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Title: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 24, 2019, 10:23:46 am
So frustrating.
So these days when I post an item for sale on Craigslist, I have to add in footnotes, NO SCAMMERS, NO TROLLS and NO LOW BALLERS. It has become the new norm for me because of all the low lives out there who either want to scam me, or who have far too much time on their hands to pick apart my ad with insults and THEN lowball me!!
There is one guy - and I am convinced it is the same one each time - who spends his time picking apart local ads and accusing the poster of lying about the item, overcharging, trying to mislead etc. He then sometimes even places his own ad referencing these ads berating the poster. He has tried this with me and I have ignored him.

Also....when it comes to lowballing -I have an ad on there right now for my 2 DXR10's with padded carry bags and whenever I advertise anything I look at recent eBay sales and start somewhere in between the lowest to highest sale price. I realize I will be made offers so this way there is some wiggle room and it is fair to the seller and buyer. Also I am saving any selling fees so I can afford to go lower.
However, it seems that the 'NO LOW BALLERS' part of the ad is irrelevant - I have had 2 stupid offers so far.
This time I even put 'LOW BALLERS WILL NOT BE RESPONDED TO' - so I won't be replying.
This happens all the time though.

Until the last couple of years, buying and selling on CL was a good option. I had really good luck selling at fair prices and was able to find stuff well priced also. Nowadays, I struggle to sell anything unless I want to literally give the stuff away yet when I look to buy, everything is way overpriced and unrealistic.....

....rant over.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Keith Broughton on January 24, 2019, 10:56:04 am
I have the same BS with Kijiji when selling motorcycles.
I don't bother responding to the a$$ hats.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Dave Garoutte on January 24, 2019, 12:37:50 pm
It just seems like all good ideas/ resources devolve into an opportunity for people to be jerks nowadays.
That's why this is my favorite forum.
All hail the troll police! ::)
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 24, 2019, 01:55:34 pm
It just seems like all good ideas/ resources devolve into an opportunity for people to be jerks nowadays.
That's why this is my favorite forum.
All hail the troll police! ::)

You know Dave - it seems everyone is so angry all the time and wants to attack other people. I see this a lot on FB too.  I agree with you about this forum - I feel it is the only place I can ask questions or make comments where someone isn't going to outright attack me.
Thanks PSW peeps for being good guys!!!
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Tim McCulloch on January 24, 2019, 02:54:47 pm
You know Dave - it seems everyone is so angry all the time and wants to attack other people. I see this a lot on FB too.  I agree with you about this forum - I feel it is the only place I can ask questions or make comments where someone isn't going to outright attack me.
Thanks PSW peeps for being good guys!!!

I think you've seen us "not to suffer fools politely" although it's pretty tame by Angry Internet standards.

One thing is certain, you're no fool.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Jeff Lelko on January 24, 2019, 03:20:42 pm
It has become the new norm for me because of all the low lives out there who either want to scam me, or who have far too much time on their hands to pick apart my ad with insults and THEN lowball reject me!!

Sounds like the story of my life for online dating... 

Have you tried Reverb?  You pay a lower percentage there compared to ebay, and so far I've had a good experience with the folks I've done business with.  There's also OfferUp, though so far I've only dealt with flakes - both as a buyer and as a seller.  As much as I hate the higher fees that ebay charges, they still seem to be the best way to reach the most people, especially if you want something sold quickly. 
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 24, 2019, 03:49:12 pm
Sounds like the story of my life for online dating... 

Have you tried Reverb?  You pay a lower percentage there compared to ebay, and so far I've had a good experience with the folks I've done business with.  There's also OfferUp, though so far I've only dealt with flakes - both as a buyer and as a seller.  As much as I hate the higher fees that ebay charges, they still seem to be the best way to reach the most people, especially if you want something sold quickly.

Funny !

I have used Reverb to buy and it was always a good experience.I have used eBay to buy too and that has also been very positive (for the most part).
Maybe I'll bite the bullet and use one of those instead. I am trying to thin the herd a bit selling things that don't get used much so  there will be more before I am done.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 24, 2019, 03:50:24 pm
I think you've seen us "not to suffer fools politely" although it's pretty tame by Angry Internet standards.

