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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => SR Forum Archives => Road Test FUD Forum Archive => Topic started by: Evan Kirkendall on December 06, 2006, 09:12:59 pm

Title: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 06, 2006, 09:12:59 pm
The kind folks over at A&H sent me a GL2800 to play with for awhile, and Im sure a lot of you guys are itching to hear about the board.

For you folks who live under a rock, the gl2800 packs some of the following features:
-8 busses
-10 aux
-4 mute groups
-2 mid sweeps
-phantom power on every channel
-pad's on every channel
-Polarity swap on every channel
-dual function(mon/FOH)
-Inserts on the group outs

The full feature set can be found Here.


In use:
The first gig was a learning experience. I used it for a school's battle of the bands. It took a little while to get used to. Im used to the meters on each channel being off to the right of the fader, however on this board they are on the left side. Took a little while to get used to. The EQ also took some getting used to. It sounds great, but has a very narrow Q. I found myself using less eq then normal, but at the same time I was using completely different frequencies then normal. Normally I boost 3k on the kick channel, but I found myself boosting 1k with the A&H. But, I must say I really like how the board sounded. It's very clean and transparent. I pushed it hard(up to clipping) and really didnt hear any distortion. The mute groups are also nice. Instead of going through the trouble of hitting the mute button on each channel, I can just hit the mute group and be done with it. 10 auxes is also nice. You can switch the first 8 pre/post in groups of 4, and you get 1 stereo aux(9-10). You can run 4 monitor mixes, 4 efx, aux subs and still have another stereo aux left! Now thats what Im talking about.

However, there are a few things I didnt like so much. They did a great job with packing a ton of features into a small space, but thats the problem. Too much stuff too close together. The knobs are a little close together, and someone with fatter fingers might have problems with bumping into other knobs. Also, the routing buttons on the channel strips are a pain. There are a ton of buttons real close together. Ive hit into them a few times and rerouted things... Woops... Oh well. One last thing that I would have liked is LED's to let you know whether the phantom power is on or off. But, I can live without that.

Also, another thing Ive noticed with all A&H's is slower meters. Ive never quite got the concept of that. On my Peavey board the meters are very quick, but with any A&H I've mixed on the meters are a lot slower. Whats the reasoning behind that?

One of the A&H's new competitors is the Mackie onyx boards. Ive been mixing on the onyx's for some time now and really like their sound. The A&H sounds completely different though. I thought the Mackie would give the A&H a run for it's money, but there is no competition. The Mackie has a more middy sound to it, while the A&H has no "sound" to it. I like the EQ on the A&H a lot more and I like the feel of the A&H board. Mackie's sweeps dont go below 100hz, A&H goes to 35hz. You just cant beat that! The Mackie is also a lot larger and heavier then the A&H. The 32 channel gl2800 is just over 4' long, less then 2' deep and only around 100lbs. The Mackie is over a foot longer and deeper too. It also weighs around 10lbs more. I'd pick the A&H board over a Mackie any day, though Mackie has really improved.

So, to sum it up:
Pros:
-Compact: 1 person can move a 32 channel frame with no problems
-Sounds great
-Looks cool
-Lots of Auxes

Cons:
-Knobs too close together
-Routing buttons bunched up with no indication of on or off

I also would have liked an internal psu. The external one is a pain to haul around.


And how about some pictures:

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e194/HarfordSound/FOH2.jpg
From the LAB show.



index.php/fa/6875/0/
First gig with it. Tom Mixing.


Ill post some more pics after my gig with it this weekend.



Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 06, 2006, 09:31:37 pm
Another glamor shot:

index.php/fa/6876/0/



Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Matt Vivlamore on December 06, 2006, 11:02:54 pm
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 21:12


One of the A&H's new competitors is the Mackie onyx boards. Ive been mixing on the onyx's for some time now and really like their sound. The A&H sounds completely different though. I thought the Mackie would give the A&H a run for it's money, but there is no competition. The Mackie has a more middy sound to it, while the A&H has no "sound" to it. I like the EQ on the A&H a lot more and I like the feel of the A&H board. Mackie's sweeps dont go below 100hz, A&H goes to 35hz. You just cant beat that! The Mackie is also a lot larger and heavier then the A&H. The 32 channel gl2800 is just over 4' long, less then 2' deep and only around 100lbs. The Mackie is over a foot longer and deeper too. It also weighs around 10lbs more. I'd pick the A&H board over a Mackie any day, though Mackie has really improved.





Which Mackie Onyx are you using?

Are you saying the A&H has a flatter sound than the Mackie?  Did you ever play with SMAART on the different boards?  like an A/B test...


Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Andy Peters on December 07, 2006, 02:45:57 am
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 19:12

I found myself using less eq then normal, but at the same time I was using completely different frequencies then normal. Normally I boost 3k on the kick channel, but I found myself boosting 1k with the A&H.


Dunno what other mixer you're using, but you might want to test both to determine the accuracy of the silkscreen.

Quote:

The mute groups are also nice. Instead of going through the trouble of hitting the mute button on each channel, I can just hit the mute group and be done with it.


Yup, mute groups are nice, nicer still that they're in a console at the GL2800's price.

Quote:

However, there are a few things I didnt like so much. They did a great job with packing a ton of features into a small space, but thats the problem. Too much stuff too close together.


So you like the fact that one person can carry the desk, yet you don't like the compromises that go into packing all of those features into that small form factor.  Come on ...

Quote:

Also, another thing Ive noticed with all A&H's is slower meters. Ive never quite got the concept of that. On my Peavey board the meters are very quick, but with any A&H I've mixed on the meters are a lot slower. Whats the reasoning behind that?


Differing meter ballistics.  You're talking about the main meters?  Maybe the A+H uses true VU ballistics whereas the Peavey doesn't?  I think the meters respond the way I expect (which is to say, VU).  I do wish the main meters were somewhat larger, but since there are input meters on all channels (also excellent considering the price), I find I don't PFL channels much on this desk (except to, you know, LISTEN to them) because the levels are right there.

Quote:

I also would have liked an internal psu. The external one is a pain to haul around.


Look at the size of the PSU, and then look at the size and weight of the console.  That'll tell you why the power supply is an external box.  Also, it keeps the heat generated by the power supply out of the console (a Good Thing).

-a
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on December 07, 2006, 10:59:30 am
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 20:12



One of the A&H's new competitors is the Mackie onyx boards. Ive been mixing on the onyx's for some time now and really like their sound. The A&H sounds completely different though. I thought the Mackie would give the A&H a run for it's money, but there is no competition. The Mackie has a more middy sound to it, while the A&H has no "sound" to it. I like the EQ on the A&H a lot more and I like the feel of the A&H board. Mackie's sweeps dont go below 100hz, A&H goes to 35hz. You just cant beat that! The Mackie is also a lot larger and heavier then the A&H. The 32 channel gl2800 is just over 4' long, less then 2' deep and only around 100lbs. The Mackie is over a foot longer and deeper too. It also weighs around 10lbs more. I'd pick the A&H board over a Mackie any day, though Mackie has really improved.


