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Title: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Josh Edwards on July 20, 2008, 10:32:06 pm
    I am looking for recommendations on a small nursery monitor, preferably something that can be wall-mounted. I am currently using an assisted listening unit, amplified by small computer speakers. This is working fine for the moment, by not ok for long term use.
  I am looking for a speaker in the $200 range, nothing fancy, but it would be good to have its own volume control. I have looked at the Hotspots.. they would do the trick, but I would have to get some more money designated..
 Also, the nursery feed is ran over a shielded coax cable. Is this fine, or should something else be used?

In Christ,
Josh Edwards

_______________________
Media Dept
Bible Baptist Church
Wiscasset, Maine
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Jonathan Heimberg on July 21, 2008, 02:15:56 am
You may want to look into a 70volt system - possibly Bogen or similar.

The benefits would be: individual speaker volume control, expandability, and relatively low cost.

You would simply need an audio feed to the 70volt amp, and wiring to the speakers. You can get ceiling-tile mounted speakers or nearly any variety/shape/size you're looking for.

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Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Tom Young on July 21, 2008, 07:12:08 am
Hotspots are lousy speakers.

This "shielded coax cable", is it 2 conductor (plus shield) or one conductor (plus shield) ? If the later (and line level cable) then it may be noisy if it is far from the source. But it could be shielded speaker-level cable.

It is also not clear but appears to be the case that you need an amplifier plus a speaker or a selfpowered loudspeaker.

So: what type of cable is feeding the nursery (how many conductors plus shield and what gauge) ?

Do you have an amp or spare amp channel ?

What is the area of the nursery (width x length) ?
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Dan Kreider on July 21, 2008, 11:19:09 am
Tom Young wrote on Mon, 21 July 2008 07:12

hotspots are lousy speakers.


What do you mean by "lousy"?  Would they work for a monitor for the organ?  Someone recommended them to me.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Jonathan Heimberg on July 22, 2008, 06:36:46 am
If your definition of 'would they work' is 'do they make sound', then they'll work fine. I've worked with a piano and organ player that love them.

In reality, at stage levels (with a band), reproducing the range of an organ through one of those little things is just not going to happen, and it'll be ugly trying!

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Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Tom Young on July 22, 2008, 07:01:42 am
Despite their popularity, HotSpots are a flawed design. Because they employ two drivers that cover the same frequency range, they interact in a manner that results in very uneven frequency response (combfiltering) and this frequency response changes drastically as you move your head. It also changes drastically when you move the mic so if you EQ the HotSpot to reduce feedback with a specific mic, when the singer moves the mic the response has changed considerably and probably feeds back. They also have virtually no output below 250Hz and do not go up very high.

Why are they popular ? Because there is nothing else in that price range available. Any better design will incorporate a woofer, a tweeter (separate or coaxial) and a crossover. So up goes the cost.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Josh Edwards on July 23, 2008, 12:17:20 am
Ok..
Nursery is 16.5 feet by 20 feet.

The cable feeding it has the label 100% shielded coax. It has the copper center, braided layer, as well as foil.

The mixer in the sanctuary is self powered.
The cable had been running of the monitor feed, but I now am using that for the stage, not for the nursery.

A small, wall-mountable self powered speaker would be what I have in mind.. with the feed running from a output on the board (that is not amplified)
I am open to suggestions and ideas, and if more info is needed from me, or I did not give all the right info .. just let me know.. I will get it! Smile
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Tom Young on July 23, 2008, 05:55:13 am
Your budget is unrealistic if you want a pro quality loudspeaker. The cable is unbalanced, which is not good for this long a run. It could work (without picking up noise) but over time there could be noise problems.

I have a Mackie SRM150, which is overkill for your needs (as far as features and required output level) but it is a 5" fullrange driver with amp and small mixer (with balanced inputs) built in. Cost is over $300. which I consider to be very reasonable. I am mentioning this as an example of what a lower priced pro quality loudspeaker can cost.

Radio Shack may have an affordable powered compact loudspeaker which might (?) be better than the PC loudspeakers you are using. But it will not have a balanced input, necessary for the long cable run between the mixer and nursery.

So why not just stick with the PC loudspeakers ? You could add a limiter (to protect them) and an EQ (to mke them sound better). The system will still be unbalanced (although you could configure the EQ and limiter to balance this long line) but you won't waste money on a lousy replacement loudspeaker.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Jeff Ekstrand on July 23, 2008, 09:56:20 am
I agree with Tom, although you could also look used and try to find a pro calibre speaker for a low price... although sometimes those things arrive and they look like they've been beaten on the road, tossed on a truck, etc... probably because they have been.

The wire is less than ideal for what you're trying to do. As Tom said, you may be okay right now running your signal down that line. However, it will still be vulnerable to any noise from items of any kind that might get added in the future causing interference. This could be a microwave, a simple FM radio antenna, etc. You may not even know someone is adding the offending piece of metal, it may be completely out of your control.

Another thing to check out, and I'm wary of suggesting this as some will note it is completely out of my character, but you could look into the Behringer studio monitors. They have both balanced and unbalanced inputs, they look somewhat nice, and they'll interface with just about every pro piece of gear out there. If I'm not mistaken, they may not be far out of your price range.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Dennis Huff on July 25, 2008, 01:36:41 am
I have a silly question.  Is the a room for nursing mothers or a room where kids are watched and taught during the service?

If the later why not just provide copies of the message to the workers?  The same can be said of the mother who misses a portion of the service.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Josh Edwards on July 28, 2008, 09:23:58 pm
It is more of a nursing mother's nursery. The workers do enjoy hearing the service "live".

What kind of cabling would be recommended if this wire was to be replaced?

Thanks for all the help so far.. It is greatly appreciated!
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Tom Young on July 29, 2008, 06:42:05 am
If you intend to use powered loudspeakers, which accept line-level audio, then you need 2-conductor shielded cable. The source device should have a balanced output and the powered loudspeakers should have balanced inputs.

West Penn 292 is one good brand/model

If the cable is run in plenum space(s), use West Penn 25292B

I strongly suggest you read up on sound system design and installation. You can google (but be aware that there is a good amount of misinformation out there), you can search here on PSW and you can read the Study Hall (now called LSI University) articles here as a start.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Jerrybosun on August 01, 2008, 03:44:27 pm
I say have someone donate an older but high quality stereo system (amp and speakers)  run a line from your mixer or buy a short range transmitter. This should be more than enough for spoken word. I just picked up a stereo system for similar use at the church for the enclosed video booth...  CragisList $20, works like a champ!
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Kent Thompson on August 05, 2008, 05:57:13 pm
I realize I am not the one making this purchase but the 70v system sounds like a good idea to me. I have never priced these out so I would have no idea if they fit in your budget or not. What I like about it? The speakers are built into the ceiling or wall. There are no cords hanging out to pull out, trip over or that little kids could grab and be electrocuted with if they put it in their mouth. No speaker cones showing that kids will stick their fingers, toys or other items in and ruin. You could put in a wall plate with a volume control that the workers could adjust that the kids could not reach.
Title: Re: Nursery Monitor
Post by: Jesse Prater on August 25, 2008, 07:19:06 pm
What about using the existing coax to send modulated video from a camera/soundboard to the nursery?  As long as the run isn't too long, a $30 Wal-mart modulator will do the job, and you can hit Craigslist for cheap/free cameras and TV's if no one has one to donate.  Just a thought . . .