One thing is certain, you're no fool.

Thanks Tim  - oh I know you guys can get quite feisty when pushed but really you are all great people and go above and beyond to help others. I feel very fortunate.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Tom Roche on January 24, 2019, 04:07:40 pm
If you use Fakebook, you might consider joining a local music gear and/or pro audio swap/for sale group.  I belong to two in my area and both are moderated fairly well.  If someone acts like a flake, the work gets out quickly to the others in the group(s).
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: frank kayser on January 24, 2019, 05:21:29 pm
I say, give 'em something to complain about (Sorry Ms. Raitt, Something to talk about)
Say yes to all low ball bids.  Set the same time and place for them all to "meet you" and then stand them all up.  Tell them to all wear a carnation so you'll be able to recognize them  "You'll" have one, too! (tee hee)
They'd have plenty to talk about.  ;D


Use the anonymity of CL to your advantage.  I have NO CONSCIENCE!


frank
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 24, 2019, 06:27:47 pm
I say, give 'em something to complain about (Sorry Ms. Raitt, Something to talk about)
Say yes to all low ball bids.  Set the same time and place for them all to "meet you" and then stand them all up.  Tell them to all wear a carnation so you'll be able to recognize them  "You'll" have one, too! (tee hee)
They'd have plenty to talk about.  ;D


Use the anonymity of CL to your advantage.  I have NO CONSCIENCE!


frank

OMG - Frank that is too funny !!!.... mmm...
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Ed Hall on January 24, 2019, 06:37:03 pm
Why not list the gear in the Marketplace here? You’ll be in front of an audience that is interested in pro audio gear, knows what a fair price is and is somewhat prescreened.

I recently bought 4 Growlers in the Marketplace for a fair price. (They kick a** for their size BTW) Drive from Philly to Maine to pick them up from a Labster. Overall a great experience.

What do you have? Central NC isn’t so far.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 24, 2019, 06:45:16 pm
Why not list the gear in the Marketplace here? You’ll be in front of an audience that is interested in pro audio gear, knows what a fair price is and is somewhat prescreened.

I recently bought 4 Growlers in the Marketplace for a fair price. (They kick a** for their size BTW) Drive from Philly to Maine to pick them up from a Labster. Overall a great experience.

What do you have? Central NC isn’t so far.

I could do that but the stuff I am selling might not be of interest to the folks here. ...Pair of DXR10's, a couple of compressors, crossover, bass guitar, pedal and micro bass head.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Rob Spence on January 24, 2019, 07:42:12 pm
I could do that but the stuff I am selling might not be of interest to the folks here. ...Pair of DXR10's, a couple of compressors, crossover, bass guitar, pedal and micro bass head.

So post em. Doesn’t cost much

You never know what people are looking for.



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Richard Turner on January 24, 2019, 09:59:02 pm
Stop feeding the trolls. THeyre just looking for somewhere to put their self loathing out into the world. FB marketplace and musician groups will work for items under $1000.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Bob Faulkner on January 25, 2019, 10:20:01 am
Here's what I do on Craigslist...

I write the ad and post pictures.  At the bottom of the ad (like most of you), I put the usual comments, "local pickup only", etc... etc... though, will usually include "Serious inquires only" - this entry (believe it not) reduced a lot of trolling. 

However, I add another line at the bottom that references something like this, "Attn: Scammers  - please respond to this ad with your contact information (email and/or phone) so that it may be uploaded to the national scammers database".

After having added that line, I rarely ever get any responses to things I have posted.  Because no one responds, I haven't posted in several months.  Most of the stuff I have now (no matter how good or functional it is) goes to local recycling centers.  I have a working 42" LCD flat screen TV (TV tuner doesn't work, but everything else does) that I'll be dropping off for recycling very soon.  Anyone around Raleigh want a free TV?


Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: John Halliburton on January 25, 2019, 10:22:15 am
Stop feeding the trolls. THeyre just looking for somewhere to put their self loathing out into the world. FB marketplace and musician groups will work for items under $1000.


And it happens in retail in person as well.  I just chaulk it up to the hazards of sales.  But as the son of a son of a saleman, maybe I'm just used to it.(apologies to Mr. Buffett).


