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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => LAB: The Classic Live Audio Board => Topic started by: Dave Aubuchon on February 21, 2015, 09:50:45 pm

Title: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Dave Aubuchon on February 21, 2015, 09:50:45 pm
Anybody know which model beta 98 Dave Rat uses on Flea's bass rig and how it's mounted?
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Vladimir Angelovski on February 21, 2015, 10:12:08 pm
Anybody know which model beta 98 Dave Rat uses on Flea's bass rig and how it's mounted?

(http://www.ratsound.com/cblog/uploads/bass.jpg)
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Dave Aubuchon on February 22, 2015, 01:56:07 am
(http://www.ratsound.com/cblog/uploads/bass.jpg)
Thanks Vladimir
Just what I was looking for. I searched and searched just couldn't find a close up shot of it.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: John L Nobile on February 22, 2015, 10:20:47 am
I've been looking at these for Tom mics. Will they survive being hit by sticks?
They look too fragile for that but I gotta ask before I rule them out.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Jim McKeveny on February 22, 2015, 11:02:06 am
Looks like some zip-ties holding the Shure factory 98 gooseneck assembly. Cool because it stays with the cabinet when cased and is ready when uncased.

Did this influence Dave's choice, or was a 98 the absolute right mic? Dunno. Often good engineering involves making things "hard to get wrong".

As for 98s/Beta 98s in general on toms, I have found the reliability meh, and they do eat up time when assembling/positioning.

In my experience, either of the Sennheiser Evolution Series tom mics set up faster, sound good faster, and can take stick impacts better than anything  I've seen. Fair price and fat warranty too.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Dave Aubuchon on February 22, 2015, 02:22:20 pm
I've been looking at these for Tom mics. Will they survive being hit by sticks?
They look too fragile for that but I gotta ask before I rule them out.
Your not going to find a mic with a smaller foot print. The only way a drummer should hit  one of these is either it was positioned wrong or the drummer was in the wrong line of work.

Not like the old days when we would use Sennheiser 421's on toms and by the end of the tour the top was beat to hell.   
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: gordonmcgregor on February 22, 2015, 02:33:44 pm
[quote
Not like the old days when we would use Sennheiser 421's on toms and by the end of the tour the top was beat to hell.
[/quote]
and there was a mile of lx tape holding them onto their clips and the casing together. Still have 2 or 3 of these pristine they ain't
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Dave Aubuchon on February 22, 2015, 02:40:58 pm
Looks like some zip-ties holding the Shure factory 98 gooseneck assembly. Cool because it stays with the cabinet when cased and is ready when uncased.

Did this influence Dave's choice, or was a 98 the absolute right mic? Dunno. Often good engineering involves making things "hard to get wrong".

As for 98s/Beta 98s in general on toms, I have found the reliability meh, and they do eat up time when assembling/positioning.

In my experience, either of the Sennheiser Evolution Series tom mics set up faster, sound good faster, and can take stick impacts better than anything  I've seen. Fair price and fat warranty too.
I have read Dave likes small condenser mics. He uses the Beta 98AD/C on toms, hi-hat and sometime even for top Snare mic.
As far as flea's bass that is the mic he prefers. He's not doing Soundgarden anymore but when he was he used the 98 on Shepherd's rig. The new tech Ted Keedick liked the sound of it so much he uses it as well.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Keith Broughton on February 22, 2015, 03:31:33 pm
I've been looking at these for Tom mics. Will they survive being hit by sticks?
They look too fragile for that but I gotta ask before I rule them out.
Work well on toms and can take a hit.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Vladimir Angelovski on February 22, 2015, 08:12:48 pm
I have read Dave likes small condenser mics. He uses the Beta 98AD/C on toms, hi-hat and sometime even for top Snare mic.
As far as flea's bass that is the mic he prefers. He's not doing Soundgarden anymore but when he was he used the 98 on Shepherd's rig. The new tech Ted Keedick liked the sound of it so much he uses it as well.

The previous photo IS the mic on Flea's bass cabinet, taken from Dave Rat's blog from some time ago.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Erik Jerde on February 22, 2015, 11:27:48 pm
I've been looking at these for Tom mics. Will they survive being hit by sticks?
They look too fragile for that but I gotta ask before I rule them out.

I suppose it depends on the hit and if it was the first one or just the latest in a succession.  I used them for a few years in club land and they lasted.  That said, they are so small that if they are getting hit either you are placing them wrong or the drummer has terrible accuracy.  You should be able to assess the second by looking at the drum head and then make your mic choice from what you see.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Tim Weaver on February 23, 2015, 06:20:18 pm
I suppose it depends on the hit and if it was the first one or just the latest in a succession.  I used them for a few years in club land and they lasted.  That said, they are so small that if they are getting hit either you are placing them wrong or the drummer has terrible accuracy.  You should be able to assess the second by looking at the drum head and then make your mic choice from what you see.


I'll never understand why people are so afraid of their mics getting hit! In 20 years I could count the mic hits by drummers on 1 hand. And that includes hundreds or maybe thousands of crappy club-level bands! For years I used 57's on toms too!
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Ray Aberle on February 23, 2015, 09:30:30 pm

I'll never understand why people are so afraid of their mics getting hit! In 20 years I could count the mic hits by drummers on 1 hand. And that includes hundreds or maybe thousands of crappy club-level bands! For years I used 57's on toms too!