Evan


I am always curious when people describe the sound of something like a console that should be neutral.

It might be instructive to attempt a null test using a third mixer with either an inverting input or polarity swap cable. I would expect (hope) the mic pre and board with EQ zero'd would null fairly deep. If not what is the remaining difference when listening to full range music as a source after best null?

I do expect EQs to have characteristic differences in Q, range, and pot tapers.

JR
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 07, 2006, 07:20:07 pm
Matt Viv wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 23:02

Evan Kirkendall wrote on Wed, 06 December 2006 21:12


One of the A&H's new competitors is the Mackie onyx boards. Ive been mixing on the onyx's for some time now and really like their sound. The A&H sounds completely different though. I thought the Mackie would give the A&H a run for it's money, but there is no competition. The Mackie has a more middy sound to it, while the A&H has no "sound" to it. I like the EQ on the A&H a lot more and I like the feel of the A&H board. Mackie's sweeps dont go below 100hz, A&H goes to 35hz. You just cant beat that! The Mackie is also a lot larger and heavier then the A&H. The 32 channel gl2800 is just over 4' long, less then 2' deep and only around 100lbs. The Mackie is over a foot longer and deeper too. It also weighs around 10lbs more. I'd pick the A&H board over a Mackie any day, though Mackie has really improved.





Which Mackie Onyx are you using?

Are you saying the A&H has a flatter sound than the Mackie?  Did you ever play with SMAART on the different boards?  like an A/B test...






Onyx1640 and Onyx2480

Havent smaarted the boards, but Ive mixed the 3 boards on the same rig. A&H has a more "flat" tone to it.



Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Jim Brown on December 07, 2006, 08:57:08 pm
A bit of background.   The venue I work for was in the market for a replacement desk for a rapidly decaying Spirit Live 4:2 board.   Having had a mixwiz for smaller shows in the venue and having toured with various GL and ML desks: we bought the GL2800 and GL2800M based on their spec sheet alone in September.   Pricewise you'd be very hard pushed to fit the amount of capability in with desks from other companies (and I not aware of a direct competitor to the GL2800M).

In use we've had no problems, the flexibility of the 2800 is great for when you can only fit in one desk but still need to handle a fairly busy stage.   Another feature which I think it's great they've snuck in is the pink noise generator (also does 1k tone), which is very useful for accurate troubleshooting.   A lot of desks around the level of this one seem to stick with a 1k tone alone.   Good to have a useful matrix section in there too.

TBH I think the density of the controls is fine (and this comes from a guy whos poker playing mates call him "bludgeon fingers"), I get where you're coming from on the routing buttons on the channel strip-but there again where else do you want to put the buttons?

EQ-wise it sounds good (for what you pay for it).   Obviously the board sells at a competitive price, but I don't feel disappointed by the EQ-you can get where you're going with it.   Would I prefer a more expensive console? Yes.   Did the venue have the budget for it? No.    Does the desk still do the job I ask of it? Yes.   As always in life and engineering it's a compromise-the GL2800(and M version) has been a good one for us.

Re. silk screen of frequencies on consoles: having measured the inaccuracies of lab equipment which claims more precision than the frequency sweep on an eq I tend to fall very much on using your ears to judge if the eq is acting where you want it to-on some desks you can make the same tonal adjustment on two channels and end up with the sweeps and gains in quite different positions.

Jim


Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on December 08, 2006, 04:24:27 pm
Quote:

Onyx1640 and Onyx2480

Havent smaarted the boards, but Ive mixed the 3 boards on the same rig. A&H has a more "flat" tone to it.

Evan


We'll actually - no it does not.

When set flat - both boards sound (and measure) essentially the same.

There is something else causing that impression.

- I like, and use the A&H boards. I gave up on Mackie after they became the BOSE of "MI/pro" audio.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 15, 2006, 04:46:24 pm
Used the board again last weeked. Another sold out gig. 800 people rocking out to another great night of music.

Im really starting to like all the extra auxes. I ran 3 IEM mixes for one of the bands from FOH at my last gig. It was a breeze. Auxes 1-4 were mons, 5-6 efx, 8 subs and 9-10 recording. Pretty sweet. Loaded the board down and it did great.

I also like the aux config for auxes 9&10. They're stereo so you can take advantage of a post fader board recording and make it stereo! I was running a mono room mix, but stereo recording. Aux 9 acts as the volume and 10 is the pan. Pretty cool feature.

I ran the board hard again. Clipped the busses and you cant tell. It shows no signs of stress even pushing as hard as I can! Even though most of the night I was only running around 0. I made sure to push it up for the headliner though. Smile


The board is really starting to grow on me. I love the sound and all the features. A&H did a great job with this board!


index.php/fa/6969/0/




Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on December 15, 2006, 04:54:27 pm
How is the build quality after the move to manufacturing in China?
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 15, 2006, 06:49:34 pm
Tony Tissot wrote on Fri, 15 December 2006 16:54

How is the build quality after the move to manufacturing in China?



Still seems very solid. Lots of screws in the frame to keep it together and the frame is very solid. It doesnt flex when you pick it up, besides the bottom. Seems like it's just a piece of sheet metal.



Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Jim Brown on December 16, 2006, 04:42:27 pm

Quote:

How is the build quality after the move to manufacturing in China?


The two consoles delivered to us have proved to be fine, as soon as they arrived (before our deadline for delivery) I briefly tested/got my head around the various routing options on both boards.   I then became very busy for a few days while one of our newer recruits tested every send and routing option on every channel.   He couldn't find a fault then, and we haven't found one up to now.   Or anything that looks like it might fail prematurely.

I wasn't aware of a move of their manufacturing, but I don't see why it should affect the quality.   As long as the QA process is strong the physical location of the plant seems to have negligible impact on end quality.

Jim
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS on December 22, 2006, 08:40:36 pm
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Fri, 15 December 2006 14:46


I ran the board hard again. Clipped the busses and you cant tell. It shows no signs of stress even pushing as hard as I can! Even though most of the night I was only running around 0. I made sure to push it up for the headliner though. Smile

Evan


Evan, Do you push you rig to the limits on every gig?  That seems a little silly to me.

You will lose you hearing, get tinitus, blow up 8" drivers, cause premature failures of equipment, etc.
Is this just typical teenage behavior, wanting it really loud?
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 22, 2006, 08:59:10 pm
RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS wrote on Fri, 22 December 2006 20:40

Evan Kirkendall wrote on Fri, 15 December 2006 14:46


I ran the board hard again. Clipped the busses and you cant tell. It shows no signs of stress even pushing as hard as I can! Even though most of the night I was only running around 0. I made sure to push it up for the headliner though. Smile

Evan


Evan, Do you push you rig to the limits on every gig?  That seems a little silly to me.

You will lose you hearing, get tinitus, blow up 8" drivers, cause premature failures of equipment, etc.
Is this just typical teenage behavior, wanting it really loud?



