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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => The Basement => Topic started by: Debbie Dunkley on October 28, 2018, 06:47:35 PM
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Craigslist.
I have been buying and selling on Craigslist since the website became available back when I lived in CA. It used to be so cool - nice and easy to post ads as seller, easy photo upload, a great 'all in one' place to find many used items nicely categorized for convenience, and a great way to meet new people too. All free of charge for non traders.
It has improved over the years - able to post many more photos at higher res and upload is quick. Ad goes live now almost immediately among other things..
BUT the whole TROLL thing is out of control!!
So I noticed a couple of years ago a few posts cropping up basically bashing other folks ads. Claiming items are way overpriced, poor quality and even fake. These people can be quite insulting in their attack. Obviously they have nothing better to do than bash other peoples attempts to make a few bucks and sell on something to someone who can use it. Whether the asking price is too high or not is irrelevant. If you think an item is too expensive then don't buy it!
In the past year this has started to happen to me too. These people always hide behind fake stupid email address names too.
It has become so bad that others including myself now have started to add verbiage at the bottom of the ad asking 'TROLLS' not to bother responding. It is bad enough with the scammers - now we have to deal with these idiots.
So I had some mics on CL yesterday. Within 2 hours I had an idiot contacted me starting out by saying, "Call me a Troll if you must"......telling me that 3 of my 4 items were way overpriced and 2 of the 4 nobody will ever want. Then at the end of the ad he made me a low ball offer for one of the mics.
I price my gear reasonably and sometimes too low - I am not a gouger by any means.
I did not respond.
Less than an hour later, I had a nice guy call me who wanted to buy 3 of the 4 mics at full pice. We had to leave for a show and made an arrangement to meet him on the way. We took the mics with us, pulled over into a parking lot, he took the mics and paid cash asking price.
I immediately went onto CL on my phone and it gave me the greatest pleasure to place the word SOLD against the 3 mics assuming the TROLL would check back at some point.
BTW - the mics I sold were the 2 the troll said no-one would ever want and the one he made an offer on - HAH!
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Soo....what were the mics you were selling?
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Soo....what were the mics you were selling?
I sold an EV ND767, and a couple of cheapies - a Pyle SM57 clone and an Audio Technica 4000.
I admit the cheapies aren't great mics but good enough to throw on a drum or guitar cab in a pinch. Also good as ambient mics for iem use. My prices reflected this.
The EV was one of 5 that I have and I am trying to slowly move stuff that isn't getting used.
The 4th mic that I removed from CL and will advertise later is a Sennheiser E838.
Right now I have a bass and inexpensive iem system on CL too - no trolls yet though!!
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I can understand your frustration Debbie! I'm usually on the other side of the equation as a buyer, but it can be an equally infuriating experience!
As a collector of vintage lighting equipment I've dealt with my fair share of sketchy and scammy sellers from ebay, craigslist, reverb, offer up, and more. You'd think for such a niche market that most sellers would be legitimate, but nope! It makes you really appreciate the honest sellers and communities of professionals such as the one here.
I've had even worse luck from actual authorized dealers too, though I won't derail your thread with the deals...and there are many. Best of luck with your sales!
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A get what you pay for moment?
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BUT the whole TROLL thing is out of control!!
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A get what you pay for moment?
Good point Riley but still a darn shame. ebay fees are high but more importantly when you want to sell something inexpensive and avoid shipping, it just doesn't make sense to go that route. I would willingly pay for the ad in CL to keep things local if it kept the scammers and trolls at bay but I don't think it would make any difference the way it is set up.
I still get sales on there and I still make purchases too so for the most part I do OK.
This recent troll thing though is so frustrating. I mean these people get really nasty and say things that they have no reason to say.
I never realized there were so many angry bitter people around who simply enjoy trying to humiliate others. I thought there was some kind of code among musicians - there used to be.
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I can understand your frustration Debbie! I'm usually on the other side of the equation as a buyer, but it can be an equally infuriating experience!
