Post by: Marsellus Fariss on January 28, 2010, 05:34:28 PM
For me it's the Alesis 3630 comp that pumps like Swartzenegger at an all night gym. Just the site of one makes me want to unplug it and set fire to it and dance around like Nero.
The MEQ is pretty bad too.
Post by: Matt_Young on January 28, 2010, 05:38:41 PM
Post by: Andy Peters on January 28, 2010, 05:42:54 PM
| Marsellus Fariss wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 15:34 |
Just one piece of gear not "digital consoles" or "all ###inger." For me it's the Alesis 3630 comp that pumps like Swartzenegger at an all night gym. Just the site of one makes me want to unplug it and set fire to it and dance around like Nero. The MEQ is pretty bad too. |
The Midas Venice mixing console.
And not because of how it sounds (which is actually real good), or because of its feature set vs cost (which is not very good), or because of its control layout (which stinks on ice).
No, it's because shitty clubs can install one of these things and advertise, "WE HAVE A MIDAS!" and of course the rest of the rigs sucks in ways that have yet to be invented.
Yes, of course I'm referring to all of those Ludlow St-area venues in NYC like Pianos and Arlenes.
-a
Post by: Collin Donohue on January 28, 2010, 05:48:22 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 16:42 | ||
The Midas Venice mixing console. And not because of how it sounds (which is actually real good), or because of its feature set vs cost (which is not very good), or because of its control layout (which stinks on ice). No, it's because shitty clubs can install one of these things and advertise, "WE HAVE A MIDAS!" and of course the rest of the rigs sucks in ways that have yet to be invented. Yes, of course I'm referring to all of those Ludlow St-area venues in NYC like Pianos and Arlenes. -a |
I agree on the Midas Venice, but it's the layout that bugs the crap out of me! Used it twice. Hated it both times. Avoid it like the plague!
That is, unless there are NO aux sends needed. Just mains.
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on January 28, 2010, 05:48:53 PM
Evan
Post by: Nathan Lehouillier on January 28, 2010, 06:13:49 PM
Nate
KDS&L
Post by: Marsellus Fariss on January 28, 2010, 06:16:32 PM
Also, I totally agree with the Venice complaints. The layout is amazingly bad for such a respected company. And they're obviously not interested in updating it either. They do other silly things like not putting channel numbers on the rear of large format consoles so you have to label them yourself or have no idea what channel your patching into.
You know the Venice does sound good though and I really can't hate gear that sounds good. I'd rather mix on a Venice then most Mackies. And in small/medium club land a Venice is kind of a luxury. I CAN hate using it though.
Post by: Marsellus Fariss on January 28, 2010, 06:19:28 PM
| Nathan Lehouillier wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 17:13 |
PV SP2G and Black Widow 1801. Any homemade "sub" with EV 18B. 18B is not a sub driver boy's and girls. Nate KDS&L |
Here here! ANY SP2! Damn Peavey for building unkillable bad sounding gear that never ever ever dies but just hangs by chains in shitty clubs for decades pumping out crap!
Sorry, got a little worked up there.
/Rant
Post by: Nathan Lehouillier on January 28, 2010, 06:26:20 PM
Nate
KDS&L
Post by: James Feenstra on January 28, 2010, 06:32:56 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 17:42 | ||
The Midas Venice mixing console. And not because of how it sounds (which is actually real good), or because of its feature set vs cost (which is not very good), or because of its control layout (which stinks on ice). No, it's because shitty clubs can install one of these things and advertise, "WE HAVE A MIDAS!" and of course the rest of the rigs sucks in ways that have yet to be invented. Yes, of course I'm referring to all of those Ludlow St-area venues in NYC like Pianos and Arlenes. -a |
Post by: Andy Peters on January 28, 2010, 06:44:08 PM
| Marsellus Fariss wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 16:19 |
Here here! ANY SP2! Damn Peavey for building unkillable bad sounding gear that never ever ever dies but just hangs by chains in shitty clubs for decades pumping out crap! |
Heh heh heh, here in Tucson there really is a shitty club (the Surly Wench) with SP2s hanging by chains pumping out crap.
I am not kidding.
-a
(edit: added name of venue, because I always ask people to name the shit.)
Post by: Nathan Lehouillier on January 28, 2010, 06:50:26 PM
Nate
KDS&L
Post by: Gus Housen on January 28, 2010, 06:52:07 PM
Why is it I can buy a crappy speaker cabinet for $80 but a 6 sided box with fur costs more
Post by: Jonathan 'JP' Peirce on January 28, 2010, 06:53:36 PM
| Nathan Lehouillier wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 18:50 |
I Jackal was the head liner. The Pa was 12x SP2G and 8x JBL 4*** SR cubs. |
Sounds just about right.
Post by: John Neil on January 28, 2010, 06:57:45 PM
Because you are eight channels of compression AND gate, and because some house techs can only imagine themselves compressing AND gating every drum on stage, and because your gates are more useable than those combo gates that DBX provides (DBX 166, 1066, etc.), and because you come in at about $70 per channel...
I vote you as my most disliked product. In my world, every venue and every rig I work seems to have one of you - and yet only 2 to 4 channels of other dynamics available. Thus, I must use you.
I can see your blue face from miles away. My fingers tremble with the tactile sensation of your knobs that click as they turn. Aside from amplifier gains, no knob should click while it turns. (My digital feedback circuits are intact and working fine, thank you very much. I can tell when a knob that I am turning is turning.)
I anticipate my arrivial to your backside with a quick check to set all of the level switches in the uniform setting...as I expect that during safe transport to the venue, various insert snakes have played friendly with your switches while bouncing down the road.
Yet, for instances where I must compress on a stereo subgroup pair, you cannot provide me with two channels of similarly behaving dynamics. Or even one channel where UNITY GAIN means UNITY GAIN. By the way, UNITY GAIN MEANS UNITY GAIN.
DBX 166 or 160 with push switches that don't work, I'll take you all day long and simply use a dedicated gate when I actually need one. You realize that quick wedding reception soundchecks allow me time to troubleshoot at most, two small sonic issues. Dynamics should not be one of them, and certainly not both.
Post by: John Neil on January 28, 2010, 07:03:25 PM
M-One. Reliability is a virtue. My best friends are reliable. My best equipment is reliable. And yet, your most reliable trait is not your failure, but the manner of your failure. I can't very well find your presets when your display is dead. But atleast, as reliable as you are, I know it's coming.
For those keeping score at home, that's three for three.
Post by: John Halliburton on January 28, 2010, 07:05:08 PM
| Marsellus Fariss wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 17:19 | ||
Here here! ANY SP2! Damn Peavey for building unkillable bad sounding gear that never ever ever dies but just hangs by chains in shitty clubs for decades pumping out crap! Sorry, got a little worked up there. /Rant |
I agree with the SP2, I have to mix on a pair for hours once each Summer at a festival here in Grant Park. Been doing this for eleven years. Powered by CS800 amps, and cheap house brand eq's from Sam Ash. Someday....
John
Post by: Marsellus Fariss on January 28, 2010, 07:17:31 PM
"Too big, too ugly, too heavy, too Peavey."
Post by: Dave Unger on January 28, 2010, 07:31:40 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 16:42 | ||
The Midas Venice mixing console. And not because of how it sounds (which is actually real good), or because of its feature set vs cost (which is not very good), or because of its control layout (which stinks on ice). No, it's because shitty clubs can install one of these things and advertise, "WE HAVE A MIDAS!" and of course the rest of the rigs sucks in ways that have yet to be invented. Yes, of course I'm referring to all of those Ludlow St-area venues in NYC like Pianos and Arlenes. -a |
I spend all summer mixing on one, and yes, it sounds fine. The layout pisses me off every time I use it. Even Beringer labels auxes as auxes!
I'd rather have a Venice than a fucking GL2200, which is in fact my least favorite piece of gear.
Post by: Dan Richardson on January 28, 2010, 07:58:11 PM
Post by: Phillip_Graham on January 28, 2010, 08:06:12 PM
Post by: John Neil on January 28, 2010, 08:21:31 PM
| Phillip Graham wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 19:06 |
Yamaha GA series mixers. So lame, especially compared to Yamaha's normal trademark durability. |
Really? I know of a local GA32/12 that keeps plugging along. It literally has holes in the roadcase laminate from impacts taken. Channel two gain pot is scratchy, but who needs snare in their wedges anyway?
It has its quirks, like no channel meters and no markers on the EQ adjustments (well, you're somewhere between 80 and 8k, that's close enough, right?) but far worse a MI level console could appear in monitor land.
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on January 28, 2010, 08:26:13 PM
Post by: Art Welter on January 28, 2010, 08:31:33 PM
Look similar to SM 58, sound like crap.
Back when these came out I once spent about 10 minutes tuning a PA using one of these mikes, thinking it was an SM 58. After I had “corrected” about a half dozen serious frequency problems, and the PA still sounded like crap, I looked closer and realized the mike was not an SM 58.
Plugged in a beat up SM 58, the PA tuning continued, resulting in the normal notches at the crossover points and room boom.
Post by: RYAN LOUDMUSIC JENKINS on January 28, 2010, 08:38:59 PM
WHAT I ABSOLUTELY HATE IS THOSE STUPID KRANK GUITAR AMPS THAT EVERY WANNABE COOKIE MONSTER BAND IN PHOENIX USES THESE DAYS!!!!!! They have the worst tone period unless you want to have a spike thrust into your forehead in which they are the perfect amp. You can not place them in a mix no matter what SPL the guitar player has them at. I have never been able to put one of them into a mix and have it sound good. No when to say when to too much midrange crap!
