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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => AC Power and Grounding => Topic started by: Art Nadelman on April 27, 2018, 02:43:03 pm

Title: IP65 Questions
Post by: Art Nadelman on April 27, 2018, 02:43:03 pm
I'm new to the world of IP65.  I just purchased my first IP65-rated Chauvet lights.  It's nice that they're IP65-rated, but they come with a power cord with an Edison plug on one end, therefore I'd have to plug it into an Edison receptacle at that end. 

So my question is, how do I make everything on stage IP-65 safe, at least outlets and connections for Edison cords?

Thanks.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Jeremy Young on April 27, 2018, 07:21:14 pm
Hi Art, I'm not much more seasoned on IP65 but I've been doing a lot of research myself for my next lighting upgrade so hopefully this is helpful. 

The Neutrik PowerCon True1 connectors would be a good place to start.  It's a locking, 16A, waterproof mains connector that connects in series (like a typical extension cord, male to female) as opposed to the conventional powercon connectors that require couplers to join lengths. 

As for "waterproof edison", I believe that's an oxymoron to the best of my knowledge.  There are outlets available with spring-loaded gasketed covers to keep unused receptacles protected, but once you open that cover to plug in your NEMA5-15P, I don't know as there's a reliable way to keep moisture out of that connection (but I'm happy to be corrected on this by someone more knowledgeable on the topic). 

Removing the edison connector and replacing it with a True1 connector would get you started.  I can't speak to why they ship it with that cord.  Making "everything on stage IP65 safe" might be a big task, and may or may not be really required.  In my mind, I want my (future) downstage wash lights to be IP65 since they have to be in front of the stage to be effective, putting them out from under the protection of the stage roof.  My upstage lighting will always be behind the performers, so for the gigs I do should be safe from rain etc. 

I don't know of too many IP65 musicians, guitar amps, or pedalboards... once things get that bad, I don't know as the show would really continue, at least in my neck of the woods. YMMV.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Cailen Waddell on April 27, 2018, 10:01:19 pm
I'm new to the world of IP65.  I just purchased my first IP65-rated Chauvet lights.  It's nice that they're IP65-rated, but they come with a power cord with an Edison plug on one end, therefore I'd have to plug it into an Edison receptacle at that end. 

So my question is, how do I make everything on stage IP-65 safe, at least outlets and connections for Edison cords?

Thanks.

Why do you want everything IP-65 rated?  I think you may be looking the wrong direction if youíre trying to make things safe...  and I wonder, safe in what sort of weather?   

What are your goals?  Perhaps that will help get you more concrete advice.


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Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Art Nadelman on April 28, 2018, 06:27:38 am

What are your goals?  Perhaps that will help get you more concrete advice.


I'm really talking about outlets.  Here in Florida, a storm can pop up in the summer at anytime.  I work a lot of performances where the band is on an open stage outside.  I'm just looking to make sure that if it pours, that if there's a better way to keep the electric connections safe for when the show starts back, that I'm doing all that I can/should.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Tim McCulloch on April 28, 2018, 10:29:59 am
The purpose of IP ratings is to determine what level of environmental water intrusion will be prevented.  It's more about the protection of the connection or device so it will live to work another day than it's about proximate personnel safety.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Cailen Waddell on April 28, 2018, 10:38:16 am
I'm really talking about outlets.  Here in Florida, a storm can pop up in the summer at anytime.  I work a lot of performances where the band is on an open stage outside.  I'm just looking to make sure that if it pours, that if there's a better way to keep the electric connections safe for when the show starts back, that I'm doing all that I can/should.

Even if your gear was somehow completely waterproof, the amps and drums and backline and snake and mics arenít...

I think the best protection is GFCI outlets on all stage power, waterproof ip65 gear is great for up in a stage roof.  On the deck, keep stageboxes and AC elevated from pooling water...  when there is a storm coming, tarp and strap, shut down power.  When the storm has passed and you have your 30 minute lightning clear, dry it off and start back up.