As a collector of vintage lighting equipment I've dealt with my fair share of sketchy and scammy sellers from ebay, craigslist, reverb, offer up, and more. You'd think for such a niche market that most sellers would be legitimate, but nope! It makes you really appreciate the honest sellers and communities of professionals such as the one here.
I've had even worse luck from actual authorized dealers too, though I won't derail your thread with the deals...and there are many. Best of luck with your sales!
I do come across many good folks too and it certainly helps me to stay sane. You just never know.....
Go ahead and derail.....get it off your chest! -LOL
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I recently posted some equipment (heavy shop machinery) on both Craigslist and Facebook Marketplace. I received almost zero hits on Craigslist but hundreds on Facebook. I despise Facebook and wish there were another second hand market with better liquidity. LetGo may be it but signing up for their service threw a few red flags security/spam wise.
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Is this item still available?
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Is this item still available?
;D
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I recently posted some equipment (heavy shop machinery) on both Craigslist and Facebook Marketplace. I received almost zero hits on Craigslist but hundreds on Facebook. I despise Facebook and wish there were another second hand market with better liquidity. LetGo may be it but signing up for their service threw a few red flags security/spam wise.
There is of course Reverb.com. I have used them for couple of purchases but never sold anything through them.
I have always liked the fact I have so much control over my ad with CL. I can go back in and edit as much as I want when I want.
Over the years I have done quite well there.
I do find though that I have only sold when willing to take low end prices or willing to wait a while to find the right person.
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Is this item still available?
I learned that these messages come in when someone hits the prominent "Ask for details" button. Instead of bringing up a message box for you to type a direct question, it auto generates the annoying "Is this item still available" message to the seller. Once I learned that, I started ignoring all of those messages.
I've not had the issue that Debbie started this thread about, but I'm not posting a lot for sale on Craigslist. Subjectively, it seems like there are fewer audio items listed for sale on Craigslist these days. I wonder if the rise of FB Marketplace is having an impact Craigslist? FWIW I have not had any luck selling higher value items on FB, but sub $100 things seem to move pretty quickly. I've resorted to eBay to move my unused LabGruppen fP series amps. My second auction winner failed to pay :(
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Is this item still available?
"Yes, still available"
Never to be heard from again.
Up here, we use a service called Kijiji, different name, same woes.
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When you filter out the things falsely listed for $1, the sob stories, the used cars (seriously, who puts "vertical blinds" in a used car listing?), the ads that include Webster's dictionary (so they show up in EVERY unrelated search), the ones with L@@K in the title, and the ones that include 17 unrelated items in the same ad, there's nothing left to buy.
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Sold a basically new TV antenna system on ebay at about 1/3 of what I paid for it.
Fully described the item and condition to the buyer.
He wanted to return it saying I mis-represented it.
All the pertinent info was available on the manufacturer's website and I explained why It didn't work for me (deep in a valley).
Paypal removed the money and I had to pay for return postage.
>:( >:( >:(
From a seller's standpoint, ebay is too buyer-centric.
There really isn't any recourse when a buyer makes a claim.
Craig's is much easier, though doesn't have the reach.
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I got email today from a seller I bought from back in August.
He is claiming he had a PayPal problem and wants to refund me and invoice again. Really, 2 months later?
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
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Sold a basically new TV antenna system on ebay at about 1/3 of what I paid for it.
Fully described the item and condition to the buyer.
He wanted to return it saying I mis-represented it.
All the pertinent info was available on the manufacturer's website and I explained why It didn't work for me (deep in a valley).
Paypal removed the money and I had to pay for return postage.
>:( >:( >:(
From a seller's standpoint, ebay is too buyer-centric.
There really isn't any recourse when a buyer makes a claim.
Craig's is much easier, though doesn't have the reach.
