Post by: Ned Ward on December 20, 2010, 05:50:58 PM
She doesn't move around alot, so hardwired in-ears is fine. We use wired SM58 for her which suits her voice fine.
Hardware is ART MyMonitor ( http://www.artproaudio.com/products.asp?type=90&cat=13&a mp;id=67)
The unit passes the vocal mic thru to the mixer, and also has an aux input for monitor. Goal would be to have a monitor mix sent to this from my 01v and give her control over her vocal for a "more me" solution.
Challenge - the Monitor Input on the MyMonitor is looking for a stereo headphone type feed; with a mono 1/4" or an XLR-TRS adapter, it only plays in mono on the right side.
Is there a simple adapter/wiring change that would let me take a mono XLR send from the 01v and with a creative adapter, present a dual mono signal to the MyMonitor aux input?
Pic with wiring diagram attached. I'm not soldering/electronics knowledgeable, but our drummer is an electronics engineer and could also open the pup up and tweak if needed. I've already sent an email to ART but figured the fine minds on this board may have a usable workaround.
Thanks.
Post by: Rob Timmerman on December 20, 2010, 06:42:29 PM
S -> ST -> TT -> R
Basically, build a splitter cable. Don't forget to label it.
Post by: John Chiara on December 20, 2010, 09:40:27 PM
Post by: Ned Ward on December 20, 2010, 10:41:47 PM
There's only 1 power switch and two volume knobs. No mono button.
Post by: brian maddox on December 21, 2010, 12:36:56 AM
if you have a F-xlr to M-trs, you can modify it inside either connector to accomplish your goal.
in the xlr connector, move pin 3 wire to combine with wire on pin 2 [technically you should then jump pin 3 to pin 1, but it'll probably work fine if you don't].
or
in the trs, disconnect ring and jump ring to tip.
you could also open the box and accomplish the same thing by moving the wire from the 'ring' connection to the 'tip' connection.
all of these make your connection unbalanced, but that is probably not a big deal for your purposes...
if you've got access to a 'electrical engineer' drummer, these mods should be a piece of cake. 10 minutes and a soldering iron.
and yeah, it should have a mono switch...
brian maddox
'cheap gear personalizer'
brianm@fcfchurch.com
Post by: Ned Ward on December 21, 2010, 12:31:02 PM
Post by: David Buckley on December 26, 2010, 05:37:41 PM
The first is that you are mixing a signal direct from the vocalist's microphone, and a return from a digital desk. The issue here is that the desk return will be out of time with the live mic feed, dues to the processing latency through the digital chain. So if you have the vocalists mike present in the feed from the desk, you may get a comb filtering thing going on. So rather than "more me", don't have any of "me" in the feed from the desk, to avoid the problem, hopefully altogether, though depending on stage volume, there may be other stuff picked up by the vocalists mic.
The second is that you're running unbalanced from the desk to the MyMonitor; this may work perfectly fine, if your setup is such that unbalanced line feeds survive intact and uninterfered with down the multi. If hums and buzzes are an issue, then a balanced to unbalanced transformer (like a DI box but in reverse) should solve the problem.
Post by: Tim A Perry on December 26, 2010, 07:37:05 PM
You don't necessarily even have to solder anything.
Simply obtain a stereo headphone extender cable and cut it in half.
strip back the ends and wire the two hots to the female end together. Then twist the single hot from the male end to the the other two.
Leave the unneeded wire from the male end loose and hook the 2 commons (usually black) together.
Then solder,or tape, or crimp and plug the headphones into it then into the box.
Post by: Ned Ward on December 31, 2010, 12:35:32 AM
| David Buckley wrote on Sun, 26 December 2010 14:37 |
Two issues you may face. The first is that you are mixing a signal direct from the vocalist's microphone, and a return from a digital desk. The issue here is that the desk return will be out of time with the live mic feed, dues to the processing latency through the digital chain. So if you have the vocalists mike present in the feed from the desk, you may get a comb filtering thing going on. So rather than "more me", don't have any of "me" in the feed from the desk, to avoid the problem, hopefully altogether, though depending on stage volume, there may be other stuff picked up by the vocalists mic. The second is that you're running unbalanced from the desk to the MyMonitor; this may work perfectly fine, if your setup is such that unbalanced line feeds survive intact and uninterfered with down the multi. If hums and buzzes are an issue, then a balanced to unbalanced transformer (like a DI box but in reverse) should solve the problem. |
David - thanks for the reply. Goal would be actually to just give her a mix on the "monitor channel" that includes her vocal and bypass the mic thru to avoid any delay issues as you say. Other change would be having our electrical engineer drummer change the mic input to a line-level input to accept a XLR male, which would make everything much easier.
worst case on the noise, I've got an ebtech hum eliminator (1:1 isolation transformer) that should work.
Having just gotten sensaphonic molds for my Shure buds and spend a day mixing with them, I can definitely see the benefits of IEM - much lower SPL, as well as the drawbacks - you need an ambient mic or you hear nothing.
Still definitely an experiment, and one we'll prove out in practice in our rehearsal studio before taking out live. Over the break i did get a headphone extender cable and female XLR - TRS adapter cables. by tweaking a few of those to sum into mono, this could be an intro into full IEMs. Next purchase would be a rack mount headphone amp. But again, we're walking before running.
Post by: Jonathan Kok on December 31, 2010, 01:30:28 AM
Jus' sayin'
Post by: Adam Kane on December 31, 2010, 11:13:20 AM
| Jonathan Kok wrote on Fri, 31 December 2010 01:30 |
Rolls makes the same thing...for about $50. WITH a mono/stereo switch. In fact, run in mono, theirs allows for remote powering of the device, via the un-used ring portion of the TRS monitor input, and the PS16. Which, incidentally, also serves as an un-balancer (XLR input on the PS16). Jus' sayin' |
I was just about to say that. I've used the Rolls unit (several of them, actually) in the past without an issue.
Post by: Ned Ward on December 31, 2010, 02:02:00 PM
Post by: Ned Ward on January 03, 2011, 12:59:37 AM
thanks guys!
Post by: Ned Ward on January 08, 2011, 08:02:21 PM
Just got the Rolls PM55, and it's heads and shoulders above the ART My Monitor. Couple of things:
Battery access - cool little pop-out plastic caddy for the 9-volt that comes in and out without any tools. By contrast, the ART has a flimsy piece of metal with miniscule tabs at the end secured with a non-captive philips screw. It's only a matter of time before the screw or this tab are lost.
Mono/stereo - Rolls unit has a jumper to configure TRS input as dual mono or stereo - nice. Also has a method that will switch the ground lift by sending phantom power, if needed, on the mic channel - nice.
Rolls unit has 1/4" and 1/8" headphone inputs - no adapter needed. ART only has 1/4" input, necessitating an adapter.
Bottom line - I'll be buying another 2 Rolls for our drummer and keyboard player; the ART unit is on eBay (with a free 1/8 - 1/4" headphone adapter).
Thanks to everyone for their suggestions and recommendations on this endeavor.