The world of Combat audio Ryan.... I normally find myself running out of gas pretty quick. With limited power its really a battle. 99% of the time I mix around the drummer. They play soo loud I have to try to get over top of it. So, I find myself running right up into the red. Im not gonna blow anything up, cause I know my limits. Ive gone past the limits once and blew up the 8's, but Im not letting that happen again.

Oh, its not that loud either. The last gig I did was only 98db @ FOH(75' back). We had 800 people though and they absorbed most of the stage  wash. I wasnt clipping anything and had a solid mix going. I pushed the board up during the headliner and hit 100db, but it wasnt my rig either. Its a monthly benefit show I do, all I provide is FOH and some mics. Mains are a pair of Carvin 1588's, biamped. Its in a gym that holds 800. They're enough and the drummers arent normally a problem in this room. Once I find my limit, I stay under it and everything goes just fine.

The other gig I do is with my full rig. Im normally 103db @ FOH(60') and its a pain. With the trx's run full range off a plx2402 bridged I never have enough. Drums are a pain in this room. Tomorrow will be the first time with the trx's triamped, so Im hoping to have more gas. Ill let you know.

Oh yeah, I normally mix with plugs in. Smile


Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Bennett Prescott on December 22, 2006, 09:29:27 pm
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Fri, 22 December 2006 20:59

The world of Combat audio Ryan.... I normally find myself running out of gas pretty quick. With limited power its really a battle. 99% of the time I mix around the drummer. They play soo loud I have to try to get over top of it. So, I find myself running right up into the red. Im not gonna blow anything up, cause I know my limits. Ive gone past the limits once and blew up the 8's, but Im not letting that happen again.

Uh huh. Tell us about it Rolling Eyes

Laughing
Title: Runnin' outta gas?!?
Post by: RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS on December 22, 2006, 09:35:13 pm
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Michael 'Bink' Knowles on December 23, 2006, 12:26:04 pm
Tony Tissot wrote on Fri, 08 December 2006 13:24

Quote:

...A&H has a more "flat" tone to it...


We'll actually - no it does not...


I guess we won't know the truth of it until either of you actually shows the measurements.

It would be interesting to fill the mixers up with pink noise on every channel and Smaart them mixed down to the main bus. The differences between mic preamps can be so subtle you have to add them together in quantity to show results.

-Bink
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Bennett Prescott on December 23, 2006, 12:33:56 pm
I suspect that differences in timbre between mic preamps is one of those things, like differences in sound between two perfectly flat speakers that nonetheless sound different, that cannot (easily?) be measured in Smaart. No doubt there is a phase component, but the rest... who knows?
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on December 23, 2006, 12:38:01 pm
Michael 'Bink' Knowles wrote on Sat, 23 December 2006 12:26

Tony Tissot wrote on Fri, 08 December 2006 13:24

Quote:

...A&H has a more "flat" tone to it...


We'll actually - no it does not...


I guess we won't know the truth of it until either of you actually shows the measurements.

It would be interesting to fill the mixers up with pink noise on every channel and Smaart them mixed down to the main bus. The differences between mic preamps can be so subtle you have to add them together in quantity to show results.

-Bink



I was planning to do this over winter break. Just havent had the time yet.



Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on December 23, 2006, 12:57:22 pm
Bennett Prescott wrote on Sat, 23 December 2006 11:33

I suspect that differences in timbre between mic preamps is one of those things, like differences in sound between two perfectly flat speakers that nonetheless sound different, that cannot (easily?) be measured in Smaart. No doubt there is a phase component, but the rest... who knows?


Arghhh... "Timbre"? While I suspect real differences between preamp are overstated, if there are repeatable audible differences they can be characterized by measurements. Note: I am not saying that they are characterized by published measurements only that they can be.

To fully characterize a mic preamp one would need amplitude, phase, linearity, noise, and input impedance plots... for every gain setting. If there's a pad, that must be characterized for how it impacts input impedance and other performance measures.

We seem quick to forget these are connected to microphones which are not only far less accurate, may also exhibit dependencies on input termination.

Not to mention perceptual biases caused by gain law, feel of controls, brand halo effect, and dirty tricks. For example one trick I've seen (I will not publicly out the brand but I doubt it was accidental) was to under size the blocking cap in the gain pot leg. This had the effect of a sliding HPF that dramatically reduced 1/F and LF grunge from the preamps noise floor at max gain... "Man just listen to how quiet these preamps are compared to (a flat) brand XYZ". Of course published frequency response was measured at a modest gain where it exhibited decent bass response (coincidence, I think not).

Merry Christmas folks...

JR  
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on December 23, 2006, 01:05:20 pm
Michael 'Bink' Knowles wrote on Sat, 23 December 2006 11:26



I guess we won't know the truth of it until either of you actually shows the measurements.

It would be interesting to fill the mixers up with pink noise on every channel and Smaart them mixed down to the main bus. The differences between mic preamps can be so subtle you have to add them together in quantity to show results.

-Bink



I'm not sure averaging a number of mic preamp outputs will do anything other than smooth differences. Your test may reveal more about the character of the summing amp than the pre.

But yes, I agree the truth can be revealed with (the right) measurements.

JR

BTW: hows the heat induced green to brown conversions coming?
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Bennett Prescott on December 23, 2006, 01:22:50 pm
John Roberts  {JR} wrote on Sat, 23 December 2006 12:57

Arghhh... "Timbre"? While I suspect real differences between preamp are overstated, if there are repeatable audible differences they can be characterized by measurements. Note: I am not saying that they are characterized by published measurements only that they can be.

Sorry, JR, I was trying to be ethereal and measurement agnostic in my reply, but my intended point was the same as yours. The differences that exist between preamps are slight, and do not (usually) reveal themselves in frequency response measurements, or any one easy-to-pick number. 20Hz - 20KHz can be claimed by any number of different preamps that all sound and react differently under actual use... Is it phase linearity? Is it "smearing" in time (a la Gunness Focussing)? Is it impedence or gain or... I don't know.

I have no doubt it can be measured, I just know it is not currently in any easily digestible form.
Title: Sweet Maria's
Post by: Michael 'Bink' Knowles on December 23, 2006, 02:16:04 pm
Quote:

...BTW: hows the heat induced green to brown conversions coming?


Just fine, thanks. Today's another conversion day.  Very Happy

It turns out the 24v 2VA Ace Hardware doorbell xfrmr I used on the fan circuit was woefully underspec and burned out on me... a much larger Radio Shack xfrmr with the same 2VA spec is working perfectly. Not overheating at all.

I failed to anticipate the two-week holiday vacation of Sweet Maria's people. Sad  Sometime between Xmas and NYE I'll run out of my stuff which means I'll use Peet's to tide me over until early Jan when I get another green bag. Current favorite is The Juan Francisco Project.

-Bink
Title: Re: Sweet Maria's
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on December 23, 2006, 07:50:14 pm
Michael 'Bink' Knowles wrote on Sat, 23 December 2006 13:16



Just fine, thanks. Today's another conversion day.  Very Happy

It turns out the 24v 2VA Ace Hardware doorbell xfrmr I used on the fan circuit was woefully underspec and burned out on me... a much larger Radio Shack xfrmr with the same 2VA spec is working perfectly. Not overheating at all.