I'll take the SP2s, the 3630s, ACP88s, hell I'll even mix on old Peavey PA400 powered mixers, I don't care, but do not bring a Krank guitar amp to my gigs.
Post by: Paul Bell on January 28, 2010, 08:42:49 PM
I had two small to medium sized Soundcraft consoles drop dead at mission critical moment. Different dates, different gigs, different consoles.
Never. Ever. Again. Will I purchase/own a Soundcraft product.
Burn me once, twice, there won't be a chance of a third time.
Post by: John T. Cotton on January 28, 2010, 08:50:10 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 17:42 |
The Midas Venice mixing console. And not because of how it sounds (which is actually real good), or because of its feature set vs cost (which is not very good), or because of its control layout (which stinks on ice). No, it's because shitty clubs can install one of these things and advertise, "WE HAVE A MIDAS!" and of course the rest of the rigs sucks in ways that have yet to be invented. -a |
Ha! LOL, the ridiculous, juvenile layout and the absurd cost were enough to tick me off from the get go.
Post by: Dick Rees on January 28, 2010, 08:52:56 PM
Thank you very much.
Post by: Darren Brown on January 28, 2010, 09:00:22 PM
Sure it's 8 gates or comps in 3U(i think), but I have yet to come across one that has all dynamics in it working. And similar to the Presonus ACP88 that John Mentioned, don't even bother using it over stereo groups; no-two channels of dynamics act the same.
The most annoying thing are the latches on the gates. You can hear them working. There is no subtlety at all; and it's a mission trying to get them to stop flapping continuously without with gates being brutally obvious.
But, still better than nothing a wee toilet with nothing else.
Post by: Tom faderjockey Brandis on January 28, 2010, 09:08:04 PM
Tom
Post by: Steve Payne on January 28, 2010, 09:11:37 PM
Post by: Bennett Prescott on January 28, 2010, 09:15:45 PM
| Darren Brown wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 21:00 |
Many may disagree with me; but I really don't like the KT Square One. |
No solution that tries to cram that much control into that little space will be successful. While the KT Square One does at least have the advantage over the Presonus ACP88 in that it works reliably, it also has some totally incomprehensible controls. Why waste the space for all that silly shit when you could have given me a larger threshold knob, or maybe some silkscreening that made sense?
Post by: Ian Hunt on January 28, 2010, 09:20:10 PM
| Marsellus Fariss wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 16:34 |
Just one piece of gear not "digital consoles" or "all ###inger." For me it's the Alesis 3630 comp that pumps like Swartzenegger at an all night gym. Just the site of one makes me want to unplug it and set fire to it and dance around like Nero. The MEQ is pretty bad too. |
The last one that needed an 'inshow' reboot!
Ian
Edit: finger issues
Post by: Stuart Pendleton on January 28, 2010, 09:34:14 PM
Post by: Winston Gamble on January 28, 2010, 09:43:57 PM
Winston
Post by: Vince Emondi on January 28, 2010, 09:44:31 PM
Post by: Vince Emondi on January 28, 2010, 09:46:11 PM
Post by: Jason Dermer on January 28, 2010, 09:46:37 PM
Post by: Grant Conklin on January 28, 2010, 09:49:18 PM
| Phillip Graham wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 19:06 |
Yamaha GA series mixers. So lame, especially compared to Yamaha's normal trademark durability. |
-1
Post by: Mike Southard on January 28, 2010, 10:12:15 PM
And it does sound great as a kick drum mic. Right up until you move it 3mm too close to the beater, then it gets $400 worth of quiet.
So I have one. But I won't use it. And I don't want to sell it.
I hate it.
Post by: Craig Leerman on January 28, 2010, 10:19:30 PM
Post by: Andy Peters on January 28, 2010, 10:23:59 PM
| Craig Leerman wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 20:19 |
I would vote for the Yamaha MG mixers as well. In one word, YUCK! |
The MG mixers are cheap, and are sold as cheap, so it's unreasonable to expect anything other than cheap.
The M3000, on the other hand, managed to outdo the Mackie SR48 in that it had crappy VCAs and the crappy bus/aux structure, in addition to having a flex-o-matic chassis. And the VCAs were the big selling point, as in trying to make it a big-boy mixer for those on a budget.
-a
Post by: Shane Presley on January 28, 2010, 10:44:39 PM
| Craig Leerman wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 22:19 |
I would vote for the Yamaha MG mixers as well. In one word, YUCK! |
I have a GA32, it's worked fine 100%, no crosstalk, or any other complaint that seems to filter around here... I guess there are lemons like anything else... My gripe about that console is they only have 28 mic inputs, and split it at ch 12? WTF? Didn't anyone tell them it would be mainly used as a monitor console..frig
and oh, I hate moving large lifts.. sumner eventers, l-16's whatever, PITA
Post by: Rick Stansby on January 28, 2010, 10:56:37 PM
Followed closely by the previously mentioned Midas Venice.
Post by: Tim Weaver on January 28, 2010, 10:56:49 PM
Post by: Mike Smith on January 28, 2010, 11:09:00 PM
Speaking of Yamaha, those old Q2031 dual 1/3 octave EQs everybody used to use. Another case of higher expectations. More disappointment in less rack space.
Audio Logic MT44 gates and MT66 comp limiters. Clicky gates and murky limiting. What you get when you put lipstick on DOD gear and try to move up the food chain.
Stewart power amps. Not just the little 1/2 rack ones that looked (and worked) like car stereo plate amps. The 2 space lightweight "pro" amps would shut off if you smacked them hard when they drove a 4 ohm load. Folded up like cheap lawn chairs.
Post by: Ken Freeman on January 28, 2010, 11:28:20 PM
Ken
Post by: Jamie Taylor on January 28, 2010, 11:56:54 PM
Hard as hell to use and they filters sound god-aweful. Thank the lord I've only had to use one twice. I'd rather NO GEQ.
Post by: Luis Pinzón Arroyo on January 29, 2010, 12:30:30 AM
YAMAHA Q2031.
HORIZON DB-1.
Latches on SKB cases.
If I have to choose only one, undoubtedly M3000.
Post by: Randy Frierson on January 29, 2010, 12:42:03 AM
model #..you all know which one...
Post by: Ales Dravinec 'Alex' on January 29, 2010, 01:53:29 AM
| Stuart Pendleton wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 02:34 |
Beta58. When I see one being used for vocals, I cringe. I would rather hear vocals through a SM57... |
+1
And ANY graphic EQ. I mean any! Those should be prohibited by law.
Post by: Chris Gruber on January 29, 2010, 01:53:43 AM
| Nathan Lehouillier wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 17:50 |
I wish I had a Pic. 4 years ago I supplied a mon rig for a fest Jackal was the head liner. The Pa was 12x SP2G and 8x JBL 4*** SR cubs. It was perfect for the chain saw! Nate KDS&L |
I remember that rig...It was downtown for the 4th of July next to the KI center. Horrible would be an understatement...but at least they had the speakers horn to horn in their 3 wide by 2 high(per side) config. The comb filtering was combing? Ugh.
Post by: Jason J Raboin on January 29, 2010, 06:46:18 AM
Yamaha M7
Yamaha PM5D
Shure SM58
Martin W8LM
L"acoustics ARCS (as mains)
Anything that needlessly adds a set of AD/DA conversions to the signal chain
Post by: Jim McKeveny on January 29, 2010, 07:59:00 AM
Post by: Paul Bell on January 29, 2010, 08:16:00 AM
Post by: Pat Latimer on January 29, 2010, 08:37:02 AM
Post by: Dustin Reynolds on January 29, 2010, 09:13:25 AM
Post by: Bob Leonard on January 29, 2010, 09:24:45 AM
SLS column speakers
Sonic Crapinizer
Beta 58
Cheap Lexicon reverbs
Post by: john lutz on January 29, 2010, 10:16:57 AM
Post by: Phillip_Graham on January 29, 2010, 10:27:11 AM
| Andy Peters wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 22:23 |
The M3000, on the other hand, managed to outdo the Mackie SR48 in that it had crappy VCAs and the crappy bus/aux structure, in addition to having a flex-o-matic chassis. And the VCAs were the big selling point, as in trying to make it a big-boy mixer for those on a budget. -a |
I forgot about the M3000, that HAS to supplant the GA series as Yamaha's worst mixer product. There is one in the GT PAC.
The case may as well polyethylene it flexes so much, and the flip bus structure is a mess.
So I retract my GA mixer and replace it with the M3000.
I never had a bad day on a Mackie SR48 that had the ubiquitous ribbon cable problem taken care of.
Post by: Nick Enright on January 29, 2010, 10:54:04 AM
Post by: Lee Douglas on January 29, 2010, 10:58:14 AM
Post by: Joe Brugnoni on January 29, 2010, 11:24:45 AM
My least favorites gear, Provided movers/help by promotors!
My least favorite. Arrogant people who dont even try to work with what is there, when the rest of us must
Post by: Pascal Pincosy on January 29, 2010, 11:26:23 AM
| Shane Presley wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 19:44 |
and oh, I hate moving large lifts.. sumner eventers, l-16's whatever, PITA |
Thank god I still have all my fingers! No more Supertowers for me!
Anybody get the privilege of figuring out that these suckers don't fit in a short box standing up? That was awesome!