Craigslist has a block feature for ads you don't want to see.  Always use the annonymous email feature there too.

That said, I've had better responses lately on FB Marketplace.

Best regards,

John

Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Scott Olewiler on January 25, 2019, 11:18:28 am
Alway try the marketplace here. I just had a fellow Forum member drive up to PA from New Orleans to buy my Yorkvilles U15ps.


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Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Nathan Riddle on January 25, 2019, 11:37:00 am
Throw in FB marketplace too.

"Where is the item located?" [Stated in the listing]
"How much?" [stated in the listing]
"Where is the item located?" [gives zip code] "where is that?" [?]
"Does the item work?" [stated in listing]


Gah, do people not read?
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 25, 2019, 11:52:52 am
Throw in FB marketplace too.

"Where is the item located?" [Stated in the listing]
"How much?" [stated in the listing]
"Where is the item located?" [gives zip code] "where is that?" [?]
"Does the item work?" [stated in listing]


Gah, do people not read?

Oh I get people asking the price when it is written in the title PLUS again in the body of the ad. Sometimes I want to be so sarcastic in my response to some of these people but there is always the risk that this is the one that will come through and make the purchase...
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Lyle Williams on January 25, 2019, 02:27:36 pm
People do ask too much for stuff.  If the item isn't rare (ie,equivalent is available via retail) then about 1/3rd of list price is what it is worth if in good condition.



Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Jonathan Johnson on January 25, 2019, 02:45:16 pm
A sure way to get me to ignore a Craigslist ad is to not list an accurate price. If you put $1 in the title for something and put the real price in the ad, I still won't bite.

Or when you're looking at cars, and for the mileage listing, they are too lazy to put in three more zeroes. (A 1996 Ford Ranger with only 462 miles? Really?) That makes it impossible to accurately search by mileage. And I'll bet more than a few people are confused by the "fwd" option -- is that front wheel drive? four wheel drive? has forward gears?

Also when they put L@@K in the title. I hate that. I WILL skip over that ad.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Bob Faulkner on January 25, 2019, 02:46:11 pm
Alway try the marketplace here. I just had a fellow Forum member drive up to PA from New Orleans to buy my Yorkvilles U15ps.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
This is the first place I post, and buy from... before hitting the CL game.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 25, 2019, 03:06:52 pm
People do ask too much for stuff.  If the item isn't rare (ie,equivalent is available via retail) then about 1/3rd of list price is what it is worth if in good condition.

I don't agree. If something is in good condition, I am happy to pay up to around 50% of new - depending on what it is - maybe  bit more. That is usually my cut off. In the past this has worked for me as  the seller too.
I find on CL I have no choice but to ask more than I want to allow for offers which is a given these days.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 25, 2019, 03:09:43 pm
A sure way to get me to ignore a Craigslist ad is to not list an accurate price. If you put $1 in the title for something and put the real price in the ad, I still won't bite.

Or when you're looking at cars, and for the mileage listing, they are too lazy to put in three more zeroes. (A 1996 Ford Ranger with only 462 miles? Really?) That makes it impossible to accurately search by mileage. And I'll bet more than a few people are confused by the "fwd" option -- is that front wheel drive? four wheel drive? has forward gears?

Also when they put L@@K in the title. I hate that. I WILL skip over that ad.

I always put the price on the title unless I am listing more than one item. CL will not allow you to post without filling in the field so it is tough to know what to put in there. I have tried the lowest priced item and had kick back because it is considered misleading, I have tried the highest priced item and then I get no calls because folks assume that price is for one of the less expensive items and I have tried the $1 thing which seems to be the norm for a multiple listing.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Lyle Williams on January 26, 2019, 01:09:46 am
Maybe 50% of street price.  But street is lower than list.

If I buy from a real store I know it is a real product with original parts and it has a warranty.

I also get to choose from a wider range of products (and purchase times) than when buying used.

I have a heap of gear I have bought used.  But used has significant downsides to me too.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 26, 2019, 08:30:34 am
Maybe 50% of street price.  But street is lower than list.

If I buy from a real store I know it is a real product with original parts and it has a warranty.