I failed to anticipate the two-week holiday vacation of Sweet Maria's people. Sad  Sometime between Xmas and NYE I'll run out of my stuff which means I'll use Peet's to tide me over until early Jan when I get another green bag. Current favorite is The Juan Francisco Project.

-Bink

I've got 10# of decaf and 10# of regular green sitting unopened on my kitchen floor. I can slide you some in an emergency (PM me), but sending green coffee beans to SF is truly like sending coals to Newcastle. My beer supplier is in your corner of the world and also pimps beans  http://www.williamsbrewing.com/GREEN_COFFEE_C72.cfm AFAIK he's open next week.

Life is too short to tolerate mediocre beverages.

JR
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tom Manchester on December 24, 2006, 03:22:36 am
I have a small complaint about the GL2800 after tonights gig, and I noticed it is common among several over A&H boards.

The GL2800 and other A&H boards have sides on them that are just the sheet metal from the bottom bent up. This creates a problem. When you go to pick it up and set it down you have to hold it from the bottom, but when you need to set it down there is nothing to grab onto so the only way to put it down is lower it down with your fingers getting scrushed between the table and the board, and then slide your fingers out and let the board drop.

Picking it up presents a similar problem, There is nothing towards the back of the board to get your hands under to pick it up.

This seems like a petty complaint but it is kind of an inconvenience. Presumably most people will have it in a flight case but if it is ever pulled out it is hard to move. My soundcraft lx7ii has molded plastic sides with a little recess to get your hands into to pick it up. Much easier to sling it around.

Plenty of handles on a piece of pro-audio gear is always a good thing.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: ThomasDameron on December 24, 2006, 04:09:29 pm
Hold it with one hand on the armrest where there is an angle and the other on the back where the i/o is.  Tilt it a little until the hand with the i/o feels comfortable.  Then put it down and go order a roadcase.   Razz

Also, I see the flat ends as a benefit because it means the console will have a narrower footprint.  Some gigs every inch counts.

thomas d.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Adam Whetham on December 24, 2006, 07:08:04 pm
ThomasDameron wrote on Sun, 24 December 2006 15:09

Hold it with one hand on the armrest where there is an angle and the other on the back where the i/o is.  Tilt it a little until the hand with the i/o feels comfortable.  Then put it down and go order a roadcase.   Razz

Also, I see the flat ends as a benefit because it means the console will have a narrower footprint.  Some gigs every inch counts.

thomas d.



The handle doesn't have to stick out. Take a look at the Mackie Onyx 24.4... Picked one of those up one time.. the handles are perfect!
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tim Padrick on December 25, 2006, 04:51:20 am
Get a case with a tray style doghouse, and you can use deep six the case at the swanky gigs, yet still hide all the cables for a tidy look.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on December 25, 2006, 05:03:34 am
Behringer has a grip as well.

Maybe that explains it all. A good-to-better console never gets moved without a solid case. Handholds are superfluous.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tom Manchester on December 25, 2006, 12:41:03 pm
Obviously a case is the way to go, but there are times when the board will need to be moved like from the box to the roadcase, and from the roadcase to the bench for cleaning, or in a permanent install when it needs to be moved so a band with their own board can put it in place. Or in the case of Evan where he is just borrowing the board and it was not sent with a roadcase. Any one of these times it would be nice to have something to grip other then smooth metal sides. It's a piece of live gear, and I'm looking around my room now at all the stuff in here that's just covered with handles.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Jim Brown on January 01, 2007, 01:24:07 pm
TBH I'd take the view if I was designing it that there are two very likely scenarios for the desk:

1.   Road use: Always cased, removed when a fault occurrs.   Frequency of movement out of case low.   Most cleaning in a fitted case can be done without desk removal.

2.   Install use: Not cased, lifted from packaging into mix position.   Not moved very often until a fault occurs.

Obviously some installs move their desk in and out but those tend to have a case made as the gear gets stored and setup on a show by show basis.

If you also factor in the expense of machining handles in, allowing the extra room in the desk for the recess, the extra components and the additional processes on the production line then I think it stacks up in favour of not having handles on the desk.   TBH if Evan bought that desk there's no way he'd move it around out of a case unless he was absolutely broke and saving up to pay for a case.  

The observation that it lacks handles wouldn't bother 99.9% of its target market so I don't think A&H will be rushing back to the drawing board to add handles.

Jim

[Edited to eliminate a double negative, my English teacher would be proud.]
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Mike Butler (media) on January 14, 2007, 07:08:04 pm
Tony Tissot wrote on Fri, 08 December 2006 16:24

... I gave up on Mackie after they became the BOSE of "MI/pro" audio.

Was that before or after they went Beijing-built?  Confused

How sad to think of an old friend (Mackie) having gone down the road of the charlatans of consumer audio.

I like the A&H too. To me, they have no "tone" which is exactly right. But they don't make anything that fits in a Porta Brace bag quite like a 1402 or 1202 VLZ (semi) Pro. Smile I would hate to see a GL desk (or even a Mixwiz) sitting athwart my tripod dolly.  Twisted Evil
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on January 25, 2007, 09:23:02 pm
The "latch" on the talk back mic no longer works. What's up with that? I use it once and it breaks... Thats not a good selling point.

Also, I noticed the board says "made in England" on the back. Are the more expensive GL consoles still made in England, or do I have  a special one?


Other then the talkback problem the console's preformed great. I still love mixing on it.



Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Dan Brown on January 25, 2007, 09:36:28 pm
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Thu, 25 January 2007 20:23

The "latch" on the talk back mic no longer works. What's up with that? I use it once and it breaks... Thats not a good selling point.
...snip...
Other then the talkback problem the console's preformed great. I still love mixing on it.
Evan


Well that is a Neutrik part so whatever that says.
It doesn't say to much about A&H though.

I love Neutrik and is sounds like somthing must have gotten tweaked.

db
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Andy Peters on January 25, 2007, 11:19:11 pm
Evan Kirkendall wrote on Thu, 25 January 2007 19:23

The "latch" on the talk back mic no longer works. What's up with that? I use it once and it breaks... Thats not a good selling point.


Actually, I think I noticed that on the 2800 we put in Club Congress.  I thought maybe it was some kinda configuration thing.  Next time I gig there I'll check it again.

Quote:

Also, I noticed the board says "made in England" on the back. Are the more expensive GL consoles still made in England, or do I have  a special one?


Carey posted something telling where the various consoles are made.

Quote:

Other then the talkback problem the console's preformed great. I still love mixing on it.


Betcha it performed great, too!

-a
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Dave Lewty on February 05, 2007, 06:57:56 pm
Hi It's Dave Lewty here. I am the product specialist for Allen and Heath in the US.
I will try to check on a regular basis.