Post by: Jason Dermer on January 29, 2010, 11:45:34 AM
The funny part is that it only seems to work on less than stellar bands. Leaving it inline when you have good signal coming off of the deck causes the opposite effect, your good clean mix turns to mud.
One of these days I'll get my Hawaiian shirted systems tech to measure what the thing is doing, but in the meantime I'm sticking with if it sounds good, it is good.
Post by: Adam Robinson on January 29, 2010, 11:57:34 AM
Yamaha M7CL
and that silver Behringer DI that's trying to be that blue BSS I own
Post by: Matt Tudor on January 29, 2010, 12:19:27 PM
| Phillip Graham wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 19:06 |
Yamaha GA series mixers. So lame, especially compared to Yamaha's normal trademark durability. |
We had a gig a while back, the BE told me when he advanced the show that he didn't care what the FOH mixer was, as long as it was analog. No digital mixer was acceptable, blah, blah, blah. He shows up day of show, and I've got our GA32/10 out front and he looks at it, shakes his head and asks if there's another mixer available. Only our LS9-32.... He went digital.
On a console like that, why not put direct outs on the back and do normal push-button group assigns like everyone else?
Post by: Joe Brugnoni on January 29, 2010, 01:24:57 PM
Post by: Gary Perrett on January 29, 2010, 01:33:44 PM
They discontinued them so fast I bet it sucked the air out of plant when they pulled the trigger...
Post by: Tom Reid on January 29, 2010, 01:45:34 PM
Alesis Midiverb
Any guitar wireless
Post by: Guy Johnson on January 29, 2010, 02:13:16 PM
Post by: Christian Tepfer on January 29, 2010, 02:38:24 PM
I'd like to add every other Yamaha desk, except PM5D and PM1D.
In the order of dislike: GA series, M series, LS9, PM series. The MG series doesn't qualify for being hated.
SM 57 except for snare top.
Any analog or digital piece of gear in bad shape. I should start to write invoices for upgrading digital desks to current (and useful) firmwares. Could make a fortune...
Post by: Charlie Zureki on January 29, 2010, 02:43:33 PM
Cheap wireless instrument rigs.
Plexi drum surrounds...yeah, we need them sometimes, but I still hate them.
Snake heads/Stage Boxes that have the channel number below it's connector.... in a hurry..and you can read the bloody thing.
Tiny silk-screened lettering/numbering on outboard equipment.
Broken casters on road boxes
CD players intended for Foh walk-in music.
Drummers that use a crappy piece of carpet under their kit, that looks like they found it by the side of the road.
Arkansas road cases....Come-Onnn...at least break down and buy a plastic tub or build a plywood box.
Fender Passport!
Old JBL amps with the crossover card.
Studio Master.
Anything made by Kustom
Traynor Bass Cabinets
Deep-bowl Ovation Acoustic Guitars
Biamp Mixing consoles
Bose Music stick-thing with the subwoofer
Hammer
Post by: Andy Peters on January 29, 2010, 02:55:04 PM
| Adam Robinson wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 09:57 |
and that silver Behringer DI that's trying to be that blue BSS I own |
The great sage Yoda once said, "There is no try. There is only do, and do not."
The Behringer piece is a do not.
And there's something even worse. Behringer has a two-channel active DI that's about the size of a matchbox. It is a hiss generator. It is unusable. Of course, what do you expect for a $30 two-channel active DI?
And this thing is so wimpy you can't even use it to prop up a wedge or keep a door open.
-a
Post by: Mack McLaughlin on January 29, 2010, 02:57:38 PM
Post by: Lou Castellucci on January 29, 2010, 02:58:43 PM
Post by: Jason Dermer on January 29, 2010, 03:27:41 PM
edit: clarity
Post by: Lou Castellucci on January 29, 2010, 03:31:43 PM
Post by: Evan Kirkendall on January 29, 2010, 03:37:04 PM
| Lou Castellucci wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 14:58 |
I HATE JBL Vertec. Better Audio Through Marketing. There are so many better boxes out there. I feel like people have been brain washed or given such stupid discounts to use these things they have had no other choices, but sonicly Vertec pale in comparison to the rest of the pack. |
I was that guy once.
Then I started carrying V4 settings on a thumb drive and convincing people that it was worth their time to upgrade.
With some minor tweaking on the high end, they actually sound really good. The DP models sound great, and you really can't mess them up.
As long as they are properly deployed, and I have enough of them, I know I'll have a good show. Sure, theres a lot more chance to have a bad VT rig then many others, but I now believe they can sound pretty damn good.
Evan
Post by: Ken Freeman on January 29, 2010, 03:41:54 PM
Ken
Post by: Matthew Haber on January 29, 2010, 03:54:12 PM
Post by: Andy Peters on January 29, 2010, 03:59:27 PM
| Matthew Haber wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 13:54 |
i have gone as far as bringing my own snake, o1v96, and set of JBLs for free just so i don't have to touch their crap. |
See, you're just encouraging bad behavior.
Charge what your gear is worth.
-a
Post by: Rob Warren on January 29, 2010, 04:07:52 PM
| Quote: |
And there's something even worse. Behringer has a two-channel active DI that's about the size of a matchbox. It is a hiss generator. It is unusable. Of course, what do you expect for a $30 two-channel active DI? |
Andy,
that's not hiss. that is exclusively generated noise for independent channel calibration.
Post by: Rob Warren on January 29, 2010, 04:17:02 PM
| Quote: |
Shure PG 58. Look similar to SM 58, sound like crap. |
+1 on that. sucky sucky.
Post by: Matt Bauer on January 29, 2010, 04:28:15 PM
Post by: Stavross (Sam Buck) on January 29, 2010, 04:58:36 PM
| Charlie Zureki wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 13:43 |
Anything made by Kustom |
Their bass heads make decent pillows.
Post by: Matthew Haber on January 29, 2010, 05:03:40 PM
See, you're just encouraging bad behavior.
Charge what your gear is worth.
-a[/quote]
To clarify: I would never bring that kind of gear free for a paying client. I would just refuse a gig which only had a passport. The time i brought my own rig to avoid one was when i was doing a pro-bono gig anyway.
Post by: Bob Leonard on January 29, 2010, 05:17:30 PM
| Evan Kirkendall wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 15:37 | ||
I was that guy once. Then I started carrying V4 settings on a thumb drive and convincing people that it was worth their time to upgrade. With some minor tweaking on the high end, they actually sound really good. The DP models sound great, and you really can't mess them up. As long as they are properly deployed, and I have enough of them, I know I'll have a good show. Sure, theres a lot more chance to have a bad VT rig then many others, but I now believe they can sound pretty damn good. Evan |
Evan,
You just made my fucking day.
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on January 29, 2010, 05:25:15 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 14:59 | ||
See, you're just encouraging bad behavior. Charge what your gear is worth. -a |
Sometimes it is in your best interest to bring some extra gear even if your out a little money because your name is on the product, which is the SOUND QUALITY. You should always strive to get paid what you're worth, but sometimes a gig is a gig and money is better than twiddling your thumbs. I was once asked to run sound in my hometown for a band that claimed to have their own P.A. for an outdoor parking lot show. When I showed up they had a 16 channel console sitting on top of 3 Nady power amps sitting on the pavement in front of the stage with a pile of various cables. No EQ's, No Xovers, No Comps, No Efx, No roadcases/racks or anything.They also had a couple of yamaha club series speakers/monitors..etc... I walked up and they said here ya go! I was like you gotta be kidding me!!! So since it was a charity event I told them I would go get my own system and come back and I did....the moral of the story...is it worth it to you to use some of your own gear to avoid a nightmare
Post by: Mark Sexton on January 29, 2010, 06:23:04 PM
1+ on the B!#$%!#$^ active DIs and Passports, though they do function well for what we use them for, basically "expendable" systems for student groups to use.
I love when the magnets fall off the frames of the passport speakers because they've been dropped too many times......
Post by: Jason Tubbs on January 29, 2010, 06:24:02 PM
Maybe the problem is deployment, but I have never mixed on a 650 rig that wasn't all honk and icepick.
jt
Post by: Jeff Suchy on January 29, 2010, 06:43:19 PM
-TT24
-D8B
-Tascam MX2424
-Behringer ADA8000
-Any tripod mic stand with a plastic base
-3630
-166 or 266
-The purple clutch on Ultimate TS-90's (would be cool if they continued to function)
-Behringer ADA8000
-Any digital processor that doesn't have more than a couple feet of output delay
-The little clips on cheap case rack rails
-ADAT M20 (been a long time, but the resentment lingers)
-Venice (sound quality win, labeling and layout fail)
-Non L4E6S mic cables
-Behringer ADA8000
-Some days, wireless anything
-Mics with switches
-414 shockmounts
-Old XLR's (black boot w/ a set screw)
-Not that a Heritage or equivalent would upset me, but just about any analog console is fairly annoying.
-Digital consoles w/ manual preamp knobs and/or none moving faders
-Behringer ADA8000
Post by: Paul Bell on January 29, 2010, 06:58:51 PM
So, I'm thinking you're not so keen on using a Behringer ADA8000?
Post by: Callan Carnahan on January 29, 2010, 07:10:06 PM
| Jason Tubbs wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 18:24 |
I hate the KF 650. Maybe the problem is deployment, but I have never mixed on a 650 rig that wasn't all honk and icepick. jt |
+1...again, maybe it was deployment, but I've mixed 2 separate scenarios with KF650's over SB850 subs....nah, come to think, one had JBL SR(X?) subs...anyway, I just did NOT like the sound. Honk and icepick sounds about right. Processing or deployment or whatever, I didn't like it.
