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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => LAB Subwoofer Forum => Topic started by: Tracy Garner on July 16, 2013, 09:29:38 am

Title: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Tracy Garner on July 16, 2013, 09:29:38 am
I saw a few pictures of the Powersoft 30" Woofer at Baltimore Caribbean Festival. Does anyone have any insight on these worth sharing?
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Marjan Milosevic on July 16, 2013, 10:39:03 am
Care to share the picture?
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Tracy Garner on July 16, 2013, 06:57:07 pm
Care to share the picture?

I never tried to upload a pic. Let me know if it doesn't show up.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Marjan Milosevic on July 17, 2013, 09:35:38 pm
How do you know whats behind the grill? I am am not aware of any products made with that 30 inch driver. Not sure you can even buy one.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Tim Perry on July 17, 2013, 10:39:17 pm
How do you know whats behind the grill? I am am not aware of any products made with that 30 inch driver. Not sure you can even buy one.

This might be a clue:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yt8NLFsBWxw

I doubt ill be in line to get one... but you never know
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Mac Kerr on July 17, 2013, 10:49:12 pm
This might be a clue:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yt8NLFsBWxw

I doubt ill be in line to get one... but you never know

It's true that Powersoft was showing a drive system attached to a prototype 30" driver at InfoComm, but AFAIK no one has announced a product based on it, I don't think PowerSoft is even selling the components yet.

It seems unlikely to see this technology of a festival truck system.

There have been other 30" woofers in the past, as well as other large drivers.

Mac
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Jeff Bankston on July 18, 2013, 06:38:19 am
back in the early 70's EV had a 30" woofer.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Ivan Beaver on July 18, 2013, 07:44:58 am
back in the early 70's EV had a 30" woofer.
I would love to get my hands on one of those.  I remember seeing my first one in a HI-FI (Remember those?) shop window back in the mid 70's.  WOW it was cool looking.

There ahve been various 22-24-26" drivers over the years.  But none have really "stood the test of time".

One of the problems is replacement parts-if you can get them-they are EXPENSIVE.

More common drivers are much more easily fixed when the time comes-and remember that a loudspeaker is a MECHANICAL device-so it WILL wear out-just a matter of time-so that needs to be part of the "overall plan/ cost" to fix/replace them at some point.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Tim McCulloch on July 18, 2013, 12:59:24 pm
back in the early 70's EV had a 30" woofer.

EV had plans for a cabinet for it on their website about 12 years ago, IIRC it was call "Patrician" and one of the notes was "if you build this, make sure you can move it."  It was bigger than a refrigerator and weighed over 500#.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Jeff Bankston on July 18, 2013, 02:30:23 pm
the big 30" ! bigger than Steven Tylers big 10" ! bigger than Superman's model locomotive !
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Nikhil Mulay on August 21, 2013, 01:01:22 am
  I remember attending a small seminar by Andy Munro last year where he showed a picture of a studio he designed in the 80's with a 30" woofer. He did mention which driver it was but the details escape me. According to specs it went down to 10hz!!
   They had to build a concrete baffle just to mount it.
    I think it was based in Denmark but again my memory is foggy on that. I do remember him saying that U2 had mixed one of their earlier albums there. They are still using it apparently!
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Art Welter on August 21, 2013, 12:14:52 pm
  I remember attending a small seminar by Andy Munro last year where he showed a picture of a studio he designed in the 80's with a 30" woofer. He did mention which driver it was but the details escape me. According to specs it went down to 10hz!!
Nikhil,

The EV 30W (also distributed by University sound) was available in the 1980's. It has about 1/10th the excursion (Xmax) and power handling of current state of the art drivers.
It used the same voice coil and magnet structure as the EV SRO 12 and 15 inch speakers, but used a Styrofoam cone similar in thickness to a disposable coffee cup.

The EV 30W had sensitivity of 100 dB one watt one meter, at full power (150 watts) in a 300 cubic foot (8490 liter) cabinet it would be around -13 dB at 10 Hz, about 110 dB.