I also get to choose from a wider range of products (and purchase times) than when buying used.

I have a heap of gear I have bought used.  But used has significant downsides to me too.

True - I never even consider list because it is rarely what anyone pays.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Steve Litscher on January 26, 2019, 08:53:02 am
To help manage scammers and the folks who hap-hazardly click "reply" to an ad without really being too seriously interested, I always include the following criteria (posted in bold text) in my Craigslist ads (the text below is taken directly from one of my previous ads):

1) Local sale only, cash only, no deals/offers/financing/trades/etc. Price is FIRM - I have priced this fairly, and if you're serious about the item, you'll realize the price is reasonable.

2) If you are interested in the item, you MUST change the subject line of your e-mail to me so that it reads, "I like sushi and your RCF speakers" - if you don't change the subject line, you haven't read this ad completely, or you're a scammer/bot and I won't reply to you.

3) If the ad is online, the item is available. I will remove the ad as soon as the item sells.

4) Please re-read and follow steps 1-3 before contacting me.



You'd be amazed at how many serious buyers skip line #2... I'll receive an e-mail with the default Craigslist subject line that reads, "Hey, I'm interested in your stuff. Where in Madison are you?"

I won't reply.

A day later, I'll get another e-mail, "Hi, I'm trying to reach you about your stuff. Call me at (number) or e-mail me back." (Subject line still default Craigslist subject)

A few hours later, I'll get another e-mail with the correct subject line... and then we'll talk.

Doing this helps cut-down on scammers, and if it IS a bot, they usually only spam you once. I may have lost a sale here or there because of the "rule" but I've also eliminated a ton of headaches.

...all of this said... I've had the best luck here on PSW. I've bought and sold stuff from dozens of people and every experience has been fantastic. Craiglist (especially in our area) is really hit-or-miss. FB is slightly better than Craigslist, but not by much. Your results may vary, of course. :-)
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Keith Broughton on January 26, 2019, 03:54:09 pm
Another annoyance is when someone asks your location (in Kijiji) and the “map” clickable is clearly visable.
As for the 1/3 list price, I find that is a rather arbitrary calculation.

One time I was so annoyed with the low ball offer for an item I was selling , I told the person that I would hand deliver the item and pay THEM the asking price😄
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Lyle Williams on January 26, 2019, 11:59:26 pm
1/3rd is arbitary.  But it factors in some of the risks in buying a used item.

There is always a reason why the item is being sold.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Stephen Kirby on January 27, 2019, 12:30:59 am
I wonder what it would cost to ship those DXRs across the country.  I'd like a pair.

There's a crazy entitlement thing that people feel emboldened to submit crazy lowballs.  I put a car up on FaceBook marketplace and got the most ridiculous offers.  I asked someone what made them think of event bothering with such an offer and got the "If you don't ask you'll never know" response.  Frustrating beyond belief.  The problem there is they have access to your public profile and information.  I'll never use that again without some burner account.

I actually want to get out of this madness and the accumulation in the garage but there's no viable way to get rid of it all.  There used to be an independent local shop that took in consignments but now they only take in high end guitars and amps >$2k.
Title: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Scott Olewiler on January 27, 2019, 10:43:28 am
I wonder what it would cost to ship those DXRs across the country.  I'd like a pair.

There's a crazy entitlement thing that people feel emboldened to submit crazy lowballs.  I put a car up on FaceBook marketplace and got the most ridiculous offers.  I asked someone what made them think of event bothering with such an offer and got the "If you don't ask you'll never know" response.  Frustrating beyond belief.  The problem there is they have access to your public profile and information.  I'll never use that again without some burner account.

I actually want to get out of this madness and the accumulation in the garage but there's no viable way to get rid of it all.  There used to be an independent local shop that took in consignments but now they only take in high end guitars and amps >$2k.

I posted in similar thread a while back that people take the position  that if you don't come down in price they are somehow being ripped off no matter how reasonable the price is.  "Entitlement" is a good description.   

And it has gone way beyond good faith negotiating IMO. People are actually trying to rip you off and they feel good about it.