Post by: Callan Carnahan on January 29, 2010, 07:10:53 PM
Post by: Jeff Wheeler on January 29, 2010, 07:25:54 PM
| Gary Perrett wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 12:33 |
JBL TR225...just about every band around here uses those shit piles They discontinued them so fast I bet it sucked the air out of plant when they pulled the trigger... |
Those are my drum monitors. Only because I got them for $50ea.
Post by: John Chiara on January 29, 2010, 08:41:32 PM
| Stuart Pendleton wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 21:34 |
Beta58. When I see one being used for vocals, I cringe. I would rather hear vocals through a SM57... |
And I have singer I mix/record that sounds great with a B58...go figure.
Post by: John Chiara on January 29, 2010, 08:53:09 PM
| Brandon Blakeney wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 17:25 | ||||
Sometimes it is in your best interest to bring some extra gear even if your out a little money because your name is on the product, which is the SOUND QUALITY. |
+1
Post by: Tucker Dragoo on January 29, 2010, 08:56:13 PM
Cheap DI's and Mic cables
Mackie Mixers - I bring my O1V96v2, High end XLR's and my mic pack to every gig regardless... just in case.
Post by: John Chiara on January 29, 2010, 08:56:17 PM
| Jeff Suchy wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 18:43 |
-ADAT M20 (been a long time, but the resentment linger. |
As far as ADATs go...and I owned a bunch...these were like Mercedes compared to the Black Faces. And through many long years I never lost a lick of audio...even when having to hand rewind many yards of crumpled tape.
Post by: Andy Peters on January 29, 2010, 09:14:23 PM
| Brandon Blakeney wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 15:25 | ||||
Sometimes it is in your best interest to bring some extra gear even if your out a little money because your name is on the product, which is the SOUND QUALITY. You should always strive to get paid what you're worth, but sometimes a gig is a gig and money is better than twiddling your thumbs. I was once asked to run sound in my hometown for a band that claimed to have their own P.A. for an outdoor parking lot show. When I showed up they had a 16 channel console sitting on top of 3 Nady power amps sitting on the pavement in front of the stage with a pile of various cables. No EQ's, No Xovers, No Comps, No Efx, No roadcases/racks or anything.They also had a couple of yamaha club series speakers/monitors..etc... I walked up and they said here ya go! I was like you gotta be kidding me!!! So since it was a charity event I told them I would go get my own system and come back and I did....the moral of the story...is it worth it to you to use some of your own gear to avoid a nightmare |
You were asked to do sound for a band for a charity event, and you were told that the band had their own PA which turned out to be a disaster.
Did you know this band? Who hired you?
I mean, for this sort of charity thing, it's better to just walk away -- because this is the exact sort of situation where some asshole will say, "Well, if you do this for free, there are all sorts of jobs waiting that pay well!"
And everyone's heard that line of bullshit, and there ain't no pot of gold at the end of that rainbow. Nobody in attendance at that gig was ever going to hire you for anything. Most definitely not the band that owns a piece-of-shit PA that they probably think is great. So by walking, your name is definitely not on the gig, which will not go well regardless of what you bring in.
-a
Post by: Andy Peters on January 29, 2010, 09:16:18 PM
| Jason Tubbs wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 16:24 |
I hate the KF 650. Maybe the problem is deployment, but I have never mixed on a 650 rig that wasn't all honk and icepick. |
The last 650 rig I mixed on was at Sudsy Malone's Laundry and Libations in Cincinnati in like 1995.
The "mixer" was a 12-channel Seck.
-a
Post by: Craig Leerman on January 29, 2010, 11:09:52 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 19:23 | ||
The MG mixers are cheap, and are sold as cheap, so it's unreasonable to expect anything other than cheap. |
Not true. Mackie and Soundcraft, among others all make small mixers in the same price range and they seem to work for my applications (corporate audio / AV sends, etc. The MG stuff just sounds bad, distorts easily, the meters are not anywhere close to being accurate, and I have had at least 3 of them fail on simple speech gigs. I have yet to have a Mackie or Soundcraft fail on me, and they sound fine.
| Quote: |
The M3000, on the other hand, managed to outdo the Mackie SR48 in that it had crappy VCAs and the crappy bus/aux structure, in addition to having a flex-o-matic chassis. And the VCAs were the big selling point, as in trying to make it a big-boy mixer for those on a budget. |
Never mixed on one of those. My gigs tend to be either really small corporate speech gigs where I need just a few inputs, or really large general session gigs where I need a real large frame console with lots of inputs and outputs.
On the small gigs, I am seeing a lot of AV companies buying those horrible MG mixers, instead of Mackies to save a few bucks. They will spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on projectors and video gear, and spend thousands on top of the line wireless, but skimp on the mixers, and wired microphones. You know, the microphones with the cable permanently attached!
Post by: Tim McCulloch on January 30, 2010, 01:30:12 AM
| Bob Leonard wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 16:17 | ||||
Evan, You just made my fucking day. |
We're throwing a "Welcome to the Dark Side" party for Evan. 8400 Balboa, Northridge CA. Date TBA.
V4 convinced a number of folks to reconsider VerTec. I was one of them. Now we own a few.
Have fun, good luck.
Tim Mc
Post by: Rafi Singer on January 30, 2010, 02:18:09 AM
Many of the products by On Stage Stands fall into another category of gear that I avoid like the plague. They are living example of "you get what you pay for."
Another thing that yanks my chain is any board that only has one sweepable mid. Nothing spells fun like trying to decide which frequency gets taken care of at the channel and which happens at the graph.
Post by: Charlie Zureki on January 30, 2010, 07:40:59 AM
| Andy Peters wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 20:14 |
You were asked to do sound for a band for a charity event, and you were told that the band had their own PA which turned out to be a disaster. Did you know this band? Who hired you? I mean, for this sort of charity thing, it's better to just walk away -- because this is the exact sort of situation where some asshole will say, "Well, if you do this for free, there are all sorts of jobs waiting that pay well!" And everyone's heard that line of bullshit, and there ain't no pot of gold at the end of that rainbow. Nobody in attendance at that gig was ever going to hire you for anything. Most definitely not the band that owns a piece-of-shit PA that they probably think is great. So by walking, your name is definitely not on the gig, which will not go well regardless of what you bring in. -a |
+1
While we're tempted to make our life easier and give better results on a gig by bringing our own equipment; you'll find yourself resenting the whole situation.
They (customer) wouldn't care if you brought a 500k rig and gave them studio-like results. The next time, they'd expect nothing less... except the amount they paid you.
Good Luck,
Hammer
Post by: Guy Johnson on January 30, 2010, 08:06:09 AM
So I always bring mics, leads, stands, a basic rack with EQ dynamics & FX, a compact mixer, and a small PA + wedges. It makes life so much easier, and you don't get to look a fool making crap sounds ... The Public, Promoters, Musos etc. will remember you and the "bad sound" otherwise.
In other words, bring some stuff to make gigs work well. I've picked up quite a bit of work, that way.
Post by: Paul Bell on January 30, 2010, 09:32:51 AM
Of course, I don't suggest you fly a line array rig but bring what will do the job without putting you out.
I do believe that every good job leads to another.
EG: Somebody saw me doing decent sound for a charity event, he spoke with the client and was told I'm a good guy. He in turn gets my card and months down the line, hires me for his event.
If I was disgruntled doing the charity event, the sound sucked, I was being difficult and nobody was happy, not only would I not get that next job but I might lose any other jobs with the charity organizer for non-charity events.
Post by: jason misterka on January 30, 2010, 10:57:34 AM
I'd rather ring out a lav mic with the channel strip.
+1 on the m-one and acp-88 and ANY lifts that I've ever used.
btw, if you didn't know already: "The ACP88 is the dopest thing ever for managing gain across multiple devices in a home studio environment (like lots of unpredictable analog gear in a techno project studio). It's also great for surround systems, crossovered' pa's, all kinds of stuff. great piece of kit!"
- email from Andy W., user in California
Jason
Post by: Jason Phair on January 30, 2010, 02:10:44 PM
-Agreed on the Venice
-As for the M3000....used to have one, and it never failed, so I have a soft spot for it, I'm afraid.
I'll add:
-Any Soundcraft I've ever used that wasn't a Series 5
-I used to put Vertec on this list, but since V4....well, it's one of my favourites now.
-Rane PSU's that use that goddamn phone plug.
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on January 30, 2010, 04:07:38 PM
But I will take a GL2200 over a Venice anytime....
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on January 30, 2010, 04:36:31 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 20:14 | ||||||
You were asked to do sound for a band for a charity event, and you were told that the band had their own PA which turned out to be a disaster. Did you know this band? Who hired you? I mean, for this sort of charity thing, it's better to just walk away -- because this is the exact sort of situation where some asshole will say, "Well, if you do this for free, there are all sorts of jobs waiting that pay well!" And everyone's heard that line of bullshit, and there ain't no pot of gold at the end of that rainbow. Nobody in attendance at that gig was ever going to hire you for anything. Most definitely not the band that owns a piece-of-shit PA that they probably think is great. So by walking, your name is definitely not on the gig, which will not go well regardless of what you bring in. -a |
What I forgot to add was that in the end the promoter ended up giving me more money than originally agreed upon because I went out of my way to make the event a success. Additionally, one of the bands playing at that event has recommended me on several occasions to other events. I guess the lesson from all this is that if you bite the bullet from time to time you can ensure a good reputation and future work
Post by: Don Boone on January 30, 2010, 05:33:40 PM
Don
Post by: Lee Brenkman on January 30, 2010, 06:28:46 PM
| jason misterka wrote on Sat, 30 January 2010 07:57 |
Has anyone said BSS Opel EQ? Jason |
I think you mean BSS "Opal"
I have had two "Opels" and they were both pretty good cars.