For what it's worth, a buddy of mine has an SM57 with a fork taped to the top of it. He uses it for snare drums. Fork's taken a beating, but the mic looks great still!

-Ray
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: John L Nobile on February 23, 2015, 10:46:37 pm

I'll never understand why people are so afraid of their mics getting hit! In 20 years I could count the mic hits by drummers on 1 hand. And that includes hundreds or maybe thousands of crappy club-level bands! For years I used 57's on toms too!
Years ago I bought 4 akg mics. Little condensers that looked like mini D112s and they sounded great in rehearsals. Drummer broke one on opening night and another one a week later. The other 2 lasted almost a year.
So yes, I'm very concerned about them being hit.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Rob Spence on February 23, 2015, 11:58:13 pm
Years ago I bought 4 akg mics. Little condensers that looked like mini D112s and they sounded great in rehearsals. Drummer broke one on opening night and another one a week later. The other 2 lasted almost a year.
So yes, I'm very concerned about them being hit.

Maybe tell the drummer not to hit it?
Or, don't put it where the sticks go?

Or, get a drummer that knows where his drums are?

Have the drummer buy the mics he wants to use. I bet he won't hit them then.


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Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Erik Jerde on February 24, 2015, 12:00:39 am
Have the drummer buy the mics he wants to use. I bet he won't hit them then.

Not a bad idea if you can pull it off - or a "you break it you buy it."  Not uncommon for mic stands and vocal mics.  Only really works in clubland if the band is getting paid and you can subtract it from their payout.

Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: John L Nobile on February 24, 2015, 12:15:42 am
It's not like I painted a bullseye on the mics lol. He's reading charts, real busy ones,  so his eyes aren't on his kit. I didn't blame him. Shit happens and it wasn't my dime. I think I got replacements for the first two but then the show closed and the money dried up. That was an expensive short run.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Jeremy Young on February 26, 2015, 10:13:34 pm
Looks like some zip-ties holding the Shure factory 98 gooseneck assembly. Cool because it stays with the cabinet when cased and is ready when uncased.

Did this influence Dave's choice, or was a 98 the absolute right mic? Dunno. Often good engineering involves making things "hard to get wrong".

As for 98s/Beta 98s in general on toms, I have found the reliability meh, and they do eat up time when assembling/positioning.

In my experience, either of the Sennheiser Evolution Series tom mics set up faster, sound good faster, and can take stick impacts better than anything  I've seen. Fair price and fat warranty too.






I've had the screens pop out after a stick hit on the sennheiser e604's; the e904's wouldn't have this problem.  my shre pg56's and beta56's all have stick dents in the metal.....maybe it's just the drummers i work with but they seem to hit them all the time.


i still remember watching my friend set up a live recording rig on a live band.  as he mounted his akg c414's above the toms he kept reminding the drummer that if he were ever going to hit one of his mic's, tonight was not the night!
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Tom Burgess on February 27, 2015, 05:14:32 pm
I've been looking at these for Tom mics. Will they survive being hit by sticks?
They look too fragile for that but I gotta ask before I rule them out.
The specific model to look for is Beta98-AMP.  Shure came out with this version 3 years ago (if memory serves) for this specific application and they are fantastic.  You can buy them individually or in 3-packs.

http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/beta/beta98amp-miniature-cardioid-drum-microphone

 
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: brian maddox on February 27, 2015, 05:27:13 pm
The specific model to look for is Beta98-AMP.  Shure came out with this version 3 years ago (if memory serves) for this specific application and they are fantastic.  You can buy them individually or in 3-packs.

http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/beta/beta98amp-miniature-cardioid-drum-microphone

 

never seen those before.  those are cool...
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: John L Nobile on February 27, 2015, 05:45:48 pm
The specific model to look for is Beta98-AMP.  Shure came out with this version 3 years ago (if memory serves) for this specific application and they are fantastic.  You can buy them individually or in 3-packs.

http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/beta/beta98amp-miniature-cardioid-drum-microphone

 

I'm really tempted to get 3 of these but our new drummer will be reading charts and not looking at the kit so I gotta question whether they'll take a few hits.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Rob Spence on February 27, 2015, 06:15:40 pm
I'm really tempted to get 3 of these but our new drummer will be reading charts and not looking at the kit so I gotta question whether they'll take a few hits.

Observe where he hits and don't put mics there. They don't need to be that close. Drums are loud. I see too many mics placed where they might get hit. I always ask the drummer if my mic placement is in their way and err on staying further away.


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Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: Tom Burgess on February 27, 2015, 06:46:25 pm
never seen those before.  those are cool...
They are really slick.  I first got to use them right after they were released with Jim Riley on a Ludwig Classic maple kit we provided for a clinic he was doing at a teaching / performance studio here in town and was VERY pleased with the results.  I've turned several of my fellow drum and sound junkies on to them since and they've been a hit everywhere they've been tried.

Jim, incidentally, is an excellent musician, clinician, and teacher.  If any PSW'ers out there get the opportunity to see one of his clinics, whether you're a drummer or not, it is well worth whatever time and money it takes to learn from this guy.
Title: Re: Miking Flea's Bass
Post by: John L Nobile on February 27, 2015, 07:39:17 pm
Observe where he hits and don't put mics there. They don't need to be that close. Drums are loud. I see too many mics placed where they might get hit. I always ask the drummer if my mic placement is in their way and err on staying further away.
DC

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I like them close to minimize bleed. I might try them further away now that I have frequency conscious gates