is 3db down at 56 hz.

You can shop online and look at your options.   There is a guy on Ebay selling a single  JBL 4719
in the 600 dollar range.   

[Bill Hornibrook]

Certainly the safest thing to do would be to go with the factory cab. You know that the drivers will be properly aligned in it.

The home builds - who knows? If you know who built them, ask a few questions. Peavey puts up box suggestions for their drivers - did they use one of them?

When you're young the prospect of hauling really large heavy objects around isn't something that concerns you at all.  Maybe that's why you think differently than your dad when it comes to which cabs would be easier to move.

And differently than most of us for that matter.

FWIW there was a local band that used one of those Peavey double 18 boxes for years. They'd set it right in front of the stage on the dance floor and it gave them plenty of thump in the clubs I heard them in (smallish).

[Paul G. OBrien]

So basically I can get a sp218 (newest model) used for 425.  The other option is a pair of Peavey Low Rider drivers in custom cabinets for 400. 

The PV LowRider is a far better driver than what's in either of the other cabs so if the cabs are well built and built to spec for those drivers the Lowrider cabs are the way to go.

[David Morison]

But, here is the caveat with that Peavey dual 18" cab. The spec shows 3db down @ 51hz and that seems a bit high to me.
There is no way to tell what the the specs are for your custom cabs.
As an example the Yamaha SW218V is 3db down at 30hz and that is a big difference

Could you reference a source for that please?
This says that 30Hz is the -10dB point, not -3. That is a big difference.
Can't check myself at the moment (Net security @ day gig getting in the way) but last time I looked at the actual response graph in the manual, it started rolling off much higher, not far from where the Peavey does IIRC.

Edit - added reference to manual.

[Stu McDoniel]

Could you reference a source for that please?
This says that 30Hz is the -10dB point, not -3. That is a big difference.
Can't check myself at the moment (Net security @ day gig getting in the way) but last time I looked at the actual response graph in the manual, it started rolling off much higher, not far from where the Peavey does IIRC.

Edit - added reference to manual.

The site I looked at did not have the (-10db) attached to the spec.  I did notice some
sites have that attached to the bandwidth and some do not.   Indeed -10db is huge!

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/309202-REG/Yamaha_SW218V_SW218V_Dual_18.html

In any case I was trying to let the OP know that 56hz is a big deal and I think he hopefully
gets the idea that a sub rated at 30hz (-3db) is more of a true sub.

[Paul G. OBrien]

The Yamaha club series are good value and they tend to perform above thier price point but they are very much an entry level product and in this case the cabs are MDF and the drivers are inexpensive stamped steel units. The PV SP series are better built but the BlackWidow drivers they contain are an old design that really aren't subwoofers by todays standards, they have a cast frame with a powerful motor but that's wasted since they don't have sufficient excursion capability to handle anywhere near rated power at low frequencies. In comparison the LowRider will take every bit of it's 800w rating in an appropriate reflex enclosure... which would include a 7.5cuft box tuned to 35hz. 

[chuck clark]

 I want to add subs to take some pressure off of the woofers (I have a Yamaha 01v and I plan on running the subs off of an aux with just kick and bass guitar with HPF at 40-50 and LPF somwhere between 80 and 150.)
Is this a viable way of adding subs w/o a crossover?

A: Yes! Looks like you have this much pretty well sorted out.
Now, this next part is easy. -Get those subs in the same room and LISTEN to them. Then you can use the spec. sheet for toilet paper.

My experience: Owned a pair of Yamaha SW Club IVs for about a year. Could never get quite the punch out of them I wanted. Had to pee once while the band was playing a long set. As I walked by the stack I happened to lean my hand on the speaker and was shocked at how much the sides of the boxes were vibrating during use. Lots of energy being lost through the sides of those boxes. Sold them soon after.
Thinking waaay back now when I owned a Pile'O'Peavey sound system. Black widow's just didn't have enough excursion to "Git 'R' done".  Fast forward to Christmas, 2011. I get a call from an Old school DJ who just bought 4 brand new Peavey SP series double 18's and wants me to come hear 'em. I'm like, OK, whatever.  Holy crap, I don't know what's going on at Peavey, they're building 'em in China now I guess cause the local Dj's keep blowing them and bringing them to me to re-basket, but boy, let me tell you the building was quaking and shaking! He was getting some serious thunder. I haven't even looked at buying Peavey in so long that I was shocked at how good it sounded. So I have a new respect for the new SP series Peavey. A pair of solid Low Riders in a fresh SP box will surprise you! Good luck.   
Chuck

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