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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => Lighting Forum => Topic started by: Alain Bouit on April 15, 2019, 03:40:43 pm

Title: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Alain Bouit on April 15, 2019, 03:40:43 pm
I'm new to lighting, sorry for the newbee question.

Our church is planning to install a new DMX lighting board to control 20 LED light fixtures. They want to be able to have a preset panel on the wall to switch on the stage lights in case the AV person is not available. Basically a push button system that would turn on some lights without having to use the DMX light control in the AV booth in the back. How would I build that in to the system?

abouit
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Dave Garoutte on April 15, 2019, 04:33:38 pm
I'm new to lighting, sorry for the newbee question.

Our church is planning to install a new DMX lighting board to control 20 LED light fixtures. They want to be able to have a preset panel on the wall to switch on the stage lights in case the AV person is not available. Basically a push button system that would turn on some lights without having to use the DMX light control in the AV booth in the back. How would I build that in to the system?

abouit

You need to change to your real name to get a response on this forum, as stated in the rules.
Then We'll be happy to chime in.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Alain Bouit on April 15, 2019, 05:46:19 pm

Sorry about that
>>I'm new to lighting, sorry for the newbee question.

>>Our church is planning to install a new DMX lighting board to control 20 LED light fixtures. They want to be able to have a preset panel on the wall to switch on the stage lights in case the AV person is not available. Basically a push button system that would turn on some lights without having to use the DMX light control in the AV booth in the back. How would I build that in to the system?

Alain Bouit
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Dave Garoutte on April 15, 2019, 08:09:51 pm
I'm don't know of a way to do what you describe.
You may need to have some lights on a second controller.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: John Fruits on April 15, 2019, 09:35:54 pm
There are lots of possibilities.  Have you decided on a console?  Are you buying thru a full service dealer?  Will that dealer install and train your staff?
If you just want a simple button station, take a look at the Doug Fleenor ES2 (http://www.dfd.com/es2.html).  They also have more advanced controllers too.
Another option would be Pathway Connectivity Controllers (https://www.pathwayconnect.com/index.php/products/dmx-show-controllers-and-consoles) like the Vignette or NSB.  The Pathway staff are known for being very helpful.
If you are going with ETC for your console there are lots of architectural options.  Perhaps the simplest would be the Inspire (http://www.etcconnect.com/Products/Architectural-Systems/Paradigm/Inspire-Stations/Features.aspx).
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Scott Hofmann on April 16, 2019, 12:03:22 am
I'm new to lighting, sorry for the newbee question.

Our church is planning to install a new DMX lighting board to control 20 LED light fixtures. They want to be able to have a preset panel on the wall to switch on the stage lights in case the AV person is not available. Basically a push button system that would turn on some lights without having to use the DMX light control in the AV booth in the back. How would I build that in to the system?

abouit

A standalone go-to for what you want to do is the Fleenor PRE10A 10-button preset controller. It goes in the DMX line (daisy-chains) between your console and your dimmers or LED fixtures. When you power up your console, the preset controller is locked out. When you turn off the power to your console, the preset controller is active. You set up what scene/lights you want for each button on your console, press a recessed "Record" switch in the preset controller and then the button you want to record. Repeat 9 more times or 8 if you want to keep the 10th button for "Off" . The Springtree SM-8 works similarly and is a lot cheaper. I've installed many PRE10A's but never actually used the SM-8 (half the price). did.com and springtree.net
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Erik Jerde on April 16, 2019, 08:13:55 am
The Fleenor PRE10A is the way to go for single universe applications.  I like the pathway vignettes for more complex systems where sacn is in use because it’ll do multiple universes and using priority it’s easy to have it automatically disable when the console is on.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Scott Hofmann on April 16, 2019, 11:27:21 am
The Fleenor PRE10A is the way to go for single universe applications.  I like the pathway vignettes for more complex systems where sacn is in use because it’ll do multiple universes and using priority it’s easy to have it automatically disable when the console is on.
Fleenor has recently come out with the PRE10E-A. Four universes with sACN in a 2-gang plate.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Dave Garoutte on April 16, 2019, 03:23:30 pm
Huh, I had no idea.  Very cool solutions for that specific issue.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Alain Bouit on April 16, 2019, 06:20:24 pm
Thanks for all the suggestions, I'm going to check out the Fleenor PRE10E-A's.

So today we have 4 x Altman 1k Fresnels and 8 x PAR 64 that we plan to replace with 20 Chauvey slimPAR pros or something similiar. In addition we will be adding 6 LED chandeliers with 0-10v dimming capabilities. Haven't decided on what light board we should buy yet. I'm thinking we don't need more than a 1 Universe device. I'm linking a physical device as opposed to a PC.

Alain Bouit
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Cailen Waddell on April 16, 2019, 09:57:58 pm
Thanks for all the suggestions, I'm going to check out the Fleenor PRE10E-A's.

So today we have 4 x Altman 1k Fresnels and 8 x PAR 64 that we plan to replace with 20 Chauvey slimPAR pros or something similiar. In addition we will be adding 6 LED chandeliers with 0-10v dimming capabilities. Haven't decided on what light board we should buy yet. I'm thinking we don't need more than a 1 Universe device. I'm linking a physical device as opposed to a PC.

Alain Bouit

You’ll want to get rid of the PARs sooner than later.... you may of heard that the lamps are no longer being manufactured. Existing stock is all that’s left, so very soon, you will not be able to get lamps.   


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Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Erik Jerde on April 17, 2019, 09:21:27 am
Fleenor has recently come out with the PRE10E-A. Four universes with sACN in a 2-gang plate.