110 dB at 10 Hz sounds about as loud as 20 dB at 1000 Hz, around the level of a mosquito at a few meters distance.

Art
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Ivan Beaver on August 21, 2013, 12:48:14 pm

The EV 30W had sensitivity of 100 dB one watt one meter, at full power (150 watts) in a 300 cubic foot (8490 liter) cabinet it would be around -13 dB at 10 Hz, about 110 dB.

110 dB at 10 Hz sounds about as loud as 20 dB at 1000 Hz, around the level of a mosquito at a few meters distance.

Art
The thing that is so often missed is that as you go low-it has to get REALLY loud to be "heard" and felt.

Every driver ever made can go into the single digits real easy-but how loud is the real question-that is most often just ignored.

Even one speaker manufacturer who advertises how low their cabinets can go-says in their own literature that you can't hear it or feel it-but it will produce those freq  (of course along with all the upper harmonics that overshadow the fundamental tone-but we won't talk about that will we--------------)  I guess those are the "free notes".
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Keith Broughton on August 21, 2013, 05:15:42 pm
Nikhil,

The EV 30W (also distributed by University sound) was available in the 1980's. It has about 1/10th the excursion (Xmax) and power handling of current state of the art drivers.
It used the same voice coil and magnet structure as the EV SRO 12 and 15 inch speakers, but used a Styrofoam cone similar in thickness to a disposable coffee cup.

The EV 30W had sensitivity of 100 dB one watt one meter, at full power (150 watts) in a 300 cubic foot (8490 liter) cabinet it would be around -13 dB at 10 Hz, about 110 dB.

110 dB at 10 Hz sounds about as loud as 20 dB at 1000 Hz, around the level of a mosquito at a few meters distance.

Art
A buddy of mine, back in the day, built a cabinet with 4 of those!
Big WOW factor but that's about it.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Daniel Twellmann on August 22, 2013, 10:04:00 am
  I remember attending a small seminar by Andy Munro last year where he showed a picture of a studio he designed in the 80's with a 30" woofer. He did mention which driver it was but the details escape me. According to specs it went down to 10hz!!
   They had to build a concrete baffle just to mount it.
    I think it was based in Denmark but again my memory is foggy on that. I do remember him saying that U2 had mixed one of their earlier albums there. They are still using it apparently!

That would probably be the Puk Studios
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: drew gandy on August 28, 2013, 09:37:11 pm
the big 30" ! bigger than Steven Tylers big 10" ! bigger than Superman's model locomotive !

Is there significance to the fact that the left and right feet don't match?  Just curious. 
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Nikhil Mulay on August 30, 2013, 02:56:49 pm
Nikhil,

The EV 30W (also distributed by University sound) was available in the 1980's. It has about 1/10th the excursion (Xmax) and power handling of current state of the art drivers.
It used the same voice coil and magnet structure as the EV SRO 12 and 15 inch speakers, but used a Styrofoam cone similar in thickness to a disposable coffee cup.

The EV 30W had sensitivity of 100 dB one watt one meter, at full power (150 watts) in a 300 cubic foot (8490 liter) cabinet it would be around -13 dB at 10 Hz, about 110 dB.

110 dB at 10 Hz sounds about as loud as 20 dB at 1000 Hz, around the level of a mosquito at a few meters distance.

Art
   I stand corrected! Didn't know much about the drivers except what was said at the seminar.
   I was in awe seeing the size of those woofers! :-)
   Guess bragging rights go a long way..
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: ron lavenski on August 30, 2013, 05:56:34 pm
had 2 ev-30 back in the 80's,cabs were each 500lbs front abd back were a full sheet of ply wood 8ftx4ft,32" wide,only used them 2 times had to get 2nd truck just to haul them,didn't take much power,but u could feel them more than hear them,think I know where 1 still is.had to turn them over weekly as the cone sagged,if I remember right
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Jens Palm Bacher on September 04, 2013, 04:03:18 pm
That would probably be the Puk Studios
It's a Fostex 30"; http://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_components/pdf/fw800hs.pdf
(http://www.pukstudio.com/1024/Web/GRAFIK2/ST1SSL1.jpg)
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Ivan Beaver on September 04, 2013, 06:44:37 pm
It's a Fostex 30"; http://www.fostexinternational.com/docs/speaker_components/pdf/fw800hs.pdf
(http://www.pukstudio.com/1024/Web/GRAFIK2/ST1SSL1.jpg)
Fostex still makes a very large woofer (not sure the exact size-maybe 27"?)

