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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => Lighting Forum => Topic started by: Rob Spence on June 14, 2015, 04:33:59 pm

Title: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Spence on June 14, 2015, 04:33:59 pm
So, my sound jobs sometimes need lights. For a while I got by with a few tripods (crank or push up) and some t-bars. Next, a couple of 10' "dj" I-beam truss on stands helped out. Now I am faced with needing a little longer span than 10' which I believe moves me to triangle or square truss.

I would only be hanging about a dozen LED fixtures, for example Blizzard Pucks so that would give some example of loading. I am not going to grow to the point of adding a huge amount of lighting. I am not that young. So, I want to spend conservatively otherwise I will never pay it off.

I am sure square truss is best but triangle may suffice and be less expensive.

I expect that a set of sections that get me over a 20' stage is more than enough. I thought a pair of 8' and a 6' would be most versatile though I suppose other combinations might be even better.

In my research to date, I see triangle with apex up and down. I have seen (though I didn't see any today) stand adapters for apex down though most seem to place it up or be expecting square truss.

So, I am looking for a little education as well as specific suggestions and even offers of gear should it be available at a price I can afford.

As usual, thank you all for your time.

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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Tim Weaver on June 14, 2015, 06:25:32 pm
The next step up would probably be a 20+ foot span front truss with a little overhang on each end to rig PA from. Use global crank stands in the lift capacity that you need.

Imagine this, but with speakers on each end.
(http://new.globaltruss.com/images/products/100313-4000PAK.jpg)

I would go ahead and get 12" square truss. Triangle is fine, but is harder to stack and rig and even carry around. It just isn't very convenient!

I have 12" square global spigot end truss. But if you think you may need more trussing on occasion, I would get plated (bolt together) truss. It's easier to cross rent.

For rear lighting you can either do without, or use your current tripods.





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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Tim Weaver on June 14, 2015, 06:31:58 pm
2 eight footers and 2 six footers is probably a good start. Gives you plenty of flexibility for stage width, and for towers if you want to stand them up.

A great package would be 4 eights, 2 six's and four or six bases to make towers with. Plus a pair of crank stands to get your rig in the air.


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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Spence on June 14, 2015, 06:50:10 pm
I see I missed a bit of explanation. This would be for upstage (rear) lighting.
I have no current plans to fly speakers and to date, a pair of t-bars on tripods front (downstage) left & right work fine.

I really am trying to spend as little as I can. I don't get much revenue from it.

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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Cailen Waddell on June 14, 2015, 07:15:09 pm
Applied electronics has a 6" triangle truss that given the low loads you seem to be intending to place on it, could be very economical...  Apex up or down depends on manufacturer recommendations and load capacity.  It can make a difference.   

A couple crank stands, global truss tends to be cheapest but applied makes a steel 11' crank.  It's heavy, but well built, and all steel means issues can be addressed by a good welder. 


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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Scott Wagner on June 14, 2015, 11:04:19 pm
Applied electronics has a 6" triangle truss...
I think you mean 8", or am I missing something?
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Cailen Waddell on June 14, 2015, 11:05:17 pm
Could be...  Use it, never measured.  A local company I work with has it.  I new it was applied wasn't 100% on the dimension.


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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Mark Cadwallader on June 14, 2015, 11:19:16 pm
Rob, since Global and similar "euro truss" is based on metric, not "inch" scale, I have mostly 2m sections, and 2 x 1 meter sections. 2 meters is about 6.5', so 3 meters is just under 10'. Three 2 meter sections and two 1 meter sections give you a neat bundle of four 2 meter lengths, which fit into vehicles pretty well. I use the ST-132 crank stands, and recently put 13 meters of truss with LED fixtures up in a ballroom (to maintain sightlines) and it worked pretty slick. 36" pipe and drape made a neat triangle to hide and guard the tripod legs.
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Brian Jojade on June 16, 2015, 04:17:53 pm
If you get mounting brackets for apex up triangle truss, square truss will also fit in the same brackets.