Cool, thanks for the info!
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Magnus Högkvist on April 17, 2019, 03:08:53 pm
I'm new to lighting, sorry for the newbee question.

Our church is planning to install a new DMX lighting board to control 20 LED light fixtures. They want to be able to have a preset panel on the wall to switch on the stage lights in case the AV person is not available. Basically a push button system that would turn on some lights without having to use the DMX light control in the AV booth in the back. How would I build that in to the system?

abouit

What You want is a DMX merger with priority something like this https://www.elclighting.com/products/dt125/. Connect Light console to A and a wallmount dmx controller to B. When console (connected to A) is powerd off, the controller on B can controll the lights.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Nathan Riddle on April 17, 2019, 04:01:11 pm
Cheapest solution will be a dmxking edin4 box.

You can record a snapshot (and recently multiple) and recall via power cycle.

Switching presets (one lights-on and one lights-off) might take some more research.

They can also do dmx merging ltp htp etc ...
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Scott Hofmann on April 17, 2019, 06:22:08 pm
What You want is a DMX merger with priority something like this https://www.elclighting.com/products/dt125/. Connect Light console to A and a wallmount dmx controller to B. When console (connected to A) is powerd off, the controller on B can controll the lights.
Since this is exactly how the Fleenor PRE10A works (see posts above), why spend more money to buy a merger?
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: John Fruits on April 17, 2019, 08:29:43 pm
If you are looking for a lower budget solution, you might consider the Northlight Systems MERGE (http://northlightdmx.com/dmx512merge.htm)
I was curious about those 0-10v chandeliers, will you have a separate controller for them?
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Alain Bouit on April 18, 2019, 04:51:31 pm
If you are looking for a lower budget solution, you might consider the Northlight Systems MERGE (http://northlightdmx.com/dmx512merge.htm)
I was curious about those 0-10v chandeliers, will you have a separate controller for them?

No the plan is to control the chandeliers with the DMX board and DMX wall switch. I would have to have a device that converts DMX signal into 0-10v to be able to dim the chandeliers.

Alain Bouit
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: John Fruits on April 18, 2019, 05:36:52 pm
I don't know if you noticed but Northlight also has a DMX>0-10v converter.  http://northlightdmx.com/dmx512decoder.htm.
DFD and Pathway also have such devices but the Northlight is a lot cheaper, but might require more work on your part.
There are also a lot of people building dmx gizmos using Arduino, if you know someone who knows Adruino. LOL
Even ETC speaks Arduino, sort of with the https://shop.etcconnect.com/lighthack-box-1/.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Alain Bouit on November 07, 2019, 09:00:59 pm
Our church finally made the purchase of the 0-10v dimmable LED Chandeliers (Crenshaw Lighting Artisan Iona Pendant) https://www.crenshawlighting.com/products/artisan-iona-lantern-pendant-pes-8201-8202/
So I'm back to trying to finalize the light control situation. I've made a diagram with I think is some of the recommendations in this post. Could someone check to make I'm not doing something that is impossible?
I have attached a diagram to this post.

Thanks
Alain Bouit
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Scott Hofmann on November 08, 2019, 09:16:31 am
Our church finally made the purchase of the 0-10v dimmable LED Chandeliers (Crenshaw Lighting Artisan Iona Pendant) https://www.crenshawlighting.com/products/artisan-iona-lantern-pendant-pes-8201-8202/
So I'm back to trying to finalize the light control situation. I've made a diagram with I think is some of the recommendations in this post. Could someone check to make I'm not doing something that is impossible?
I have attached a diagram to this post.

Thanks
Alain Bouit

It looks like you are going from Ethernet sACN out of your ChamSys into the Fleenor PRE10E-A, but the Fleenor only re-transmits the sACN and does not convert it to DMX which is what you need for the input of the ETC DMX to analog decoder and all of your LED fixtures. You would have to add an Ethernet to DMX gateway after the Fleenor to get DMX out.
If you can get by with one universe of DMX (512 DMX addresses), then come out of the DMX output of the ChamSys and get a Fleenor PRE10A (with DMX in and out) instead of the PRE10E-A. It will be a lot less expensive.

Also, DMX is a daisy-chain unless you incorporate a DMX splitter. You can't/shouldn't essentially "Y" out of the Fleenor box. So in a revised diagram with DMX out of the ChamSys and a PRE10A, it has to go from out of console to input of Fleenor box, then out of Fleenor box to input of ETC decoder, then out of decoder to input of LED fixture #1, then out of LED fixture #1 to LED fixture #2, etc.

Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Scott Hofmann on November 08, 2019, 09:58:38 am
Also remember that you will need to incorporate a power supply for the Fleenor box!
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Alain Bouit on November 08, 2019, 10:55:31 am
Also remember that you will need to incorporate a power supply for the Fleenor box!

Thanks so much for all the great technical help. Much appreciated! I'll post an update on how it goes.
Title: Re: DMX lighting bypass DMX Wall Controller
Post by: Scott Hofmann on November 13, 2019, 05:28:15 pm
Thanks so much for all the great technical help. Much appreciated! I'll post an update on how it goes.

You might make certain the UFR2-LV can drive however many of the chandeliers you are going to use.
From the ETC cut sheet: "Independent control for 0-10V fluorescent ballasts and/or LED drivers, each (of the two outputs) is capable of sinking 100mA".
What is the milliamp requirement for each of your fixtures? Just a thought. I've never dealt with LED 0-10v dimming.