If you have any questions regarding the console etc I will do my best to answer them.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Carey Davies on February 06, 2007, 05:33:12 am
Jim Brown wrote on Mon, 01 January 2007 18:24

TBH I'd take the view if I was designing it that there are two very likely scenarios for the desk:

1.   Road use: Always cased, removed when a fault occurrs.   Frequency of movement out of case low.   Most cleaning in a fitted case can be done without desk removal.

2.   Install use: Not cased, lifted from packaging into mix position.   Not moved very often until a fault occurs.

If you also factor in the expense of machining handles in, allowing the extra room in the desk for the recess, the extra components and the additional processes on the production line then I think it stacks up in favour of not having handles on the desk.  

Yes Jim, you pass the test for joining our design team!  Cool
Console packaging is a pet beef of mine. Where budget is tight (isn't it always!) I believe it is vital that every penny, er... cent, goes into what really matters - the build quality, performance and feature set. Adding nice looking plastic trims or handles was at the bottom of the list.

Another factor is footprint - I am out on the circuit quite a bit myself and know the struggle it can be fitting everything into the back of a small van or estate car, and finding someone to help you carry the gear in. Then the venue manager starts wining about 'bums on seats' and you get squashed into a little corner. In short, it made sense to keep the surface compact but not too tight for the bigger fingers, and to avoid wasting space, and cost, with unnecessary add-ons. It is true that most of these GL's get flightcased or installed. The compact, non-trim chassis was designed to fit snuggly into a case not much bigger than the area taken up by the controls themselves.

That said, the armrest is designed with a shape that provides a grip for lifting the uncased console, and a place for the additional under armrest headphones socket. That's another gripe from A&H users over the years - the position of the phones socket. So we bit the bullet on the GL2800 and fitted 3 sockets, one 1/4" at the top of the panel, another under the armrest, and a 3.5mm mini jack for plugging in ear-pieces or when you lose the headphones adaptor! Paying for those parts made more sense than paying for plastic  Very Happy

I could ramble on but will try to keep on topic. BTW, I wrote a piece on the design concept of the new GL Series for LSI magazine about a year ago, November 2005 I think. May be worth a read if you are interested. If you have any specific questions feel free to contact me off line or here, or to contact US based Dave Lewty who is also a passionate sound guy... enjoys mixing too  Twisted Evil
All the best,
Carey (GL designer)
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Mark Herman on February 07, 2007, 01:55:30 am
I did a very quick text copy of the Live Sound article by Carey. It may have a few mistakes because this isn't the very final version but at least it is close... Sorry about the formatting but like I said it was quick.


In researching the design for the
third generation GL Series consoles,
we first looked to identify the
key factors in choosing an analog console
for mixing live sound. This was
the great chance to take advantage of
our years of experience developing
and manufacturing consoles for this
application, talking to users and
spending time at the “sharp end”
behind the controls.
We also examined how the live
sound application has evolved in
recent years, most strikingly, the leap
in audio system power and quality,
the sheer number of sources and
feeds involved, and the complex
requirements now faced by even the
lower budget operators.
Price, of course, is the aspect that
has remained tightly capped. It was
obvious we faced a tough challenge
to enhance the performance and functional
capability over the previous GL
range and still retain the clear benefits
of an analog console – affordability
and ease of use.
And regardless of price, reliability
remains paramount. Earlier GL models
gave us a solid foundation to build on,
and we were confident that our individual
card, semi-modular construction
method and choice of components
was right for the job.
Sound quality, too, is high on the
list when it comes to talking about
console choice. We had a lot to draw
on from the development of our more
recent consoles, such as the flagship
ML Series.
Ease of use also remains a key
point for those who want a quick,
walk-up-and-mix solution, especially
where non-technical operators are
involved. However, it’s the number
of inputs and outputs (I/O) and
functionality versus cost that represents
the starting point for most in
choosing a console that is right for
their application.
The new GL design has been driven
by the need to provide a lot more
I/O and functional capability without
compromising quality, usability or
cost. Who would have thought even a
few years back that an affordable console
such as the GL2800 would pack a
56-channel, 10-auxes, left-center-right
(LCR), four-matrix architecture into a
package under 6 feet wide and 25
inches deep?
Years ago, Allen & Heath pioneered
dual functionality, devising the
concept of being able to apply one
the GL4800.