We gave up on eBullshit due to the 100% buyer focus. We sold some vintage JBL HF drivers as "used, pulled from working install but sold as is." About 8 pics of the drivers in our listing. Buyer complained about the scratches and worn finish of a 50 year old item and we had to eat the return shipping and had no recourse when the buyer didn't insure the shipment and packed it badly, leaving the drivers in unsalable condition after the carrier drop-kicked it across the USA.
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The other thing that annoys me is when I select owner ads to filter out dealers and there are dozens of ads that are obviously placed by dealers. I would NEVER consider buying from a dealer who is trying to save a few dollars (and CL is cheap for dealers) by lying to people. The same dealers are on there every single week.
Sorry to hear about the horror stories from you guys - makes my rant subject matter appear quite picky really.....
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I have so much to sell and so little time. CL and Ebay are the alternatives so what else do you do.
Anyway, I saw an ad that stated "We buy all musical instruments." Guy came to the house, looked at amplifiers, guitars, pedals, raw speakers, etc.. All good and all worth much more than I was asking. He offered pennies on the dollar, I offered him the door. So later in the day he stops buy and drops off a radio, then asks if I would look at it for him. Well, I looked, and I've been looking at it for 6 months.
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I have so much to sell and so little time. CL and Ebay are the alternatives so what else do you do.
Anyway, I saw an ad that stated "We buy all musical instruments." Guy came to the house, looked at amplifiers, guitars, pedals, raw speakers, etc.. All good and all worth much more than I was asking. He offered pennies on the dollar, I offered him the door. So later in the day he stops buy and drops off a radio, then asks if I would look at it for him. Well, I looked, and I've been looking at it for 6 months.
"It all began when I took a tour
Hoping to find some furniture
I followed a sign that said "beautiful chest"
It led to a lady who showed me her best..."
- Genesis, 'The Reverend' from Battle of Epping Forrest
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I've gotten into it with a few trolls on both CL (they used to be called CLL or Craig's List Losers) and FB. I gave up on FB. Trying to sell a car gets you and endless stream of lowball "would you take $xxx". Some are so ridiculous as to really piss me off. Worst thing is that it's mixed up with a public profile telling everything about you. Those of us who play music tend to use FB to advertise gigs and promote things. So, now you have these jackalopes hounding you with half price offers. I asked a few why they would even bother with such ridiculous offers and you get "well, I should be able to try" or some other insipid entitled nonsense.
The other thing that's happened to me a few times when trying to sell a vehicle is spammers selling CarFax alternatives. They start by asking a question about the vehicle and add in (a red flag that I've forgotten about the first few times) that they have trouble with the craigslist mail transfer system so please reply to xyz@gmail or some other free mail host. Then you get spam about how you should get a vehicle report from whatever it is to help you sell it.
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OfferUp is another alternative but I have found that nobody wants to pay the listed price even if it is very reasonable. As if they're getting ripped off if you won't take their lower offer.
So the trick is to ask for more than you want and then negotiate down to your real price. Ridiculous but effective.
I also have been getting numerous "buyers" tell me they want to buy what I have on both offer up and Facebook marketplace after some back and forth questions and then they suddenly just stop communicating.
My biggest beef with all of these services is the inane questions asked that are already answered completely in the item listing.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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OfferUp is another alternative but I have found that nobody wants to pay the listed price even it it is very reasonable. As if they're getting ripped off if you won't take their lower offer.
So the trick is to ask for more than you want and then negotiate down to your real price. Ridiculous but effective.
I also have been getting numerous "buyers" tell me they want to buy what I have on both offer up and Facebook marketplace after some back and forth questions and then they suddenly just stop communicating.
My biggest beef with all of these services is the inane questions asked that are already answered completely in the item listing.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Yes Scott - you hit on another couple of pet peeves of mine.
I cannot count the times I have had someone blow up my email or phone for info back and forth over days - sometimes weeks and then suddenly it's like they never existed. You cannot get them to call or text back.
I had one guy do this to me in texts on 2 separate occasions and I didn't catch it but on the third attempt, I noticed the thread on my phone that linked his number and I totally ignored him.