Post by: William Scorzo on January 30, 2010, 06:50:01 PM
The Shure SLX wireless stuff is enough to drive one mad with that silly power/mute button. At one point I installed a bunch of them when they first came out- one by one I took them out of service and replaced them with something with a normal switch. In the install world some clients are lucky they can flip the switch to turn to system on- now you expect them to deal with a cheap feeling push button switch that performs multiple functions.. YUK!
I don't even mentio the budget products here (jbl tr series, on stage mic stands, etc...) because you get what you pay for basically. Hmmm, lets see, I can buy 1 k&m mic stand or 6 on stage stands.....
Post by: Paul Bell on January 30, 2010, 07:30:22 PM
I've used K&M booms and literally gave them away. I tried and went with the Atlas PB21XEB three piece. Way better section locking knobs than the K&M and with three sections, it's longer.
The Atlas booms are double the cost of the On-Stage stands but worth it.
I used to have a load of Ultimate Support one handed mic stands. One by one, they jammed. One by one, they got tossed in the trash.
Post by: Mikey Brown on January 30, 2010, 10:15:55 PM
| Randy Frierson wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 21:42 |
i'm dating my self but the yamaha compressor, can't remember the model #..you all know which one... |
That would be the GC2020. I remember them! Wow what a POS.
Post by: jason misterka on January 31, 2010, 12:21:06 AM
I own the BSS Opal, I just don't know how to spell its name because I refuse to look at it anymore. I hid it in a short rack with the Presonis ACP-88 and has been used less then three times in two years.
Jason
Post by: Moby (Mike Diack) on January 31, 2010, 12:40:08 AM
Other things: +1 on the midas venice - never had to use one but had to service many and hate the shit sandwich design.
Small Soundcrafts which self destruct for no reason (special mentions to the Spirit 328 - nothing more depressing than seeing "reboot" halfway through a show.
Shure PG mics - look like a mic, feel like a mic - just don't sound like a mic.
Anything at all associated with DJs.
M
Post by: Guy Johnson on January 31, 2010, 06:43:17 AM
| Moby (Mike Diack) wrote on Sat, 30 January 2010 23:40 |
Anything at all associated with DJs. M |
+∞
Post by: Toby Mills on January 31, 2010, 10:05:35 PM
- Everything without balanced inputs and outputs on XLR's.
- Everything that has an external wallwart power supply.
- Non rack mount CD Players
- Anything that has been put in a SKB roadcase.
- All laptops with noisy power supplies
- Desk lamps with incandescent bulbs that always blow during the opening song.
- Anything that uses a bulb.
- Any electric guitar that is not a Les Paul or a Strat.
- Any acoustic guitar that is not a Takamine, Martin or Taylor.
- Marshall Quad boxes.
- Any piece of equipment that does not use phillips or flat head screws and requires a 'special bit' to dis-assemble 10 minutes before the doors open when it has blown the internal board mounted rail fuse which is an oddball rating.
But my specific and most hated bit of gear is by far...
- Trucks without tail lifts or ramps.
Post by: Dick Rees on January 31, 2010, 10:17:12 PM
| Toby Mills wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 21:05 |
Call me lazy but.... |
OK, lazy but. Happy now?
Post by: Andy Peters on January 31, 2010, 10:38:49 PM
| Toby Mills wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 20:05 |
- Any electric guitar that is not a Les Paul or a Strat. |
My 1981 Ibanez Artist is a MUCH better guitar than my 1996 Gibson Les Paul Special.
| Quote: |
- Any acoustic guitar that is not a Takamine, Martin or Taylor. |
My 1995 Lowden D25C is a MUCH better guitar than anything Takamine ever made, and it's seriously better than most Taylor or Martin instruments.
| Quote: |
- Any piece of equipment that does not use phillips or flat head screws and requires a 'special bit' to dis-assemble 10 minutes before the doors open when it has blown the internal board mounted rail fuse which is an oddball rating. |
Both the Philips head and slot-head screws need to be banned outright and replaced by hex or Robertson drive. Nothing like a screw that's designed to slip when overtorqued.
-a
Post by: John Cameron on January 31, 2010, 10:44:25 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 22:38 | ||
My 1995 Lowden D25C is a MUCH better guitar than anything Takamine ever made, and it's seriously better than most Taylor or Martin instruments. -a |
Most, not all
Post by: Toby Mills on January 31, 2010, 10:49:50 PM
Fair enough, "All" is duly replaced with "most", you don't come across gems like that or the guitars in Andy's collection on the road very often though.
Post by: John Norris on January 31, 2010, 11:10:10 PM
Post by: John Cameron on January 31, 2010, 11:12:43 PM
| John Norris wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 23:10 |
Nice 14th fret, John. |
The previous owner's name is John also
Post by: Brian Wynn on January 31, 2010, 11:26:16 PM
1/4" CONNECTORS
I hate 1/4" connector's who's the dumb ass who invented a connector that has no locking device and every time you plug it in it creates a direct short in your signal chain. 1/4" connectors don't even belong on guitar's. When I'm president of AES I will make it illegal to manufacture and audio device with a 1/4" connector's.
Switchcraft XLR's
Switchcraft XLR's suck ass too. Because I'm shure everyone carries a small flat head screw driver around with them on every gig. The german's have there shit together on the XLR!
Post by: Brian Wynn on January 31, 2010, 11:29:50 PM
Turn it down stupid! (me)
But I need to get my tube's hot!! ( most guitar players)
Your girlfriend just got my tube hot backstage. Now turn it down or go home. (me)
Post by: Ned Ward on January 31, 2010, 11:39:09 PM
| Toby Mills wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 19:05 |
Call me lazy but.... - Any electric guitar that is not a Les Paul or a Strat. |
Great guitars, but seems just a bit limiting. I'll keep both of my Teles, thank you. I'm sure the Gretsch fans will be OK as well.
And by throwing every Les Paul and Strat in there, you're including the dreck from the mid-to-late 70's and early 80's, which were dark, dark times for both companies in terms of quality.
Post by: John Norris on February 01, 2010, 01:02:24 AM
| Ned Ward wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 23:39 | ||
Great guitars, but seems just a bit limiting. I'll keep both of my Teles, thank you. I'm sure the Gretsch fans will be OK as well. And by throwing every Les Paul and Strat in there, you're including the dreck from the mid-to-late 70's and early 80's, which were dark, dark times for both companies in terms of quality. |
+1 for good Tele tone.
Gotta be a better than average player to make the intonation sound right, but a Tele really makes a direct connection to the soul when played well. That was typical Scorcese genius to use Roy Buchanan's version of "Sweet Dreams" for the closing of "The Departed".
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on February 01, 2010, 01:06:09 AM
| Brian Wynn wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 22:29 |
Oh ya ANY guitar amp over 50 watts. You don't need that shit. Turn it down stupid! (me) But I need to get my tube's hot!! ( most guitar players) Your girlfriend just got my tube hot backstage. Now turn it down or go home. (me) |
Epic soundman win!
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on February 01, 2010, 01:12:04 AM
| Brian Wynn wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 20:26 |
The german's have there shit together on the XLR! |
Liechtensteiners!
Post by: Tom Manchester on February 01, 2010, 01:57:53 AM
| Brian Wynn wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 23:26 |
1/4" CONNECTORS who's the dumb ass who invented a connector that has no locking device and every time you plug it in it creates a direct short in your signal chain. |
Those same morons who invented that newfangled gizmo the telephone
Post by: Chris Gruber on February 01, 2010, 03:23:48 AM
| Brian Wynn wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 22:29 |
Oh ya ANY guitar amp over 50 watts. You don't need that shit. Turn it down stupid! (me) But I need to get my tube's hot!! ( most guitar players) Your girlfriend just got my tube hot backstage. Now turn it down or go home. (me) |
Almost lost it there for a minute....Has to be one of the funniest things I've read as of late.
and the TR225's...FAIL! I know a guy that uses a pair as his guitar rig
When I get his DI'd signal(how do you mic turds?) to the board I have to hack the crap out of the EQ to get anything that even remotely resembles a decent guitar sound. I've tried telling him, but you know guitar players "but it's MY tone".
Post by: frank kayser on February 01, 2010, 09:45:50 AM
And mixers where the mute button doesn't - Some (not all) Mackie, for example, leave the aux channels on when the mute is pressed. Hell, why have a mute button at all?
Post by: Helge A. Bentsen on February 01, 2010, 12:26:25 PM
- 810 bass cabinets
- Fender Twin
- Cheap JBL wedges
- Lab-Gruppen analogue crossovers
- C-Audio amplifiers
- Not Enough Rig For The Gig!
- Not Enough Monitors For The Gig!!
- Yamaha 01V
- Yamaha DM2000
- Soundcraft Spirit (all of them!)
- JBL Vertec
- Meyer Line arrays
- Any event planner who doesn't understand that if something is impossible due to the laws of physics, then I'm not trying to be uncooperative and lazy, it's just not possible right now. Sure, go ahead and call my boss to complain about me being uncooperative because I can't make the sound from the PA stop right at the edge on the dance floor, when you want it loud up front...