I have found that if I ask more than I want I usually end up getting what I really want offered to me.  The buyer can feel free then to brag to his friends how he low balled me.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Lyle Williams on January 27, 2019, 03:06:12 pm
Say you want to sell something and you advertise it for $200.  The (undisclosed) minimum you will accept is $120.

A buyer is interested, but the (undisclosed) maximum they are willing to pay is $150.

So a dance starts where seller and buyer probe each others pricing to try and find if there is a deal to be made.

As neither party has full information there will be several interactions to find a price.  If the buyer (but not the seller) had full information the price would be $120.  If the seller (but not the buyer) had full information the price would be $150. 

Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Jonathan Johnson on January 27, 2019, 06:52:11 pm

I posted in similar thread a while back that people take the position  that if you don't come down in price they are somehow being ripped off no matter how reasonable the price is.  "Entitlement" is a good description.   

And it has gone way beyond good faith negotiating IMO. People are actually trying to rip you off and they feel good about it.

I have found that if I ask more than I want I usually end up getting what I really want offered to me.  The buyer can feel free then to brag to his friends how he low balled me.

A lot of people seem to think that if you're happy, they must have gotten screwed. They can't understand that both parties can benefit from a transaction.

Economics is not a zero-sum game.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Debbie Dunkley on January 27, 2019, 07:41:45 pm
When I lived in the UK, people didn't really make offers - at least it wasn't an expectation at that time. When I moved to CA, I got quite a shock as EVERYONE made offers on EVERYTHING.
However, if I saw something used for sale that I wanted and it appeared to be fairly priced, I would hand over the asking price without question - that was the way I was used to doing things. On a few occasions I have had the seller give me the weirdest look obviously confused as to why I didn't make an offer. After a few years I realized making an offer was an expectation and I fell in with everyone else. There have still been a few occasions when I had not made an offer and have handed over the asking price IF the item was worth it (to me).
Of course I realize that if I find that something isn't as described, making an offer lower than asking makes sense. Also if something is slightly beyond my budget, I might make an offer in case the seller is willing to let me have the item for a bit less than asking.  I just don't understand why EVERYONE has to make an offer on EVERYTHING.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Lyle Williams on January 27, 2019, 11:03:10 pm
Flag the price as being firm in the ad.  If you are still trying to sell it a month later, don't be offended if people make offers.
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: drew gandy on January 28, 2019, 12:04:06 am
Another annoyance is when someone asks your location (in Kijiji) and the “map” clickable is clearly visable.


I don't know about Kijiji (I for some reason thought that it went away a couple years ago) but I wonder about folks who are viewing the ads, on whatever service we're using, on their phone.  Such a tiny screen and, well, our lives are all so fast paced, it's no wonder they might ask what appear to be dumb questions to us grown-ups still using "computers" with full size monitors etc. 

A friend of mine recently posted a couple things for me on offer-up.  He got so many responses so quickly that I decided to give it a try for some other things.  Mobile devices only.  So I installed the app only to find that getting the photos [that I've already taken] into their app was a huge pain.  So I gave up on it. 

Honestly, if the service is only on mobile I assume it's for children or those that suffer from ADD.   :-\ 
I'm sorry; all due respect to the participants here who are children with ADD...
Title: Re: I hate using Craigslist these days....
Post by: Matt Greiner on February 17, 2019, 02:32:18 am
1/3rd is arbitary.  But it factors in some of the risks in buying a used item.

There is always a reason why the item is being sold.

Yes there is always a reason, some honest, some not so honest.  Upgrading to better gear, getting out of the business.  Now, on the darker side, the piece of gear may have been abused, not always fully functional, etc. 

It can be hard to wade through all these possibilities, especially from afar.

I always put the price on the title unless I am listing more than one item. CL will not allow you to post without filling in the field so it is tough to know what to put in there. I have tried the lowest priced item and had kick back because it is considered misleading, I have tried the highest priced item and then I get no calls because folks assume that price is for one of the less expensive items and I have tried the $1 thing which seems to be the norm for a multiple listing.

Debbie, I have the same thoughts when listing multiple items as well.  And depending on how many different items you are selling, it can take a while.  And for the small $$ stuff <$150, it's almost not worth the time unless you do one big post.