console to properly mix front-ofhouse
(FOH) or stage monitors. It
makes perfect sense. For the cost of a
few clever “mode” switches, the console
architecture can be optimized for
either application. And if done properly,
no controls are redundant.
REFINING FUNCTION
The new GL takes the principles
established by the previous models
and further refines the function for the
new applications such as in-ear monitoring
(IEM), aux-fed subs and ambient-
enhanced matrix mixing.
The first requirement is that all
the main outputs are provided with
100-mm (4-inch) faders, inserts for
patching in equalizers, +4 dBu balanced
XLR output for driving long
cables to the amp racks, and dedicated
meters, mutes and AFL monitoring
for each. This is done by swapping
the group and aux control sections,
and in the case of the smaller
models, which have the XLRs and
inserts on the groups only, the connectors
reverse too.
The groups should continue to
feed the matrix and subgrouping to LR
while in monitor mode, a feature now
added to all models. One benefit is
that you can use the groups to create
additional monitor mixes from the
matrix, presenting new opportunities
for in-ear mixing.
Another requirement is that the
main “C” fader and associated XLR
output can be configured as the engineer’s
wedge monitor feed providing
the same control and “feel” as the
stage monitors being checked.
The mode switches should also be
protected from accidental operation
during the show. The GL does this by
recessing these switches for operation
using a pointed object for little to no
chance of mistakes.
MODERN MULTI-OUTPUT
Perhaps the biggest addition to the
new GL models is the matrix. We recognize
this as becoming increasingly
useful in modern multi-output mixing,
so much so that it is proving invaluable
even on a small format mixer
such as the GL2400.
The matrix provides a versatile
‘toolbox” of outputs for many applications.
These outputs can be used to
feed delay fill loudspeakers, for
acoustically compensated mono or
stereo recordings, hard-of-hearing
loops, patching in the support act console,
creating additional monitor
mixes and more.
Take this GL2400 recording example:
It is equipped with four matrices,
each fed from the four groups, L, R
and an external line input. These
inputs are normalled through their
sockets so that plugging in just one
source feeds all four matrix mixes,
plugging into the first pair feeds 1-2
and 3-4 in stereo, and plugging into all
allows independent input.
Two independently balanced stereo
mixes could be created, for example, to
feed separate audio and video
recorders. Ambient microphone sources
could be plugged into external inputs 1
and 2. These feed both pairs of matrices
in stereo adding the required amount of
audience reaction to each mix.
The design philosophy was to
maximize capability versus size and
cost. This was the thinking behind the
two multi-function stereo channels,
each of which include a mic preamp
and two independently controlled
stereo line inputs with several different
modes of operation.
Mix the stereo inputs together into
one channel strip, for example, to
combine two sound effects players or
reverb returns, or use the strips as
mono mic channels while the stereos
are routed direct to the LR mix providing
up to four “short” returns.
There is even the facility to patch
the unused mic preamps elsewhere,
for example into the matrix as
described above to create the ambient
enhanced recordings, or to use with
A look at the functionality and features of the GL2800 master section. an analyzer mic.
November 2005 Live Sound International 81
The matrix provides a furthemeans of creating quick monitor
mixes, in much the same way as the
new breed of distributed monitor systems
provide mixing from groups of
signals. The external inputs may be
used to add ambience to closed inear
monitors using the stereo channel
microphone cross-patching method,
or alternatively, to add “more me”
signals patched from the channel
direct outputs or auxes. The GL2800
offers the capability to create up to
17 monitor mixes comprising eight
mono, four stereo and the engineer’s
wedge from the 10 aux, LR, C and
four matrix outputs.
Additional facilities have been
introduced to make the new GL more
capable for mixing
IEM. One
aspect we focused
on is the
ability for the
engineer to listen
to the mix as the
musician would
hear i t . Apart
from the wedge
monitor output,
the GL2800 and
GL3800 provide
true stereo headphone
monitori
n g o f s t e reo
mixes c reated
from aux 9-10
and the matrix,
even down to the
inclusion of a 3.5
mm socket for
plugging in an
earpiece.
WHAT IS
NEEDED
An application that is gaining popularity
is to feed the sub bass loudspeakers
with their own mix. This helps
clean up the sound by putting just
what is needed into the subs, typically
kick and bass, and keeping out low
frequency pickup from the other stage
mics. While a C mix - as on the
GL2800 – can do the job just fine, the
smaller GL2400 offers a new option to
use post-fade aux 6 as the sub feed for
true aux-fed subs.
The important point here is that the
sub master level is re-routed to the M
fader and balanced XLR making it easier
to maintain the balance between
subs and tops when adjusting the PA
master levels.
The GL4800 at the top of the range
provides additional live recording
capability with its group outputs
selectable pre or post master fader,
and both these and the channel direct
outputs routable through trim pots to
match the levels to the recorder. This
console introduces a switched Q
equalizer, balanced inserts, and an
onboard MIDI-capable snapshot
memory system for the more sophisticated
user.
Plenty of configurable options are
provided, mostly set internally,
although the GL2800 and GL3800 take
the pre/post EQ aux setting to the
front panel. The new GL consoles
retain the per channel aux pre/post
fader switching. We believe that global
pre/post switching, while convenient
for the operator, is restrictive to
the application.
Switches per channel make it possible
to deal with situations such as
theatre monitor sends combining
stage and radio mics. The stage mics
would be set pre-fade to maintain
consistent level in the monitors but
the radio mic channels should be set
post-fade to follow the scripted fader
movements and thus prevent noise
such as offstage talk or out of range
hiss getting to the monitor mix.
FINDING ITS FEET
Of course, the one thing that still
attracts users to the analog console is
its ease of use. In a world where the
digital alternative is still finding its
ergonomic feet with some users, the
familiar layout of a well-designed analog
console can be reassuring.
Live mixing is far removed from
the more relaxed studio. It’s about
working under pressure, making
quick decisions and dealing with
The matrix is a big addition, helping meet
multi-output mixing needs.
The interconnectivity of the rear panel (GL2800), with the diagram
illustrating the bringing of mic inputs of the stereo input modules into
the matrix in order to add ambience to for things like IEM.
82 Live Sound International November 2005
problems in a non-ideal world. Our
objective has been to make the layout
as clear and logical as possible for
walk-up-and-go mixing so typical of
the smaller festivals and events.
Versatility is a good thing, but not a
lot of use if it’s confusing or lost
among the controls. We paid special
attention to many aspects of the
design: The shape of the console for
operating comfort and control reach,
the compact footprint for space-saving
installation and flight casing, visibility
of the meters and indicators in a way
that avoids information overload,
working under different lighting conditions,
color-coding and logical
grouping of the controls, the ability to
check and monitor any signal, to communicate
with the stage, and line-up
and test the equipment.
With the huge recent advances in
amplifier and loudspeaker design, as
well as the high-powered - and often
over-powered - systems now affordable,
it has become increasingly
important to focus on the sonic performance
of our new designs.
Remember the days when a -70
dBu noise floor was deemed acceptable
because it far exceeded the performance
of the tape recorder to be
connected? Now a good 20 dB better
than that is the norm.
PLENTY OF DISCUSSION
Equipment “sound quality” has
become one of the most subjective
and emotive subjects talked about in
our industry, particularly the console
mic preamp. There is a lot of
mix engineer discussion about the
“sound” of the mic pre but, while
this interface to the outside world is
very important, it is by no means
the only part of the signal chain that
matters.
To properly address the issue, we
needed to examine the full signal
path from input to output. In fact, the
mix bus head amp, the circuit that
combines the sources into the mix, is
a very underrated discussion point,
particularly regarding its dynamic
performance.
The circuit developed for the new
GL uses a differential transistor front
end referenced to a compensating
ground bus resulting in a mix noise
reduction of around 6 dB (half the
noise), a welcome and noticeable
improvement for users working with
high-powered FOH and monitor rigs.
The mix amp is structured to work
at -2 dBu rather than 0 to achieve
extended headroom of +23 dB. This
makes the console forgiving of a
“hot” mix, avoiding distortion where
it is most at risk - the bus itself. Based
on our more recent circuit developments,
we set about making the mic
preamp more transparent and better
able to handle transient peaks.
We regard the input headroom of
the mic pre as ultra important, especially
with the new breed of high
output microphones and dBfs normalized
line sources available today.
Both the XLR and TRS jack can
accept a source as high as +34 dBu,
ensuring plenty of margin for hot signals
from the stage without the need
for external padding. The EQ was
also re-engineered to make its gain
controls more responsive, particularly
around mid-point.
Part of the GL Series story has
been the ability to offer users plenty
of choice. The new series continues
this with the introduction of over 40
variants of the four models, with
frame sizes from 16 to 56 channels,
and with some models offering a
variety of stereo channel layouts. For
those who want more channels feeding
the mix, our proprietary Sys-Link
console linking option is available. n
Carey Davies heads up design for Allen & Heath,
based in the U.K.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Michael 'Bink' Knowles on February 07, 2007, 02:12:47 am
That's quite the article... hard to read formatted like that but it's worth it.

The text is glib about the dual function switches which change the GL desk from monitor to FOH duties. In the analog world, such a switch is very much NOT a simple thing to achieve. There have to be additional circuit board traces going every which way--the circuit design demands increase greatly. Nothing on that scale is easy.

Thanks to Carey and his team for continuing to push the point where budget meets feature set. Let's hear it for Cornwall!