Post by: Caleb Dick on February 01, 2010, 12:43:00 PM
| Toby Mills wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 19:05 |
- Any common electric guitar that is not a Les Paul, PRS, or a Strat. - Any acoustic guitar that is not a Larrivee, Taylor, or Martin. |
There, fixed it for ya
Is that a Tak you're playing? (me)
Sure is! How can you tell? (them)
Just has that {crap} sound (me)
Caleb
Post by: Jerry Turnbow on February 01, 2010, 01:21:34 PM
| Jim McKeveny wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 06:59 |
Any rack with a BBE Sonic Maximizer has me questioning the whole rig.. |
Agreed! I was wondering how far into this post I'd have to read before the "Sonic Mushalyzer" would appear.
Post by: Karl Winkler on February 01, 2010, 01:30:32 PM
JBL wedges with the bullet tweeter
Mic cables with adhesive goo on them
Masking tape
DBX 31-band 1RU EQs - nearly unusable
Alesis mixers
AKG C-1000
Cheap Yamaha PA speakers (worse than Peavey IMO)
Mostly, I've been fortunate to have worked with good gear. The above list represents attempts to use those items and finding them difficult to get a good sound with.
Post by: Marsellus Fariss on February 01, 2010, 09:06:41 PM
Post by: Geoff Doane on February 01, 2010, 09:17:33 PM
| Tony "T" Tissot wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 02:12 | ||
Liechtensteiners! |
Or is it the Swiss?
If the Germans were in charge of microphone connectors, we'd be using Tuchels. I don't think you want to go there
.Some of my earliest audio memories are of assembling Switchcraft or Cannon XLRs, and having that small screwdriver slip and gouge my hand
. I can't say I was all that thrilled with the first generation of Neutrik connectors, but I'm a big fan now.GTD
Oh yeah, the hate list: Midas Venice (open it up and it looks like a Mackie), Yamaha GC2020 (Don Boomer described it perfectly), Soundcraft "padless" mic pres, cheap mic cables that don't make it through the first set, XLR inputs or outputs that aren't really balanced (hell, spend a nickel on a resistor, and at least impedance balance it!).
Post by: Jason Phair on February 01, 2010, 09:54:24 PM
| Brian Wynn wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 23:26 |
Switchcraft XLR's Switchcraft XLR's suck ass too. Because I'm shure everyone carries a small flat head screw driver around with them on every gig. The german's have there shit together on the XLR! |
It's already been pointed out that Neutrik is not a German company, but I'd like to ask what soundguy doesn't carry a set of jeweler's to a gig? (though yeah, it'd be nice to to have to I guess)
Post by: Jerry Turnbow on February 01, 2010, 10:14:54 PM
When someone from the audience complains that they can't hear the [<guitar><mandolin><fiddle><bass vocal> . . etc] (pick one) there's not a cotton-picking thing I can do about it.
Disclaimer: I have seen one or two professional groups pull it off well, but they are few and far between, at least in my area.
(Confessions from a control freak)
Post by: John Cameron on February 01, 2010, 10:18:10 PM
| Jerry Turnbow wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 22:14 |
I guess the one I hate to see is that single LD condensor that some of these bluegrass groups try to use because it looks "retro", but they have no concept of the inverse square law and the need to move in and out to balance vocals, solos, etc. When someone from the audience complains that they can't hear the [<guitar><mandolin><fiddle><bass vocal> . . etc] (pick one) there's not a cotton-picking thing I can do about it. Disclaimer: I have seen one or two professional groups pull it off well, but they are few and far between, at least in my area. (Confessions from a control freak) |
Post by: Dick Rees on February 01, 2010, 10:27:08 PM
| Jerry Turnbow wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 21:14 |
I guess the one I hate to see is that single LD condensor that some of these bluegrass groups try to use because it looks "retro", but they have no concept of the inverse square law and the need to move in and out to balance vocals, solos, etc. When someone from the audience complains that they can't hear the [<guitar><mandolin><fiddle><bass vocal> . . etc] (pick one) there's not a cotton-picking thing I can do about it. Disclaimer: I have seen one or two professional groups pull it off well, but they are few and far between, at least in my area. (Confessions from a control freak) |
1. The one they insist on using is "real good" and cost $75 new.
2. They've lost the proprietary shock mount.
3. It travels loose rattling around in the banjo case, has a pronounced peak in the response around 6.3K.......and little else.
BTDT
Post by: Steve Hurt on February 02, 2010, 12:05:09 AM
(I do have a 73 Les Paul Deluxe and a few Strats for those who can't handle a Tele)
| John Norris wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 01:02 | ||||
+1 for good Tele tone. Gotta be a better than average player to make the intonation sound right, but a Tele really makes a direct connection to the soul when played well. That was typical Scorcese genius to use Roy Buchanan's version of "Sweet Dreams" for the closing of "The Departed". |
Post by: Walter Wright on February 02, 2010, 02:03:07 AM
| Steve Hurt wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 00:05 |
Tele's rock! (I do have a 73 Les Paul Deluxe and a few Strats for those who can't handle a Tele) |
slightly OT, but what i hate? that guitar stand to the right in this picture!
that's the ol' hamilton hanger, which is very stable and folds up small, a great design, until the soft foam rubber covering that hard, square-edged metal "fork" starts to recede from the ends and wear through (you can see the metal ends poking out in the picture); i didn't notice until after a few years of gigs with these things, when i discovered that my 62RI tele and my 58RI les paul had dings and gouges all over the back of their necks.
hercules makes a new version that's a similar design but way more finish-friendly.
Post by: Steve Blaski on February 02, 2010, 02:20:17 AM
| Caleb Dick wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 11:43 | ||
There, fixed it for ya Is that a Tak you're playing? (me) Sure is! How can you tell? (them) Just has that {crap} sound (me) Caleb |
Glad to know I'm not the only one who hasn't heard a good Takamine, at least, one with a good pickup. IME, the Taylor has the best sounding pickups.
+1 on Fender Passports. What were they thinking making colors for the EQ section? What's wrong with just numbers? Very confusing to someone who doesn't have time to RTM before using it.
Post by: Dave Dermont on February 02, 2010, 09:03:21 AM
If you don't know which posts they are, it's probably due to your lack of experience.
Dave "only a poor craftsman blames his tools" Dermont
Post by: Paul Bell on February 02, 2010, 09:22:20 AM
However, my dislike of anything Soundcraft comes from two different consoles dying at the wrong time on different events.
Sometimes, it is the choice of poor tools that can sink a job.
Post by: Jason Dermer on February 02, 2010, 09:50:31 AM
| Steve Hurt wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 00:05 |
Swerving the other way, I hate that I have, through the years, invested in much of the same or similar recording and playback gear that you have in the racks there. But nowadays most of it has so little value and market demand that I can't sell it because what I would get for it would barely pay for a one time rental for the rare times that I need it. The one exception being the 2" Ampex deck that I sold for WAY more than I paid for it.
Post by: Guy Johnson on February 02, 2010, 10:18:48 AM
| Dick Rees wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 21:27 |
1. The one they insist on using is "real good" and cost $75 new. 2. They've lost the proprietary shock mount. 3. It travels loose rattling around in the banjo case, has a pronounced peak in the response around 6.3K.......and little else. BTDT |
4. The mic will be fixed patten.
5. The band can't do 'the dance' around the mic.
6. The band, or its leader has it's mind set in stone: "Don't confuse me with facts, my mind is made up", so no suggestions on how to make the sound better than thin and shit will be accepted as other than heresy.
7. They won't allow the bass to be miked or DI'd.
8. AARRGHHHhhhhhh!
Post by: Charlie Zureki on February 02, 2010, 01:38:37 PM
| Stavross (Sam Buck) wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 15:58 | ||
Their bass heads make decent pillows. |
and foot rests...
Hammer
Post by: Marsellus Fariss on February 02, 2010, 05:10:22 PM
I'm kidding. This is hilarious.
Post by: Tony "T" Tissot on February 02, 2010, 05:41:34 PM
| Marsellus Fariss wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 14:10 |
So I asked what piece of gear you guys hate the most and some of you came up with the Venice and Vertec. Wow! I mean, that's all you could hate on? Did you guys never work in clubs? Did you start with Clair or Showco or something and never had to work with REALY crap gear? Never had to mix on a Behringer? Never had to lift an old school Yammy or Peavy or Hill board that was 200LBS and all of 24 inputs? Never had to deal with cheap mics with switches that people forget to turn on and you have to run up on stage in the middle of the show? Never had the knob on a Spirit come of in you hand? Venice and Vertec huh? Well I'm jealous. I'm kidding. This is hilarious. |
I think it points out that crappy gear can be dealt with.
But oversold gear leaves a sour impression.
Post by: Jordan Wolf on February 02, 2010, 05:50:57 PM
1. Large format Mackie SR-series "consoles".
2. That Alesis compressor (3630?).
3. Sonic Maximizer (when used over the whole mix).
Try a sonic maximizer inserted on a subgroup of brass...might change your mind.
At least try it ONCE so you know you don't like it.
Post by: Dave Dermont on February 02, 2010, 08:07:50 PM
| Paul Bell wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 09:22 |
Dave, I would somewhat agree with that. My dad ingrained upon me that it's a poor craftsman who blames his shortcomings on his tools. However, my dislike of anything Soundcraft comes from two different consoles dying at the wrong time on different events. Sometimes, it is the choice of poor tools that can sink a job. |
Yeah, but if it were not for all those smoked Soundcraft power supplies, would the practice of carrying a spare supply been so ingrained in the industry? You hate Soundcraft for a reason, and a very good one.
