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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => Pro AV Forum => Topic started by: Ben Carson_ on June 22, 2022, 07:28:12 PM

Title: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Ben Carson_ on June 22, 2022, 07:28:12 PM
Provided a QSC quote involving MP-A80 8 channel amp for a sports bar and it was approved.

They were in stock when quoted but now ETA is several months out, and this is the same with other preferred options like the QSC CX404, Crest CM2204.

I am just powering a bunch of JBL Control speakers @ 8ohm

Security faceplate / or no front controls is a neccesary feature

New Class D would be welcomed, as heat and fan noise are an issue; gear is stationed just 5' from patron seating

While looking for alternatives I came across an alternative: ART SLA4.
These guys are meant for the studio, but they recently released at 70V version, which implies that the SLA4 predecessor might be suitable for installed sound too. After all, studios run gear 18 hours a day much like public venues.

4 x 100 Watts/Ch @ 8 Ohms, 140 Watts/Ch @ 4 Ohms
2 x 100 Watts/Ch @ 8 Ohms & 1 x 280 Watts @ 8 Ohms (bridged)

They are inexpensive ! Just $500 Canadian.

Too good to be true?

Anyone have experience with these or doing something similar?
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Dave Garoutte on June 22, 2022, 07:36:48 PM
Provided a QSC quote involving MP-A80 8 channel amp for a sports bar and it was approved.

They were in stock when quoted but now ETA is several months out, and this is the same with other preferred options like the QSC CX404, Crest CM2204.

I am just powering a bunch of JBL Control speakers @ 8ohm

Security faceplate / or no front controls is a neccesary feature

New Class D would be welcomed, as heat and fan noise are an issue; gear is stationed just 5' from patron seating

While looking for alternatives I came across an alternative: ART SLA4.
These guys are meant for the studio, but they recently released at 70V version, which implies that the SLA4 predecessor might be suitable for installed sound too. After all, studios run gear 18 hours a day much like public venues.

4 x 100 Watts/Ch @ 8 Ohms, 140 Watts/Ch @ 4 Ohms
2 x 100 Watts/Ch @ 8 Ohms & 1 x 280 Watts @ 8 Ohms (bridged)

They are inexpensive ! Just $500 Canadian.

Too good to be true?

Anyone have experience with these or doing something similar?
Please change your display name to your actual name per the forum rules.  No one will reply until then.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Ben Carson_ on June 26, 2022, 06:08:53 PM
Looks like this forum post here covers this exact discussion pretty well:
https://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/topic,176677.0.html

If the CX series were available I don't think it would even be a question. These things are rock solid.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Mike Caldwell on June 26, 2022, 11:03:56 PM
For what it's worth I've put a couple ART SLA-2 amps in installs and they are working fine for their application.
One is driving 8 ohm loads and the other is in bridged mono driving a 70volt system with 8 JBL ceiling speakers.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Brian Jojade on June 27, 2022, 12:29:47 AM
I've worked with quite a bit of ART stuff over the years.  Never had any reliability issues, although many times it was on the noisier side of things.  For many cases, that doesn't make much difference. At the price, it could be a stop gap install until the real stuff gets in too.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Ben Carson_ on June 27, 2022, 11:56:25 AM
I've worked with quite a bit of ART stuff over the years.  Never had any reliability issues, although many times it was on the noisier side of things.  For many cases, that doesn't make much difference. At the price, it could be a stop gap install until the real stuff gets in too.

Thanks for the feedback Mike and Brian. Last night I convinced myself to go the Crown XLS route, and bridging 2-4 8 ohm speakers per channel. But for the price of the ART SL4 could install a couple and have each speaker on its own output. I thought I may have gone off the deep end with considering Art for the application, but hearing that reliability issues are not a problem has me reconsidering.

By "noiser" are you referring to fan noise or signal to noise, or both?
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Brian Jojade on June 27, 2022, 12:31:28 PM
Thanks for the feedback Mike and Brian. Last night I convinced myself to go the Crown XLS route, and bridging 2-4 8 ohm speakers per channel. But for the price of the ART SL4 could install a couple and have each speaker on its own output. I thought I may have gone off the deep end with considering Art for the application, but hearing that reliability issues are not a problem has me reconsidering.

By "noiser" are you referring to fan noise or signal to noise, or both?

The signal noise is what I was referring to.  Just a little more hiss than I like (which is none, of course!) but not bad enough to be a deal breaker.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: John Roberts {JR} on June 27, 2022, 02:06:55 PM
Most amplifiers use common innards, even more so now with class D amplifier chip sets. Different SKUs for different markets will mainly differ in feature sets.

JR
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Mike Caldwell on June 27, 2022, 07:09:10 PM
Thanks for the feedback Mike and Brian. Last night I convinced myself to go the Crown XLS route, and bridging 2-4 8 ohm speakers per channel. But for the price of the ART SL4 could install a couple and have each speaker on its own output. I thought I may have gone off the deep end with considering Art for the application, but hearing that reliability issues are not a problem has me reconsidering.

By "noiser" are you referring to fan noise or signal to noise, or both?

What do you mean by "bridging 2-4 8 ohm speakers per channel" ?

The XLS series has the advantage of the the basic on board DSP most importantly the high pass filter option.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Tim Hite on June 27, 2022, 11:58:41 PM
Dynacord and Linda Research are both currently delivering quality power amplifiers.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Dave Garoutte on June 28, 2022, 01:37:45 AM
Dynacord and Linda Research are both currently delivering quality power amplifiers.
  I don't know about delivering.  I've had a dynacord on order for months.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Nathanael Iversen on June 29, 2022, 09:22:00 PM
  I don't know about delivering.  I've had a dynacord on order for months.
I just received three of the Danley 20ks.  I could not get them with Dante. But without Dante was available.  These are made by Linea.  These seem to be times that one buys whats available unless very long wait times are ok.  I bought non Dante stage boxes for SQ5 mixer for the same reason. They existed.  But Id have preferred Dante.  Maybe Dante will get better next year. I think Audinate gave up and changed parts for their gen 3 chip.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Tim McCulloch on July 01, 2022, 12:28:10 PM
I just received three of the Danley 20ks.  I could not get them with Dante. But without Dante was available.  These are made by Linea.  These seem to be times that one buys whats available unless very long wait times are ok.  I bought non Dante stage boxes for SQ5 mixer for the same reason. They existed.  But Id have preferred Dante.  Maybe Dante will get better next year. I think Audinate gave up and changed parts for their gen 3 chip.

Audient is getting more of the Brooklyn chips, but delivery is still only about 10% of need.  They've got a new chip set coming (presumably they've already booked production slots in the remaining chip foundries).

We're 9 months to a year from having new foundries coming on line, which kind of coincides with Yamaha and Shure projections for resuming production of certain models.
Title: Re: Thinking outside of the box for commercial amps due to supply issues
Post by: Tim Hite on July 02, 2022, 03:13:40 PM
  I don't know about delivering.  I've had a dynacord on order for months.

Depends on the models you need. I can't get TGX but the C series is available.