-Bink

http://www.cornwall-calling.co.uk/culture/flag.jpg
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Jamin Lynch on April 07, 2007, 04:40:06 pm
That's pretty creative hanging the lights from the basketball back stop.  Laughing
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Guthrie Saunders on August 07, 2007, 12:48:22 am
Hmmm... having mixed on a GL2800 several times, and the Onyx once (although it was for a three day festival with a lot of different bands) I liked the preamp on the Onyx a little better.  It seemed to have more headroom and was pretty powerful, I always end up pushing the preamp on the GL consoles more than I like.  I liked the eq section on the GL better than the Onyx though.  I'm not saying I'm right, that was just my impression.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Jim Brown on August 07, 2007, 02:33:23 pm
I'm not sure I follow you when you say "pushing the preamp".   Just curious about what you mean.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Brearton on September 25, 2007, 09:14:30 pm
I bought a GL2800/32 on its specs and my positive experiences with my GL2, GL3 and WZ16:2dx. I needed a board that can be a monitor desk and at FOH when I am running a smaller show.

I still have not used it for FOH but the first show out of the box was as a monitor desk feeding 10 mixs.  One glaring omission jumped out right away at sound check - no AFL on the mix 9 or 10 faders. We could not que up mix 9 or 10. I don't understand why this was not included. My guess is that aux 9-10 were not meant to run mixes but they do have inserts and grp/aux switches? Did I overlook a way to que up these mixes?

In this case, we were able to route those mixes to two monitors that needed radically different mixes so we just hard panned channels that went to each mix. My monitor guy liked the board and it worked great otherwise.

i'll be mixing monitors and mains from front of house this weekend so I'll finally get to work with and listen to it myself.

john

Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on September 25, 2007, 09:49:46 pm
index.php/fa/11473/0/
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Brearton on September 26, 2007, 02:23:23 pm
index.php/fa/11489/0/
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on September 26, 2007, 02:43:07 pm
index.php/fa/11491/0/

Not as direct as having an AFL button above the fader, but it's there.





Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: ThomasDameron on September 26, 2007, 03:19:31 pm
It's almost worse having it there but not being able to use it for what should be done.  When you're using it as a monitor console the button Evan pointed out does not route it to the cue wedge.  Monitor only refers to the headphones apparently.  I think it's a huge problem with the desk, and for this reason I only consider it to be an 8 mix monitor console instead of the 12 mix board it narrowly missed (10 aux + L/R).

Swing and a miss A&H.

thomas d.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tim Tyler on September 26, 2007, 05:34:06 pm
To TD -

According to your formula, shouldn't you consider this a 10 mix board (8 aux + LR = 10)?
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: ThomasDameron on September 26, 2007, 05:49:50 pm
No because you can't monitor the L/R or aux 9/10 off of the cue wedge, so it's no different.  I admit that if you're doing in-ear mixes off of 9/10 or L/R you're usually going to use ear buds to monitor those mixes, so you're a little better for the wear.  However, I think it's silly that your work flow is dictated by the omission of two cue buttons.

thomas d.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on September 26, 2007, 05:51:56 pm
Thats what the GL2800M is for. Wink




Evan
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Brearton on September 26, 2007, 06:05:30 pm
That is what I found too... Nothing I tried would get the mix 9 and/or 10 fader to AFL to the cue wedge.

I even twisted the "LR-M" knob shown here:

index.php/fa/11499/0/

Possibly the 9-10 pair would work well as an in-ear mix and the engineer could cue it up in cans using the monitor 9-10 button.

John
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: John Brearton on September 26, 2007, 06:19:52 pm
I do want to comment on the build quality. At least for the PSU.

I actually purchased this one used off the Marketplace here. The PSU was shipped mounted in a small rack. The carrier was quite rough with it and it must have been dropped and tossed around pretty good. Much more abusive than any of us would be with a rack, short of accidentally dropping it down a flight of stairs. The rack ears were bent in several directions but the unit still works flawlessly putting out the correct voltages.

John

Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on September 26, 2007, 10:26:25 pm
It's an 8 aux board for practical, mono out, traditional purposes.

The differences in aux 9 and 10 start all the way back at the channel strip.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Kevin Ballard on September 27, 2007, 05:48:29 am
Bink said
[/quote]

Thanks to Carey and his team for continuing to push the point where budget meets feature set. Let's hear it for Cornwall!

-Bink

http://www.cornwall-calling.co.uk/culture/flag.jpg[/quote]

For Heavens sake, don't encourage them or we'll have to start taking our passports there for our summer breaks. Laughing
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Anthony Montano on October 08, 2007, 01:24:25 am
I like everything about this economy console except for one minor thing. The pink noise function.  What I found is when you use the built-in pink noise generator in this console with a sizable sound system with some decent volume, is feedback.  Feedback through the consoles frame/housing.  I beleive all the latest generation GL consoles have this problem.  Go ahead and try it! Turn on the pink noise,  turn up the sound over your system.  While its up try tapping the console surface like knocking on a door and you will hear it over your PA.  I addressed this with A & H two years ago and they replied that it was not an important enough problem to make a fix.
     Although you should not use this consoles pink noise source as a way of measuring a room, it better serves its purpose for referencing gain where you need to see it on the console or as a simple means of trouble shooting.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Randall "Btm Fdr" Cook on March 27, 2009, 05:05:04 pm
Is it a good idea to use the stereo 9-10 aux for effects sends?  Left or 9 to Reverb and Right or 10 to Delay?

What's the best way to use the auxes of the GL2800 when you need more than 4 monitor mixes (pre fade) and at least 2 auxes for effects (post)?

Thank you!
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Peter Etheredge on April 17, 2009, 11:33:53 am
Randall Cook wrote on Fri, 27 March 2009 16:05

Is it a good idea to use the stereo 9-10 aux for effects sends?  Left or 9 to Reverb and Right or 10 to Delay?

What's the best way to use the auxes of the GL2800 when you need more than 4 monitor mixes (pre fade) and at least 2 auxes for effects (post)?

Thank you!


That's what I would do/have done.

It woul be nice if every single or at least every two aux's could be set to pre/post but it is a mid level board so it would be kind of silly to expect such a thing.

That said for a mid level analog board it's by far one of the best deals out there and I've had nothing but good experiences with these things.

pete
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Randall "Btm Fdr" Cook on April 17, 2009, 11:52:25 am
Thanks Pete!

I haven't purchased this board yet, but it is number one in the running.  I hope to land one soon!

I know what you mean by the ability to select pre/post per aux or every two.  That would be nice, but not affordable for me at this time.

Thanks again for your confirmation on the use of the GL2800 auxes!

Randall
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Keith Shannon on September 04, 2009, 06:41:22 pm
Quote:

Routing buttons bunched up with no indication of on or off


Just curious, but could you give me an example of an analog board anywhere near this price range that does have more than up-down indication of routing? Not having had the privilege of working with anything more than the 2400-series, I have just gotten used to the up-down indication.