If you are following safe storm procedures, a storm with lightning is going to shut you down 60 minutes... 


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Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Art Nadelman on April 28, 2018, 01:46:18 pm
On the deck, keep stageboxes and AC elevated from pooling water...  when there is a storm coming, tarp and strap, shut down power.  When the storm has passed and you have your 30 minute lightning clear, dry it off and start back up.

If you are following safe storm procedures, a storm with lightning is going to shut you down 60 minutes... 


Pretty much what I've been doing.  Just wanted to make sure there wasn't anything more I should do.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Lyle Williams on April 29, 2018, 02:27:43 am
Some DMX lights get installed for architectural illumination, used for weeks on end as part of popular "festival of lights" type events.

I have seen a few things used (not by me, just looking at others work) including True1, weatherproof construction connectors, and just lots of self-amalgamating tape.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Jonathan Johnson on April 30, 2018, 06:18:40 pm
Consider equipping your distros with weather-resistant receptacles.

While they aren't waterproof, they can reduce the amount of incidental water intrusion.

The caveat is that "weather Resistant Receptacles offer protection from rain, snow, ice, moisture, and humidity when properly installed in an approved weather protective or while-in-use cover." So you still need to protect them from rain. The "while-in-use" covers usually must be mounted in a certain orientation.

Example: Eaton Weather Resistant Duplex Receptacles (http://www.cooperindustries.com/content/public/en/wiring_devices/products/receptacles/residential/tamper_weather_resistant/weather_resistant_duplex_receptacles_twr270.html)
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Daniel Levi on May 01, 2018, 03:40:17 am
And there are always the European IEC60309 16/32/63A connectors wich whilst sort of bulky are waterproof, robust and designed to be outside on a permanent basis.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: David Buckley on May 01, 2018, 11:39:27 pm
The IEC60309 (CEEFORM) connectors usually encountered are IP44, which is adequate for use in outdoor wet conditions.  If you can find "Tourmate" connectors they are good for theatre / stage / RnR as they are mostly black rather than mostly blue.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Lyle Williams on May 06, 2018, 03:57:45 am
What would your city use if they had to install an outdoor power receptical?  In Australia, it would probably be something from the Clipsal 56xxxx range.

What would your city use, and is this an acceptable choice for your lights?

Power outdoors is a very old problem space.
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Jeff Robinson on May 13, 2018, 01:53:49 pm
I'm new to the world of IP65.  I just purchased my first IP65-rated Chauvet lights.  It's nice that they're IP65-rated, but they come with a power cord with an Edison plug on one end, therefore I'd have to plug it into an Edison receptacle at that end. 

So my question is, how do I make everything on stage IP-65 safe, at least outlets and connections for Edison cords?

Thanks.

While not IP65, these are Nema 4X and 6P (better than IP65, IIRC between IP66 and 67):
http://ecatalog.hubbell-wiring.com/productinformation/specsheets/3A/Live/PDF/HBL60W33D_cart.pdf
Matching plug required for this rating:
http://ecatalog.hubbell-wiring.com/productinformation/specsheets/3A/Live/PDF/HBL14W33A_cart.pdf

Hubbell is not the only one, Leviton, Woodhead (now part of Molex) and Erickson also do this.

Compatible with regular molded edison, but not watertight unless both male and female are employed.

HTH,

Jeff Robinson
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: Jeremy Young on May 14, 2018, 04:21:22 pm
On a related note, just saw this announced today: Neutrik Debuts True Outdoor Protection Series (https://www.prosoundnetwork.com/gear-and-technology/neutrik-debuts-true-outdoor-protection-series)
Title: Re: IP65 Questions
Post by: John Fruits on May 17, 2018, 12:19:16 pm
One other point of interesting relating to IP65 moving lights is the exclusion of dust and debris.  That should reduce maintenance problems for outdoor use.