Me, I look back fondly at what, at the time, were 'big' gigs that I did with a Soundcraft 1S. All 20 channels of it. The same goes for the 200b, 400B and Delta.
I know a guy who hates Symetrix for the same reason you hate Soundcraft. I have a pile of old Symetrix things that still work well. So well, in fact, I prefer them to a lot of what is now considered "entry level" pro gear.
I have also been in a few situations where I'd have gladly traded a body part for an SM58 or an OM5.
I guess I have a bit of room between gear that's "not my first choice" and gear I "hate" than some other people.
DD
Post by: Art Welter on February 02, 2010, 08:36:22 PM
| Dave Dermont wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 18:07 | ||
Yeah, but if it were not for all those smoked Soundcraft power supplies, would the practice of carrying a spare supply been so ingrained in the industry? You hate Soundcraft for a reason, and a very good one. Me, I look back fondly at what, at the time, were 'big' gigs that I did with a Soundcraft 1S. All 20 channels of it. The same goes for the 200b, 400B and Delta. I know a guy who hates Symetrix for the same reason you hate Soundcraft. I have a pile of old Symetrix things that still work well. So well, in fact, I prefer them to a lot of what is now considered "entry level" pro gear. I have also been in a few situations where I'd have gladly traded a body part for an SM58 or an OM5. I guess I have a bit of room between gear that's "not my first choice" and gear I "hate" than some other people. DD |
Having traded a few body parts to equipment, I would never “gladly” do it again!
I agree with you that there have been many pieces disparaged in this thread that I have no problem with, and in some cases are my first choice.
One mans meat is another man’s poison...
I never liked that band much.
Art Welter
Post by: Marsellus Fariss on February 02, 2010, 08:54:05 PM
Actually I work a club occasionally that still has a 1604VLZ and everything on it still works like a champ. Course I sold mine when the one at the club I was mixing at lost the master buss just before the show and I had to mix the whole night on a pair of post fader auxes. 3 was left and 4 was right! I've had to do this a few times actually.
Now all the clubs have moved on to Allen and Heath's but because it was built so well I'm still dealing with the same MR's that were installed 15 years ago. What can you do? It's better then Yammy SV stuff.
Why these clubs by a brand new all plastic GL2200 when they could score an old Ramsa, Crest, or Yammy PM board for the same bread (although I kinda dislike the PM's) is beyond me but they do. And I can mix on the GL series stuff with my eyes closed.
Post by: Brandon Blakeney on February 03, 2010, 02:17:05 AM
| Jordan Wolf wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 16:50 |
I've got a few: 1. Large format Mackie SR-series "consoles". 2. That Alesis compressor (3630?). 3. Sonic Maximizer (when used over the whole mix). Try a sonic maximizer inserted on a subgroup of brass...might change your mind. At least try it ONCE so you know you don't like it. |
I own a Mackie SR40.8, their reliability has come into question on several occasions. However they have a good bit of features and sound really good. Shame they aren't more rider friendly and road worthy
Also A&H and Soundcraft owner
Post by: Charlie Zureki on February 03, 2010, 07:49:14 AM
| Marsellus Fariss wrote on Tue, 02 February 2010 16:10 |
So I asked what piece of gear you guys hate the most and some of you came up with the Venice and Vertec. Wow! I mean, that's all you could hate on? Did you guys never work in clubs? Did you start with Clair or Showco or something and never had to work with REALY crap gear? Never had to mix on a Behringer? Never had to lift an old school Yammy or Peavy or Hill board that was 200LBS and all of 24 inputs? Never had to deal with cheap mics with switches that people forget to turn on and you have to run up on stage in the middle of the show? Never had the knob on a Spirit come of in you hand? Venice and Vertec huh? Well I'm jealous. I'm kidding. This is hilarious. |
Hello,
I'm sure most posters started in clubs, but this was before some "graduated" to bigger gigs, and the slew of equipment manufacturers that came in later years. They still had to deal with what some called, crap gear (by today's standard) ...but, this gear was the best offered at the time. We made do with what was available.(kinda like today)
And...yes, we've all had to lift extremely heavy gear, including consoles that weighed more than 400lbs... way before the Ez-ups. Ground stacking cabinets... three high.
When it came to Mics with switches...we learned early on to put tape over the switch..so the artist wouldn't slide the switch off, or just remove the switch and jumper around it.
The Vertecs...that's another story, and as some have said, the new versions and tunings have made them "less disagreeable", but the older versions having still left a bad taste for some...
Equipment and it's compatibility is a much better story than the "old days". Standardizing on the Pin 2, had been a big issue.
The "standardizing" of snake connectors, cabinet connectors and Amp input connectors...and the past, seems distant.
Knobs have always come off.. but, you repair/replace and get on with the work.
Cheers,
Hammer
Post by: Jeff Knorr - Cobra Sound on February 03, 2010, 10:58:55 AM
| Dick Rees wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 22:27 | ||
1. The one they insist on using is "real good" and cost $75 new. 2. They've lost the proprietary shock mount. 3. It travels loose rattling around in the banjo case, has a pronounced peak in the response around 6.3K.......and little else. BTDT |
This is why we carry multiple high quality LDC's with us on most of our gigs. It's also why we use high quality, fully horn-loaded trap boxes.
We work with quite a few bluegrass groups from amateur to nationally touring professional groups and can make almost all of them sound good with the one mic technique. Garbage In = Garbage Out. But optimizing the system for GBF goes a loooong way.
Jeff "Doesn't break the laws of physics but likes to bend them in his favor"
Post by: Donnie Evans on February 03, 2010, 11:06:37 AM
| Randy Frierson wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 00:42 |
i'm dating my self but the yamaha compressor, can't remember the model #..you all know which one... |
Would that be like the AC2020 or whatevever..something like that?
woops just saw that somebody beat me to that one...and yea gc2020, not ac2020..
Post by: Dick Rees on February 03, 2010, 11:08:22 AM
| Jeff Knorr - Cobra Sound wrote on Wed, 03 February 2010 09:58 | ||||
This is why we carry multiple high quality LDC's with us on most of our gigs. It's also why we use high quality, fully horn-loaded trap boxes. We work with quite a few bluegrass groups from amateur to nationally touring professional groups and can make almost all of them sound good with the one mic technique. Garbage In = Garbage Out. But optimizing the system for GBF goes a loooong way. Jeff "Doesn't break the laws of physics but likes to bend them in his favor" |
Jeff....
I've highlighted the crucial phrase above. Of course I have a nice selection of LDC's with me. When they think theirs is "better" and will use only it, there's not much you can do except drop back 10 yards and punt. So it's a beat-to-heck, no-name POS rather than a nice Shure, AT or other name brand.
Hey.....they like "Their Sound"......
Post by: Guy Johnson on February 03, 2010, 03:08:33 PM
| Dick Rees wrote on Wed, 03 February 2010 10:08 |
Jeff.... I've highlighted the crucial phrase above. Of course I have a nice selection of LDC's with me. When they think theirs is "better" and will use only it, there's not much you can do except drop back 10 yards and punt. So it's a beat-to-heck, no-name POS rather than a nice Shure, AT or other name brand. Hey.....they like "Their Sound"...... |
That mic's like The Messiah to them. I've found most one-mikers stick to their mic for 'their' sound. Luckily doesn't happen to me much.
Having decent gear really does help in that scenario. As does a little extra care and work.
Post by: Brandon G Romanowski on February 03, 2010, 03:42:00 PM
Post by: Caleb Dick on February 03, 2010, 07:08:39 PM
To add to the list - acoustic guitar amps. So far, every single acoustic guitar amp, when A/B'ed with a Radial J48, lost. To get to the A/B test, I politely asked if I could use both the J48 before the amp, and mic the amp. After practice/event, I'd let them listen from FOH.
Caleb
Post by: Gus Housen on February 03, 2010, 08:01:09 PM
I had a Hill B3, That I was kina fond of. But really was a dog it has terible body flex and it used a weird sized Pot that was at least for me at the time difficult to find.
Post by: Jason "JB" Browning on February 04, 2010, 01:45:42 AM
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- EAW MX8750 |
If as bass-ackwards to use as the MX8700; agree.
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- 810 bass cabinets |
On a Arena tour; disagree; at a pub; agree.
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Fender Twin |
Disagree
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Cheap JBL wedges |
Agree
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Lab-Gruppen analogue crossovers |
Not Qualified to answer
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- C-Audio amplifiers |
Not qualified to answer
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Not Enough Rig For The Gig! |
Wholeheartedly agree!!!!
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Not Enough Monitors For The Gig!! |
Wholeheartedly agree to the second power!
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Yamaha 01V |
Don't agree
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Yamaha DM2000 |
Really don't agree
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Soundcraft Spirit (all of them!) |
Sort of agree...had some great nights with a stellar band on a Spirit Live at a dive bar, had some awful nights with a national headliner on a Spirit monitor board.
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- JBL Vertec |
You're loosing me....v4 presets work for me
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Meyer Line arrays |
Umm...totally disagree....
| Helge A. Bentsen wrote on Mon, 01 February 2010 12:26 |
- Any event planner who doesn't understand that if something is impossible due to the laws of physics, then I'm not trying to be uncooperative and lazy, it's just not possible right now. Sure, go ahead and call my boss to complain about me being uncooperative because I can't make the sound from the PA stop right at the edge on the dance floor, when you want it loud up front... |
Back with 'ya....you are preach'in to the choir....