One thing you may consider, if you control this mixer, is painting the front side of the up-down buttons in some color that will contrast well under just the desk lights (maybe even glow-paint). Red==off, just like the mute switches.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on December 12, 2009, 06:35:55 pm
GL2800 is an awesome console especially for the money! I installed one in a local club a couple of years ago and have not had a problem with it. A&H really addressed a missing link in the GL series with this console. Many clubs and Local so co's on a budget need at least 8 auxes but can't afford a $10K console when they only make $500-$1000 per show. I really like the VU meters on the larger A&H consoles, but I understand it would just add to the cost.  Very Happy
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: chris johnson on July 11, 2010, 06:17:53 pm
so i think we are purchasing a 48 channel 2800 sometime this month where i work. cheapest i can find currently new is 6700ish.

i guess my question is, if you had 6700 to spend on a 48 channel FOH console, what would you buy? all signs for our current situation point to this board, but i am curious if there is anything out there i should be looking into.

thanks for your time in advance.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tim Tyler on July 11, 2010, 09:38:17 pm
Chris -

If you need an analog mixer, scrape a few extra $$$ and look here:

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/t/58615/4514/

I question the investment value of a $6700 GL2800.  Very good analog mixers are popping up regularly at bargain basement prices, the APB (above) is a prime example, and is a VERY PRO piece.

-Tim T
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: chris johnson on July 13, 2010, 12:01:26 am
im not tryin to be a dick or anything, but that photo says 1994 in the corner.

maybe im missing something, but that console, which was used, not new, in 1994, is better than a brand new A & H 2800?
Title: APB Dynasonics Spectra series
Post by: Mac Kerr on July 13, 2010, 12:17:26 am
chris johnson wrote on Tue, 13 July 2010 00:01

im not tryin to be a dick or anything, but that photo says 1994 in the corner.

maybe im missing something, but that console, which was used, not new, in 1994, is better than a brand new A & H 2800?


The company that makes that console was not even in existence yet in 1994. Ya think the date may be wrong in the photo?

The APB Dynasonics Spectra series are very high quality analog consoles.

Mac
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tim Tyler on July 13, 2010, 12:37:51 am
Chris -

I didn't notice the date on the pic - it's really kinda comical. The bigger APB is a little over 4 yrs. old I think, not over 5 yrs.  

Here's a link to a revue with some good info:  

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/mv/msg/14583/0/40/ 4514/

I do not know the seller, other than by a good reputation on this forum.  

-Tim T
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: chris johnson on July 13, 2010, 02:39:19 am
ha!

that is funny

not familiar with them, and the photo isnt the best, and i saw the 94, and just assumed. oh well. you know what they say about ASS and U and ME

reading your link now. t y!
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Steve Payne on July 13, 2010, 09:57:08 am
Hi Chris,
 If you are not familiar with APB and you are getting ready to plunk down $$ for an analog console, you will do yourself a big favor by doing a little research.  There is a LOT of info here on the board.  I have owned numerous examples of both.  They are not even close to the same league.  
Happy shopping.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on July 13, 2010, 01:48:07 pm
GL 2800s are good. As are the similar Soundcrafts. Very respectable, easy to service, long lived and good quality.

The APBs are in the class above, the very best "affordable" analog consoles.

Look in the reviews section for a detailed discussion.

There are other options as well - particularly if you are looking at boards for the theater - but they were terribly expensive, and I think for the most part replaced by digital.

You would have to speak to high-end theater sound folks to get the lay of that land.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: chris johnson on July 13, 2010, 03:15:43 pm
so i might be able to convince the ole boss man to up the budget from 7 grand to 8ish grand.

i do not shop for anything of this price or nature online regularly. where would i go about finding one 2 buy?
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Dan Johnson on July 15, 2010, 08:47:08 pm
Right here is probably going to be your best bet.  There were some on here very recently.

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/f/14/22040/
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on July 16, 2010, 02:25:53 am
chris johnson wrote on Sun, 11 July 2010 17:17

so i think we are purchasing a 48 channel 2800 sometime this month where i work. cheapest i can find currently new is 6700ish.

i guess my question is, if you had 6700 to spend on a 48 channel FOH console, what would you buy? all signs for our current situation point to this board, but i am curious if there is anything out there i should be looking into.

thanks for your time in advance.


Basically what it comes down to is that you can either buy this console new for $6700, meet your needs, and have a warranty. Or buy something used and higher end, possibly VCA, and take your chances with repair. In the past I have bought nearly all of my personal consoles used to make my money go farther. But the GL2800 is very solid, I've mixed several national acts on that console  Very Happy
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: chris johnson on July 16, 2010, 02:42:49 am
im thinking that at this point, a warranty is a little more important to our business. down the road though, i can totally see where you guys are coming from.

thanks for all of your input so far everyone. its so great to come to a forum concerning anything that isnt clouded with BS Smile
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Steve Payne on July 16, 2010, 11:43:09 am
Chris,
 FWIW, I would not put too much emphasis on the value of a warranty on pro audio gear.  Well made analog consoles should easily give you 7 to 10 years of pretty much trouble free service.  I don't recall if riders are (or perhaps will be in your future?) part of your consideration.  I have found the  APB Spectra to be an acceptable substitute for one off dates for riders specing A level (the "M" word) analog consoles.  You definitely won't be able to go there with an A&H GL series console.  Just a thought.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: chris johnson on July 16, 2010, 02:00:43 pm
we deal with riders fairly often, but for the most part, what we have to deal with is fairly easy to accommodate so far. we just have been renting in a 48 channel verona if our little champ will not cut it.

damn you all. now i want a apb. wish i could find a 48 channel one used right now for cheap.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on July 16, 2010, 06:12:41 pm
chris johnson wrote on Fri, 16 July 2010 13:00

we deal with riders fairly often, but for the most part, what we have to deal with is fairly easy to accommodate so far. we just have been renting in a 48 channel verona if our little champ will not cut it.

damn you all. now i want a apb. wish i could find a 48 channel one used right now for cheap.


FWIW the Verona is not a VCA console and is fairly similar to the GL2800.

An A&H ML series console would be a step up from the GL series.
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Teri Hogan on July 17, 2010, 03:38:34 pm
Chris,
I'm the idiot who does not know how to set the date on my camera!  Very sorry about that.  And as to the quality of the photo, well, it's hard to photograph something that large in detail and I'm not much of a photographer, either.  I have PMd you about my Spectra-T, whose name, by the way, is Phil Spectra.  This desk is the best $8K you'll ever spend on a console!
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Andy Peters on July 17, 2010, 05:30:40 pm
Teri Hogan wrote on Sat, 17 July 2010 12:38

 I have PMd you about my Spectra-T, whose name, by the way, is Phil Spectra.


Does it have outrageous hair, and did it kill its girlfriend?

-a
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Doug Fowler on July 19, 2010, 09:33:32 am
Quote:

FWIW the Verona is not a VCA console


True.


Quote:

and is fairly similar to the GL2800.


Riiiiiight......  

Rolling Eyes
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: Silas Pradetto on July 19, 2010, 12:04:24 pm
Doug Fowler wrote on Mon, 19 July 2010 09:33



Quote:

and is fairly similar to the GL2800.


Riiiiiight......  

Rolling Eyes


Obviously, it has faders, knobs, and consumes electricity. Laughing
Title: Re: Allen & Heath GL2800
Post by: frank kayser on July 23, 2010, 02:48:28 pm
Uh...

Everyone does realize this is a 2006 thread, right?  Rolling Eyes

The undead are coming alive!  Twisted Evil