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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => LAB: The Classic Live Audio Board => Topic started by: Brian Larson on February 04, 2013, 06:59:47 pm

Title: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Brian Larson on February 04, 2013, 06:59:47 pm
I'm a weekend warrior who owns an LS9. I've been carrying a 40 channel copper snake for the last few years which I really have no problems with at all. I like that it easily interfaces with any console I could choose to rent and I can crossrent it to other companies. It does the job.

I haven't kept up with the latest offerings on digital snakes but I've heard prices have come down quite a bit and if I can find something that fits my criteria I could be interested in making the switch.

My ideal snake would:

-Be modular (a couple of 16x8 units would be great as well as a few 8 channel output-only boxes)
-Use a standard format that can be easily connected to any brand of console (no proprietary Yamaha/Roland stuff)
-Run on a single Cat5 cable
-Have control of the preamps from the console
-Have the option to use with an analog console by connecting the input unit directly to an output unit that would be kept at FOH
-Not be ridiculously hard to set up (device IDs, MAC addresses etc. )
-Be under $4k for 32 inputs

For all I know, a system like this might not exist, but I thought I would ask here to see if now is the time to go digital or wait until its possible.

Let's hear suggestions!


Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Bob Leonard on February 05, 2013, 12:01:00 am
Maybe these will float the boat.

http://www.soundcraft.com/products/product.aspx?pid=192
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: paul bell on February 05, 2013, 01:00:48 am
That looks interesting Bob but it'll only connect to a Soundcraft console. It's not stand-alone.
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Peter Morris on February 05, 2013, 01:39:18 am
I'm a weekend warrior who owns an LS9. I've been carrying a 40 channel copper snake for the last few years which I really have no problems with at all. I like that it easily interfaces with any console I could choose to rent and I can crossrent it to other companies. It does the job.

I haven't kept up with the latest offerings on digital snakes but I've heard prices have come down quite a bit and if I can find something that fits my criteria I could be interested in making the switch.

My ideal snake would:

-Be modular (a couple of 16x8 units would be great as well as a few 8 channel output-only boxes)
-Use a standard format that can be easily connected to any brand of console (no proprietary Yamaha/Roland stuff)
-Run on a single Cat5 cable
-Have control of the preamps from the console
-Have the option to use with an analog console by connecting the input unit directly to an output unit that would be kept at FOH
-Not be ridiculously hard to set up (device IDs, MAC addresses etc. )
-Be under $4k for 32 inputs

For all I know, a system like this might not exist, but I thought I would ask here to see if now is the time to go digital or wait until its possible.

Let's hear suggestions!

I think the Yamaha option is going to be too expensive. It may be worth considering selling the LS9 and getting an Allen and Heath GLD80.

The only 32 channel entry level digital snake I can think of in your price range is made by Behringer, it come complete with an X32   ;D ...


Title: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Brian Larson on February 05, 2013, 02:07:32 am
That looks interesting Bob but it'll only connect to a Soundcraft console. It's not stand-alone.

Hmm it says on the website they take cards for MADI and Cobranet which I should be able to get MY cards for right?
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: TJ (Tom) Cornish on February 05, 2013, 10:00:13 am
Hmm it says on the website they take cards for MADI and Cobranet which I should be able to get MY cards for right?
Brian, with all due respect, dump your current console if you want a digital snake.  In most cases, the cost of just the standalone digital snake components exceeds the cost of a new mixer with integrated digital snake, and then you're stuck with systems that don't really play all that seamlessly.  New options from A&H, Soundcraft, and the evil B-word will be better solutions.
Title: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Brian Larson on February 05, 2013, 10:31:11 am
Brian, with all due respect, dump your current console if you want a digital snake.  In most cases, the cost of just the standalone digital snake components exceeds the cost of a new mixer with integrated digital snake, and then you're stuck with systems that don't really play all that seamlessly.  New options from A&H, Soundcraft, and the evil B-word will be better solutions.

Tom,

Unfortunately cross-rent ability is a big factor. Every engineer will accept my LS9 while the same can't be said for the X32 or Soundcraft. The A&H console looks interesting but last time I checked not too many engineers knew their way around it. Maybe that has changed?
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Roland Clarke on February 05, 2013, 10:42:27 am
Tom,

Unfortunately cross-rent ability is a big factor. Every engineer will accept my LS9 while the same can't be said for the X32 or Soundcraft. The A&H console looks interesting but last time I checked not too many engineers knew their way around it. Maybe that has changed?

That's the point.  It's probably cheaper to buy an X32 with the digital snake than the snake option for the LS9 or for that matter a 3rd party solution.

At present, remote microphone amps are very expensive, arguably, using the right technology, it's not that expensive to make.
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: TJ (Tom) Cornish on February 05, 2013, 10:45:57 am
Tom,

Unfortunately cross-rent ability is a big factor. Every engineer will accept my LS9 while the same can't be said for the X32 or Soundcraft. The A&H console looks interesting but last time I checked not too many engineers knew their way around it. Maybe that has changed?
This is an issue for a weekend warrior?  Will those same engineers who turn their noses at the GLD/iLive/Soundcraft be happy with a digital snake kludge?
Title: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Brian Larson on February 05, 2013, 11:44:23 am
This is an issue for a weekend warrior?  Will those same engineers who turn their noses at the GLD/iLive/Soundcraft be happy with a digital snake kludge?

Yes, a significant chunk of my revenue comes from renting equipment to other local companies. The reason I asked here was to find out of I could avoid a kludge and as I said I'm not opposed to the GLD or iLive as long as they have become well known. The X32 and Soundcraft options on the other hand don't seem right for me since no one wants to rent them.
Title: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Samuel Rees on February 05, 2013, 12:42:59 pm
You could always ask some of your regular clients how they'd feel about a new desk. I'm surprised they haven't replaced the LS9!
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Scott Stephens on February 05, 2013, 06:29:55 pm
Brian, Keep your LS9 and your copper snake. Think about it as a business. If they are paid for, then they are making you money. If you get a job or jobs where it will pay you to upgrade then do it, but not now. scott stephens                                                                                                     
I'm a weekend warrior who owns an LS9. I've been carrying a 40 channel copper snake for the last few years which I really have no problems with at all. I like that it easily interfaces with any console I could choose to rent and I can crossrent it to other companies. It does the job.

I haven't kept up with the latest offerings on digital snakes but I've heard prices have come down quite a bit and if I can find something that fits my criteria I could be interested in making the switch.

My ideal snake would:

-Be modular (a couple of 16x8 units would be great as well as a few 8 channel output-only boxes)
-Use a standard format that can be easily connected to any brand of console (no proprietary Yamaha/Roland stuff)
-Run on a single Cat5 cable
-Have control of the preamps from the console
-Have the option to use with an analog console by connecting the input unit directly to an output unit that would be kept at FOH
-Not be ridiculously hard to set up (device IDs, MAC addresses etc. )
-Be under $4k for 32 inputs

For all I know, a system like this might not exist, but I thought I would ask here to see if now is the time to go digital or wait until its possible.

Let's hear suggestions!
Title: Re: Entry level digital snake
Post by: Bob Leonard on February 05, 2013, 10:54:24 pm
Yes, a significant chunk of my revenue comes from renting equipment to other local companies. The reason I asked here was to find out of I could avoid a kludge and as I said I'm not opposed to the GLD or iLive as long as they have become well known. The X32 and Soundcraft options on the other hand don't seem right for me since no one wants to rent them.

Brian,
The soundcraft options were just released at NAMM. That would be why no one has asked to rent them.