The downside of apex up (pun intended) is that your lights are not going to be centered on the load of the truss.  Depending on the stands you use, this may or may not be an issue.  Note that square truss has the same problem no matter what.  Hang a few lights on the front bar and a few on the back, and problem solved.

Personally, with triangle truss, I think it LOOKS better apex down.  I also think square truss looks better overall. However, that's just artistic opinion.  For a truss at the back of the stage, much less attention is focused on the  truss itself.

Triangle truss can be a little trickier to stack, but can take up less space in the truck, if stacked properly.  It's also going to be a little bit lighter per section. As long as it can handle the load and span you plan to use, it's probably your best choice.  Once you switch to triangle or square truss, you'll never want to use your iBeam stuff again!
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Justin Waters on June 17, 2015, 07:18:14 pm
I got these last summer to accomplish what you are trying to (at least I think).  2 meter global truss with 24"x24" steel baseplates.  There is a lot more flexibility when doing them this way for when you get weird stages that are super narrow or something. 
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Mark Cadwallader on June 17, 2015, 08:10:00 pm
If you get mounting brackets for apex up triangle truss, square truss will also fit in the same brackets.

The downside of apex up (pun intended) is that your lights are not going to be centered on the load of the truss.  Depending on the stands you use, this may or may not be an issue.  Note that square truss has the same problem no matter what.  Hang a few lights on the front bar and a few on the back, and problem solved.


With adjustable brackets I also have the option of moving the CofG more towards the centerline of the stands by moving the loaded chord towards the center. (The shift is about 5", which is pretty good for 12" truss.)  I don't know if anyone else has tried this; YMMV.  Be careful with overhead loads....
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Gow on June 18, 2015, 03:58:02 pm
I use a similar version of Aluminum triangle truss (I'm
In Canada) two 8' sections with ST-132 stands fits 11 Blizzard 3NX's nicely. I use 11 because then I can work off a center light when using alternating colors.

(http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z398/robare99/2F873EE4-2C65-4B4A-8B53-542E9DE408E4-9286-000006728CE92D01_zps447dff93.jpg)

(http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z398/robare99/06643E48-1C15-4677-A32C-60C7CDF2C08D-16744-00000BD5442B5598_zpsf09542cb.jpg)



Don't forget the safety cables.

;)
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Spence on June 18, 2015, 07:33:56 pm
I use a similar version of Aluminum triangle truss (I'm
In Canada) two 8' sections with ST-182 stands fits 11 Blizzard 3NX's nicely. I use 11 because then I can work off a center light when using alternating colors.

(http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z398/robare99/2F873EE4-2C65-4B4A-8B53-542E9DE408E4-9286-000006728CE92D01_zps447dff93.jpg)

(http://i1187.photobucket.com/albums/z398/robare99/06643E48-1C15-4677-A32C-60C7CDF2C08D-16744-00000BD5442B5598_zpsf09542cb.jpg)



Don't forget the safety cables.

;)

Those look like ST-132s


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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Gow on June 18, 2015, 09:03:14 pm
Those look like ST-132s


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Ah ok. I tried to find the equivalent. They are actually Players Choice DLC001

I'm Canadian, different market. Probably from the same factory in China.

http://www.axemusic.com/lighting/lighting-accessories/lighting-stands-truss/players-choice-dlc001-light-stand-13-180lbs-capacity-steel.html
Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Spence on June 19, 2015, 12:40:41 pm
Ah ok. I tried to find the equivalent. They are actually Players Choice DLC001

I'm Canadian, different market. Probably from the same factory in China.

http://www.axemusic.com/lighting/lighting-accessories/lighting-stands-truss/players-choice-dlc001-light-stand-13-180lbs-capacity-steel.html

ST132 is 13'2" with tripod legs
ST180 is 18" with outrigger legs


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Title: Re: Weekend warrior truss - education needed
Post by: Rob Gow on June 19, 2015, 01:20:01 pm
ST132 is 13'2" with tripod legs
ST180 is 18" with outrigger legs


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Ahhhhhh ok. The ST132 is the similar one. I was confused, these go to 13 feet as well.

The point was more the truss. It can be held up by whatever you choose.


Works great.