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Sound Reinforcement - Forums for Live Sound Professionals - Your Displayed Name Must Be Your Real Full Name To Post In The Live Sound Forums => LAB: The Classic Live Audio Board => Topic started by: Steve Litcher on July 07, 2016, 12:25:17 PM
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Seriously exploring a pair of SM80s with some TH-118s, and I'm curious what type of coverage folks are getting from their Danley SM80s.
Indoor/Outdoor, number of people, type of music - what are you experiencing? And, with how much power?
If you've used them for a while, are there any tips or tricks or anything you'd do differently now that you have experience with them?
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Coverage is not an absolute, fixed number. You have to factor in the area, desired SPL over the given area, type of music and the expectations of the promoter, audience and performers.
That said, you'd have a hard time going wrong with Danley.
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There's a lot of 'it depends' scenarios that Ivan will go into no doubt, but without front fills the maximum I've personally spaced them apart is about 5m (over 2xTH118s on each side), and I'd say you cover about 10m x 20m pretty well.
They sound great although there is a bit of a hole in the lower midrange, you can boost it a bit. I'd highly suggest that you go with danleys own amps and 4xTH118s if you can afford it. A single DNA20K can drive all 6 boxes with no issues whatsoever (don't worry about the driving the subs at 2 ohms (when paired), the DANLEY amps handle it just fine.
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I've mostly used them as sidewash but have done a few shows in a 106' x 112' x35' room for 400 ppl. Used 2 DBH218's for subs and Labgruppen power. Wasn't pushing the system but I measured 105 dbc and FOH and had some volume complaints. Haven't heard them reach their potential yet.
Highly reverberant room but it still sounded very good.
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We have done several outdoor shows with a one SM80-over one TH118 on each side of the stage, powered by Crown xti4000 and ITech 6000 each in stereo mode. No problem hitting 100dB peaks at 100 ft at full tilt, as long as we had full power (mostly the ability to give the sub amp a full 20A dedicated circuit). One of our larger areas was about 100 by 100 ft at a downtown stage, with additional spillover on the sidewalk and street, maybe 300-400 people; pop/country act; there were a few buildings on each side of the lot that helped confine the sound a little bit. Recently got some higher extension poles and speaker tilters which help with aiming the sound where it needs to go. Lots of compliments on the quality of sound.
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Here is shot of a 1500-2700(lawn seating) capacity venue we regularly work. Acts range from jazz to heavy rock. The Danley rig always produces great results. I have never noticed a "hole in the low mid area".
https://youtu.be/ItjfD7EZaAk
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As usual-It depends. And this applies to all loudspeakers
"Coverage" can mean different things to different people and different situations.
Obviously SPL is one thing. Rock levels are different than easy jazz.
Other things include: How close are the closest people?
How wide is the area of coverage?
How high are the speakers?
How far are the furthest listeners?
What sort of SPL deviation (from the closest to the furthest listener) is acceptable to be considered "covered"? 3dB? 10dB? 20dB?
I have a friend that does a large event every fall (I think around labor day) in Dallas with the band "War". He has done it 2 years with the SM80s and is doing it again this year.
The audience area is in a large field and extends out to 300' deep
He uses 1 SM80 per side and subs.
Granted the subs he uses are the "larger" subs-so he is able to push the system a bit more-due to the big bass support.
For the event he says it works just fine. Once the band got over the "size" of the speakers the first time
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I regularly do a summer concert series in a space 100' deep and 140' wide with more than 180 degrees coverage needed. We fly two SM80 over four TH118 facing front with one over one for each side. We are mandated to keep it at 100-105 db (C, slow) out front. We can easily exceed that if we wanted. Variety of acts. Crown iTech8k one channel per box.
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Here is shot of a 1500-2700(lawn seating) capacity venue we regularly work. Acts range from jazz to heavy rock. The Danley rig always produces great results. I have never noticed a "hole in the low mid area".
https://youtu.be/ItjfD7EZaAk
Thanks for posting! Can you post details in the video description (or here)? As far as amps, type of subs, etc.
Thanks!
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Thanks for posting! Can you post details in the video description (or here)? As far as amps, type of subs, etc.
Thanks!
Crown Itech 4000 SM80. Two Itech 6000's for four TH 118/ two per side.
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We have done several outdoor shows with a one SM80-over one TH118 on each side of the stage, powered by Crown xti4000 and ITech 6000 each in stereo mode. No problem hitting 100dB peaks at 100 ft at full tilt, as long as we had full power (mostly the ability to give the sub amp a full 20A dedicated circuit). One of our larger areas was about 100 by 100 ft at a downtown stage, with additional spillover on the sidewalk and street, maybe 300-400 people; pop/country act; there were a few buildings on each side of the lot that helped confine the sound a little bit. Recently got some higher extension poles and speaker tilters which help with aiming the sound where it needs to go. Lots of compliments on the quality of sound.
Hi Rick, can you specify the speaker poles with tilt function? Been looking for something exactly like that for the SM80s that can handle their weight.
Cheers
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Hi Rick, can you specify the speaker poles with tilt function? Been looking for something exactly like that for the SM80s that can handle their weight.
Cheers
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Nimrod Webber's BT12 tilters. Awesome product that does just what is needed. Not cheap, but nothing that well designed and made is.
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Thanks Stephen!
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Here is shot of a 1500-2700(lawn seating) capacity venue we regularly work. Acts range from jazz to heavy rock. The Danley rig always produces great results. I have never noticed a "hole in the low mid area".
https://youtu.be/ItjfD7EZaAk
Love it - that's awesome, and helps a ton. Question - are those K12s over K181s in the "Private Party 6/30" video? Sounded quite nice - well done.
And, thanks again to everyone for the input and examples. I realize that there are a ton of variables to consider; was just looking for some general experiences.
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Love it - that's awesome, and helps a ton. Question - are those K12s over K181s in the "Private Party 6/30" video? Sounded quite nice - well done.
And, thanks again to everyone for the input and examples. I realize that there are a ton of variables to consider; was just looking for some general experiences.
That is a JBL SRX 712/718 powered by Itech 6000
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Thanks Stephen!
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The BT-12's are the best. The K&M 19674 will also work, but the center of gravity will be a little forward and they are slightly underrated at 55# for the SM80's weight of 65#.
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The BT-12's are the best. The K&M 19674 will also work, but the center of gravity will be a little forward and they are slightly underrated at 55# for the SM80's weight of 65#.
I use those K&m tilters with my ev zxa5's (50lbs) cranked up high on my st-132 crank stands. although they do throw off the centre of gravity, with my Tripod legs spread wide, I have yet to find any issue with stability. (YMMV- not recommending using a product outside it's factory rated specs by using those specific tilters with the 65lb sm80). The locking sleeve works beautifully for keeping them from spinning around on you. Helpful if you're tilting "back" to cover a balcony for example.
Consider that the stand weighs as much as the speaker in this case, and that I'm only tilting maybe 10 degrees at most, it's not as bad as one might think. In a pinch I've even attached a pair of adj dotz Par LED wash lights using one of those short tee attachments from on-stage stands, and they were still more stable at 13' than some cheaper tripods at 6'.