However it is REALLY expensive.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Doug Fowler on September 04, 2013, 07:57:20 pm
had 2 ev-30 back in the 80's,cabs were each 500lbs front abd back were a full sheet of ply wood 8ftx4ft,32" wide,only used them 2 times had to get 2nd truck just to haul them,didn't take much power,but u could feel them more than hear them,think I know where 1 still is.had to turn them over weekly as the cone sagged,if I remember right

Ron -

Can you get a photo?  I used to have the builders plan for this box but I can't find it.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Tim McCulloch on September 04, 2013, 11:44:55 pm
Ron -

Can you get a photo?  I used to have the builders plan for this box but I can't find it.

The name on the plans was 'Patrician'.  If an archeologist ever digs my files, I have a copy somewhere.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Doug Fowler on September 05, 2013, 11:22:46 am
The name on the plans was 'Patrician'.  If an archeologist ever digs my files, I have a copy somewhere.

Tim -

You can still find Patrician documentation out there.   But that was a home system, nice sparkly grill cloth, etc.

The builders plan for the 30" woof, it was just like the other TL series builders plans for the smaller loudspeakers.  The thing looked like an 8' tall refrigerator.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Doug Fowler on September 05, 2013, 11:39:59 am
Here is a link to 30w plans, but there might be more than one version of builders plans.  I could swear the one I'm thinking of was much taller than 60".

http://mypicsonline.net/archive/archives.telex.com/archives/EV/Builders%20Plans/30W%20Build%20Plans.pdf
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Ivan Beaver on September 05, 2013, 12:43:57 pm
Here is a link to 30w plans, but there might be more than one version of builders plans.  I could swear the one I'm thinking of was much taller than 60".

http://mypicsonline.net/archive/archives.telex.com/archives/EV/Builders%20Plans/30W%20Build%20Plans.pdf
I have seen photos of people building the cabinets under the floor and firing up into the room.

I was thinking the cabinets I have seen were more like 6-7' tall not 5'.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Doug Fowler on September 05, 2013, 12:45:04 pm
I have seen photos of people building the cabinets under the floor and firing up into the room.

I was thinking the cabinets I have seen were more like 6-7' tall not 5'.

That's what I thought too.  Maybe "the other" set of plans will turn up.
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Tim McCulloch on September 05, 2013, 02:26:13 pm
Here is a link to 30w plans, but there might be more than one version of builders plans.  I could swear the one I'm thinking of was much taller than 60".

http://mypicsonline.net/archive/archives.telex.com/archives/EV/Builders%20Plans/30W%20Build%20Plans.pdf

I remember a warning on the plans, to the effect of "be sure you can move this once it's built: total weight is about 550# and it won't fit through most doors."

Edit for ps:  from the late Al Limberg  http://www.livesoundint.com/lab/lab/messages/archive3/74525.html

And a search based on Brother Al's reference brings us to this:

http://mypicsonline.net/archive/archives.telex.com/archives/EV/Builders%20Plans/TL303%20Builders%20Plans.pdf
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Doug Fowler on September 05, 2013, 03:19:48 pm
I remember a warning on the plans, to the effect of "be sure you can move this once it's built: total weight is about 550# and it won't fit through most doors."

Edit for ps:  from the late Al Limberg  http://www.livesoundint.com/lab/lab/messages/archive3/74525.html

And a search based on Brother Al's reference brings us to this:

http://mypicsonline.net/archive/archives.telex.com/archives/EV/Builders%20Plans/TL303%20Builders%20Plans.pdf

That's it!
Title: Re: Powersoft 30" Woofer
Post by: Kyle_Keating on September 29, 2013, 04:27:54 am
Anyone have the T/S params?