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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => SR Forum Archives => LAB Subwoofer FUD Forum Archive => Topic started by: Jason Voyles on October 15, 2010, 04:52:08 pm

Title: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Jason Voyles on October 15, 2010, 04:52:08 pm
I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's. I was pricing out and about to order the subwoofers when I saw something interesting.

I wanted to get a take on the “lab 12 MKII” vs. the Dayton “Titanic MKIII” subwoofers. They look somewhat equivalent, and I should be able to squeeze them into the cabinet. The Titanic looks like it would give you a lower frequency response, but I am not sure about the spec's. I think it would put some ware on the driver in a lab12 cabinet, limiting how much you could push it.

Could someone a bit more knowledgeable take a look and comment accordingly? (both are on parts express website)

Thanks..
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Silas Pradetto on October 15, 2010, 04:58:13 pm
I don't even have to look at it to tell you that you should be using the LAB12 driver. The driver was specifically designed for this box and no other driver is going to work as well.

A different driver is NOT going to make the box go lower. More boxes coupling will do that, limited ultimately by the horn length.

Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Art Welter on October 15, 2010, 08:17:21 pm
Jason Voyles wrote on Fri, 15 October 2010 14:52

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's. I was pricing out and about to order the subwoofers when I saw something interesting.

I wanted to get a take on the “lab 12 MKII” vs. the Dayton “Titanic MKIII” subwoofers. They look somewhat equivalent, and I should be able to squeeze them into the cabinet. The Titanic looks like it would give you a lower frequency response, but I am not sure about the spec's. I think it would put some ware on the driver in a lab12 cabinet, limiting how much you could push it.

Could someone a bit more knowledgeable take a look and comment accordingly? (both are on parts express website)

Thanks..

It has more Xmax, which is good, but less Bl, which is bad.
Also has a lower impedance, good if you want to get more power out of an amp, bad if the amp does not like a 2 ohm load.

I would not dismiss it without trying it, but doubt it would be an improvement.
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: John Halliburton on October 16, 2010, 08:51:30 am
Quote:

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's.


Why?  Regular wood glue is more than good enough.  About the only area you'd want to consider epoxy or some adhesive with filling capacity is the baffle area with the compound mitered pieces that form the initial part of the flare-and only if you're woodworking skills didn't produce a tight fitting set of pieces.

So much extra work and mess for nothing.

Best regards,

John
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Ivan Beaver on October 16, 2010, 09:43:27 am
John Halliburton wrote on Sat, 16 October 2010 08:51

Quote:

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's.


Why?  Regular wood glue is more than good enough.  About the only area you'd want to consider epoxy or some adhesive with filling capacity is the baffle area with the compound mitered pieces that form the initial part of the flare-and only if you're woodworking skills didn't produce a tight fitting set of pieces.

So much extra work and mess for nothing.

Best regards,

John


PL Premium is a good choice as it is super strong-fills gaps-and has a slight expanding characteristic.

More expensive than regular wood glue-but MUCH less expensive and less hassle and much easier to apply than epoxy.
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Chuck Harrigan on October 29, 2010, 11:49:26 pm
Ivan Beaver wrote on Sat, 16 October 2010 09:43

John Halliburton wrote on Sat, 16 October 2010 08:51

Quote:

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's.


Why?  Regular wood glue is more than good enough.  About the only area you'd want to consider epoxy or some adhesive with filling capacity is the baffle area with the compound mitered pieces that form the initial part of the flare-and only if you're woodworking skills didn't produce a tight fitting set of pieces.

So much extra work and mess for nothing.

Best regards,

John


PL Premium is a good choice as it is super strong-fills gaps-and has a slight expanding characteristic.

More expensive than regular wood glue-but MUCH less expensive and less hassle and much easier to apply than epoxy.


+1

This is what I use when building speaker cabinets
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Josh Billings on October 30, 2010, 06:46:30 am
Chuck Harrigan wrote on Fri, 29 October 2010 20:49

Ivan Beaver wrote on Sat, 16 October 2010 09:43

John Halliburton wrote on Sat, 16 October 2010 08:51

Quote:

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's.


Why?  Regular wood glue is more than good enough.  About the only area you'd want to consider epoxy or some adhesive with filling capacity is the baffle area with the compound mitered pieces that form the initial part of the flare-and only if you're woodworking skills didn't produce a tight fitting set of pieces.

So much extra work and mess for nothing.

Best regards,

John


PL Premium is a good choice as it is super strong-fills gaps-and has a slight expanding characteristic.

More expensive than regular wood glue-but MUCH less expensive and less hassle and much easier to apply than epoxy.


+1

This is what I use when building speaker cabinets


+2
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Duncan McLennan on October 30, 2010, 09:49:21 am
PL Premium for me too!
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Duane Silveira on October 30, 2010, 05:00:22 pm
Keep in mind that you really shouldnt have any gaps to fill. If you do, then you have measured/cut incorectly. Take the extra time to get the parts fitting just right, if they arent..then do them over again!! Its worth it in the end knowing you have done it right and can be proud of it. Smile
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Jeff Robinson on November 15, 2010, 01:29:50 pm
Jason Voyles wrote on Fri, 15 October 2010 15:52

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's. I was pricing out and about to order the subwoofers when I saw something interesting.

I wanted to get a take on the “lab 12 MKII” vs. the Dayton “Titanic MKIII” subwoofers. They look somewhat equivalent, and I should be able to squeeze them into the cabinet. The Titanic looks like it would give you a lower frequency response, but I am not sure about the spec's. I think it would put some ware on the driver in a lab12 cabinet, limiting how much you could push it.

Could someone a bit more knowledgeable take a look and comment accordingly? (both are on parts express website)

Thanks..


Jason

If you want a drop-in alternate, look at the Quattro QT305-4.

The Titanic's Qms is too low. Per Tom Danley you need for the Qms to be >9. The Vas and Qes are pretty close. Xmax is respectable at 10MM. About $40 less, stamped frame and lower power handling are the trade offs for the lower cost.

HTH

Jeff Robinson
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Silas Pradetto on November 15, 2010, 03:31:35 pm
Jeff Robinson wrote on Mon, 15 November 2010 13:29

Jason Voyles wrote on Fri, 15 October 2010 15:52

I am in the process of epoxying together the first of 4 lab 12's. I was pricing out and about to order the subwoofers when I saw something interesting.

I wanted to get a take on the “lab 12 MKII” vs. the Dayton “Titanic MKIII” subwoofers. They look somewhat equivalent, and I should be able to squeeze them into the cabinet. The Titanic looks like it would give you a lower frequency response, but I am not sure about the spec's. I think it would put some ware on the driver in a lab12 cabinet, limiting how much you could push it.

Could someone a bit more knowledgeable take a look and comment accordingly? (both are on parts express website)

Thanks..


Jason

If you want a drop-in alternate, look at the Quattro QT305-4.

The Titanic's Qms is too low. Per Tom Danley you need for the Qms to be >9. The Vas and Qes are pretty close. Xmax is respectable at 10MM. About $40 less, stamped frame and lower power handling are the trade offs for the lower cost.

HTH

Jeff Robinson



That driver is discontinued.

The whole "Let's build a giant horn sub for max performance then cripple it's output with a $60 driver" just kind of defeats the whole purpose, doesn't it?

PS-there is a driver better than the LAB12 but I can't tell you what it is.
Title: Re: Ideas on Lab 12 MkII vs. Titanic 12 MKIII with Lab 12 folded cabinet...
Post by: Duane Silveira on November 16, 2010, 01:24:24 am
Silas...If you told us you would have to kill us??