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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => Wireless and Communications => Topic started by: David A. Pierce on January 21, 2016, 01:53:42 pm

Title: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: David A. Pierce on January 21, 2016, 01:53:42 pm
Can anyone recommend a wireless headset that has a mic and ear bud monitor. Body pack and the whole setup.
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Pete Erskine on January 21, 2016, 02:22:35 pm
Can anyone recommend a wireless headset that has a mic and ear bud monitor. Body pack and the whole setup.

What for-Singer with in ear, monitor or comms?

For comms I use a  Sensaphonics TC1000 (http://www.sensaphonics.com/tc-1000-custom-intercom-earset) - pix below.  Molded in ear and nice mic all in one.

For a pack for singer and ear monitor - no one yet makes it in one piece - transmitter and in ear monitor.

Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: David A. Pierce on January 21, 2016, 02:26:52 pm
Can anyone recommend a wireless headset that has a mic and ear bud monitor. Body pack and the whole setup.
Thank you for the info sir
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Samuel Sjöbergsson on January 21, 2016, 04:22:11 pm
For singers with iem dpa has a few variants at http://www.dpamicrophones.com/mic-finder?filteroption=384&searchtext=In-Ear but they still need two bodypacks

Skickat från min GT-I9505 via Tapatalk

Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: MikeHarris on February 21, 2016, 05:18:34 am
I have asked Sennheiser's chief wireless engineer for a 1 rackspace integrated IEM Tx and Rx in one chassis with compatible frequency co-ordination and in typical German fashion he replied "Why would you want that ?". I shook my head and his hand and said Thank You.
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Simon Conway-Smith on November 19, 2018, 05:13:42 am
I too am looking for a single wireless bodypack unit that has separate & independent channels transmitter (for headworn mic) and receiver (for in-ear monitor), and the corresponding base station (sound desk) unit. This is to allow a performers (guitar & vocal) to be truly wireless. I already have the Samson AirLine AG1 Guitar wireless system for them.

Can anyone recommend a wireless headset that has a mic and ear bud monitor. Body pack and the whole setup.
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Russell Ault on November 19, 2018, 02:06:57 pm
I have asked Sennheiser's chief wireless engineer for a 1 rackspace integrated IEM Tx and Rx in one chassis with compatible frequency co-ordination and in typical German fashion he replied "Why would you want that ?" [...]

I suspect the reason he's sceptical is because, from an RF standpoint, this is actually a pretty tricky problem. Putting a transmitter near a receiver typically causes the receiver to desens and have reception issues. On the rack side this can be solved with proper antenna placement (although at that point your antenna rig takes up enough space that the 1U form factor is pretty moot); on the performer side things start to get tricky, especially if you want diversity reception for your IEMs (which you do).

The Telex BTR approach to this problem was to leave ~100 MHz between the RX and TX frequencies and then use filtering to reduce desens to manageable levels, but with available spectrum reductions this has gotten a lot harder. A shared antenna on the beltpack and a circulator would theoretically work, but you'd again lose diversity reception (and circulators tend to be delicate and expensive).

Probably the best solution is the most common: put a large bag of meat between the RX and TX beltpacks to attenuate the TX signal at the IEM RX. Of course, this means using a single beltpacks for both isn't possible.

Basically, as I understand it, what you're looking for doesn't exist because of physics...

-Russ
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Jerome Malsack on November 20, 2018, 09:24:14 am
True but with the 1/4 wave rule you will only need 8 inchs in uhf to have the separation between the transmitter and receiver.  You can add in the body of the talent to help by placing the IEM high left side breast pocket or area.  and the typical wireless mic on the back right side like the guitar player.   Then setup the antenna for the FOH in the correct places.  receivers antenna around the back line and the IEM from the FOH  front of stage onto the stage. 
 
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Jean-Pierre Coetzee on November 20, 2018, 01:55:10 pm
True but with the 1/4 wave rule you will only need 8 inchs in uhf to have the separation between the transmitter and receiver.  You can add in the body of the talent to help by placing the IEM high left side breast pocket or area.  and the typical wireless mic on the back right side like the guitar player.   Then setup the antenna for the FOH in the correct places.  receivers antenna around the back line and the IEM from the FOH  front of stage onto the stage.

I believe this is exactly what Russell said. The issue is TX and RX in one pack. In some countries this is feasible. We for instance have the 600 MHz and 800 MHz available which means you can put one in each band and filter the RX to exclude the other however in the USA you will probably need one to run digital VHF and the other in the available UHF band and even then you will need to run at pretty low power.
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: Henry Cohen on November 20, 2018, 10:05:25 pm
The issue is TX and RX in one pack. In some countries this is feasible.

Let's not forget that wireless intercom has been doing this for years, the Telex BTR being the obvious example. In the UHF BTR-800, band separation is just under 100MHz; in the VHF BTR-300, separation was as little as 36MHz.


Quote
We for instance have the 600 MHz and 800 MHz available which means you can put one in each band and filter the RX to exclude the other however in the USA you will probably need one to run digital VHF and the other in the available UHF band and even then you will need to run at pretty low power.

Why digital VHF?

No question putting both a very high audio quality transmitter and receiver in one small-ish pack is a challenging effort, and one that is being pursued. A couple of paradigm shifts are coming.
Title: Re: wireless mic and in ear monitor combo
Post by: MikeHarris on November 24, 2018, 10:15:45 am
I suspect the reason he's sceptical is because, from an RF standpoint, this is actually a pretty tricky problem. Putting a transmitter near a receiver typically causes the receiver to desens and have reception issues. On the rack side this can be solved with proper antenna placement (although at that point your antenna rig takes up enough space that the 1U form factor is pretty moot);

Probably the best solution is the most common: put a large bag of meat between the RX and TX beltpacks to attenuate the TX signal at the IEM RX. Of course, this means using a single beltpacks for both isn't possible.

Basically, as I understand it, what you're looking for doesn't exist because of physics...

-Russ

I was only looking at the rack side...not the meat side of the system. I felt a little DSP management of tx & rx frequencies might be handy