Also you mentioned the folks who ask questions that have all been clearly addressed in the ad - even the price!
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only way its feasable around here is to have a second line or burner phone. put voice calls only and phone number in the ad and that seems to eliminate all the keyboard warriors. they seem scared to lowball outside of txt and email
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only way its feasable around here is to have a second line or burner phone. put voice calls only and phone number in the ad and that seems to eliminate all the keyboard warriors. they seem scared to lowball outside of txt and email
Google Voice or other free VOIP service is good for the times you don't want to expose your Telco number.
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Got a call today about a piece of gear listed on Craigslist
Caller:, “Is the item still available?”
Me, “Yes”
Caller, “ I don’t have the money for it now, can you hold it for me for a few weeks?”
Me, “No, I can’t hold it for you”
Caller, “Why are you being a jerk?”
Me, “Why are you trying to buy things with no money?”
Caller starts yelling something and I hang up.
I have gotten dozens of calls from people who tell me straight up they don’t have the money to buy stuff I list on Craigslist but want me to hold the item for them until they can raise the cash.
I also get a dozen or so lowball offers on every item.
I just listed a few old 10 and 12 space racks and a guy emails and asked if they could be converted to drum cases. I respond and tell him the rack rails are just bolted in and he could glue carpet or foam to the insides and make nice drum cases out of them. He answered he didn’t have time for a project like I was going to do the conversion for him!
On the plus side, I usually sell all the crap I don’t want to pack and ship on eBay.
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Low-ball offers don't bother me, at least I know there is somebody interested..
What bothers me are people that complain when I won't "meet them halfway" about an hour drive away for a $25 item.
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Yes Scott - you hit on another couple of pet peeves of mine.
I cannot count the times I have had someone blow up my email or phone for info back and forth over days - sometimes weeks and then suddenly it's like they never existed. You cannot get them to call or text back.
I had one guy do this to me in texts on 2 separate occasions and I didn't catch it but on the third attempt, I noticed the thread on my phone that linked his number and I totally ignored him.
Also you mentioned the folks who ask questions that have all been clearly addressed in the ad - even the price!
This happened again to me on Friday. Negotiated a deal on some gear with someone, settled on a price and then he just stopped responding.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
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This happened again to me on Friday. Negotiated a deal on some gear with someone, settled on a price and then he just stopped responding.
Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
I only "negotiate" in person. Anyone trying to run down the price without looking at the item isn't serious. I do the market research and price fairly. If they bother to come look at it, I'll entertain offers. Especially if they can justify it in some way. This car needs new tires, or, I'm going to have to repaint these cabinets to use them on my corporate gigs.
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I have found with Craigslist whether the asking price is fair or not - there is an expectation of taking a reasonable offer.
I don't necessarily like doing things this way but I personally see it as a trade off for the free advertising.
If I was paying eBay fees, I'd probably end up with about the same money or even less so taking less than advertised isn't such a negative.
Lowballing however is the problem. eg. when an item is worth $200, I don't mind someone offering $150. I might then counter with $175 and if accepted we are all good. But in that instance offers of $100 won't get a response.
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Will you take $50 cash?
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Will you take $50 cash?
Sure, bring me 4 of them. 8)
Chris.
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Debbie -
Just ignore anyone responding to your ad that doesn't sound serious. I learned to ignore the trolls and foolish offers for stuff I sell with the delete key. I don't have time. Good luck!
--Kevin
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Debbie -
Just ignore anyone responding to your ad that doesn't sound serious. I learned to ignore the trolls and foolish offers for stuff I sell with the delete key. I don't have time. Good luck!
--Kevin
Thanks Kevin... problem is I have done that to responses such as , " Still Available"?, "Still got it?" or " mic?"...... and then had the person call me a couple of days later wondering why I didn't get back to them and THEN they have made the purchase .. so in this era of poor vocabulary and Urban dictionary text abbreviations etc, I can't always be sure of the seriousness of the inquiry.
Years ago, people sent me well written polite messages - not so these days.