JB
Post by: Jason "JB" Browning on February 04, 2010, 01:51:32 AM
JB
Post by: Patrick Tracy on February 04, 2010, 05:35:15 PM
| Dan Richardson wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 17:58 |
Alesis MEQ230. Stereo 30 bands, each band an octave wide. At least. |
Just happened to do this yesterday.
Alesis M-EQ 230 frequency response, bypassed, zeroed, +12dB @ 1kHz, -12dB @ 1kHz:
Post by: Kristian Johnsen on February 04, 2010, 07:00:18 PM
| Patrick Tracy wrote on Thu, 04 February 2010 23:35 | ||
Just happened to do this yesterday. Alesis M-EQ 230 frequency response, bypassed, zeroed, +12dB @ 1kHz, -12dB @ 1kHz: |
Patrick
Could you show us the same with let's say a decent DBX unit?
Very interesting post.
Post by: Patrick Tracy on February 04, 2010, 07:18:41 PM
| Kristian Johnsen wrote on Thu, 04 February 2010 17:00 | ||||
Patrick Could you show us the same with let's say a decent DBX unit? Very interesting post. |
That's sorta of where I was headed. I borrowed a Rane MQ302 to try next. It's an earlier one with the level marked 0-10 rather than -12dB/+12dB. Intermediate curves are at the silkscreened markings. Quite different from the Alesis, but obviously not right. Looks fixable to me, though.
Post by: Patrick Tracy on February 05, 2010, 12:49:47 AM
Mackie 1604VLZ Pro LF section.
MF section, -15dB, with knob pointing to 100Hz, 200Hz, 800Hz, 2kHz and 8kHz.
HF section, +15dB & -15dB.
Post by: Alan Hamilton on February 05, 2010, 03:02:14 AM
But then the more I thought about it the more I just have to go ahead and say the Alesis MEQ EQ.
I mean it's an EQ that sucks sonically, has no XLR's, little metering, a hard to read screening job, everything's crammed into 1sp, AND you have to use your thumbnail to actually move those tiny, rough, stupid sliders.
I give it an "Epic Fail".
Post by: Guy Johnson on February 06, 2010, 06:58:23 AM
It fits two channels of 30 bands into 1 U
Easy to adjust with nails.
Spectacles fix the reading problem...
Does what it says on the tin.
Sounds fine.
Suits small racks, and smaller desks, so no balanced i/o is fine.
Come on, peeps, the thing is cheap as chips, been out for ages, does its job well. what do you expect? BSS? KT?
I do hate its wall-wart, however.
In FACT:
Post by: Guy Johnson on February 06, 2010, 07:01:53 AM
They are horrible and messy. They fall out of mains sockets, and worst of all, throw magnetic and RF "squirt" all over the place.
Post by: Steven Jackson on February 06, 2010, 07:54:36 AM
| Jason J Raboin wrote on Fri, 29 January 2010 11:46 |
The list is very long so I'll stick to things that providers regularly try to make me use: Yamaha M7 Yamaha PM5D Shure SM58 Martin W8LM L"acoustics ARCS (as mains) Anything that needlessly adds a set of AD/DA conversions to the signal chain |
What is wrong with the W8LM?
I may be about to get some, but am looking for recommendations.
I haven't heard it yet, I'm going to get a listen to the W8LM and Geos12 next week
Post by: Kristian Johnsen on February 06, 2010, 09:12:24 AM
Post by: Dave Bigelow on February 07, 2010, 02:41:56 AM
| Brandon Blakeney wrote on Wed, 03 February 2010 02:17 | ||
I own a Mackie SR40.8, their reliability has come into question on several occasions. However they have a good bit of features and sound really good. Shame they aren't more rider friendly and road worthy Also A&H and Soundcraft owner |
We have one of those Mackies in the shop, I have never seen it go out on a gig, just heard that it makes funny noises.
My list is more the "normal" I think
THAT Alesis comp
B* consoles and cabinets
Delay units with no way of telling what the delay time is other than some stupid flashing light. (I don't want to guess, give me an old roland sde1000 if you have to)
EQs that are so small that you can't make a cut without taking more than 3db
Hell, give me damn near any rig if it has adequate power and processing and I'll deal with it. You don't hear truck drivers screaming for a Peterbuilt when they are handed a Mac.
Then again I am on the club level but if I were to get where I demanded a profile I would just fucking carry one and save myself the trouble.
Post by: Steve Bunting on February 07, 2010, 06:07:26 AM
| Jason "JB" Browning wrote on Thu, 04 February 2010 06:45 | ||
Umm...totally disagree.... |
Only if you have to rig them.
Post by: Steve Hurt on February 07, 2010, 10:15:20 AM
Post by: Jason "JB" Browning on February 09, 2010, 01:06:00 AM
| Steve Bunting wrote on Sun, 07 February 2010 06:07 | ||||
Only if you have to rig them. |
Ok, you kinda got me there.
Took a MILO rig into Atlantic City a few years ago; local hands thought MILO was an acronym for "Meyer Involves Lots'o Overtime"
JB
Post by: Ales Dravinec 'Alex' on February 09, 2010, 02:30:59 AM
I either helped set up or watched being setup quite a bunch of arrays and Meyers 'go up' the fastest and with least effort. That's just the fact.
Want proof :
One side shown. Setup time : 16 minutes, subs included ! I was there !
Show : Killers, Ljubljana, 2009
Provider : Festival Novo mesto
Additional remarks : If you can't fly Milos that fast, read the rigging manual again.
Thank you for listening
Post by: drewgandy on February 10, 2010, 01:16:44 PM
| Guy Johnson wrote on Sat, 06 February 2010 05:58 |
Things I like about the MEQ 230. --- Does what it says on the tin. --- Come on, peeps, the thing is cheap as chips, been out for ages, does its job well. what do you expect? BSS? KT? |
Several of the MEQ230s that I've monkey'd with had some issues with sliders. Namely, when you push them all the way down, they drop out of the circuit. It was usually on the bass side of things. Try it on one of yours with smaart running. See if the filter stays in all the way up and down. I applaud the engineering effort to make such a cheap piece of gear but the manufacturing tolerances didn't seem to be good enough to make a reasonably stable unit. Now, the graphs showing the 1k to be considerably off in frequency was a surprise though. I thought they used "laser trimmed resistors"?
drew
Post by: Chris Diener on February 10, 2010, 03:28:47 PM
| drewgandy wrote on Wed, 10 February 2010 12:16 | ||
Several of the MEQ230s that I've monkey'd with had some issues with sliders. Namely, when you push them all the way down, they drop out of the circuit. It was usually on the bass side of things. Try it on one of yours with smaart running. See if the filter stays in all the way up and down. I applaud the engineering effort to make such a cheap piece of gear but the manufacturing tolerances didn't seem to be good enough to make a reasonably stable unit. Now, the graphs showing the 1k to be considerably off in frequency was a surprise though. I thought they used "laser trimmed resistors"? drew |
A "long long time ago" I had a pair of MEQ230s (hey, they were cheap and SMALL! ha) Always had a hard time ringing out monitors with them. One day I replaced them. Suddenly the monitors sounded fine, flat! And the replacements were Yamaha Q2031a! (not exactly well regarded either) I don't know what those filters were doing, but I'd love to see what the actual frequency response was when all the sliders were at "0".
Post by: Guy Johnson on February 11, 2010, 06:57:43 AM
Yes, the sliders are getting a bit crap after many years, but not too bad, and I don't do a lot of cutting, anyway...
Those lasers were always a bit dodgy to me...
Post by: Moby (Mike Diack) on February 11, 2010, 02:28:29 PM
| Chris Diener wrote on Thu, 11 February 2010 09:28 | ||||
A "long long time ago" I had a pair of MEQ230s (hey, they were cheap and SMALL! ha) Always had a hard time ringing out monitors with them. One day I replaced them. Suddenly the monitors sounded fine, flat! And the replacements were Yamaha Q2031a! (not exactly well regarded either) I don't know what those filters were doing, but I'd love to see what the actual frequency response was when all the sliders were at "0". |
For a truely gruesome GEQ, it's hard to go past the Dod SR231
I was given a couple...that seems about the right price.
Here's what they look like with the faders flat :
M
Post by: Steve Hurt on February 11, 2010, 02:39:41 PM
Post by: Patrick Tracy on February 11, 2010, 11:29:03 PM
| Kristian Johnsen wrote on Thu, 04 February 2010 17:00 | ||||
Patrick Could you show us the same with let's say a decent DBX unit? Very interesting post. |
I had a chance to hook up to a White Instruments Series 4000 today:
Bypassed, zeroed, 1kHz at maximum, minimum and intermediate settings.
Post by: John Sulek on February 14, 2010, 03:09:32 PM
| Jason "JB" Browning wrote on Tue, 09 February 2010 01:06 | ||||||
Ok, you kinda got me there. Took a MILO rig into Atlantic City a few years ago; local hands thought MILO was an acronym for "Meyer Involves Lots'o Overtime" JB |
Having flown 58 Milos a day (19/side main and 10/side sidehang) on an arena tour I disagree.
Our mandate was to be at trim 1 hour after getting points and we did it every day. One tour guy and two locals on each stick of pa.
Only tough part was getting the side hangs going when the ice was in but you overcome.
They are heavy though!
Cheers,
John
Post by: Dave Barnett on February 15, 2010, 01:15:08 AM
Post by: Jordan Wolf on February 16, 2010, 09:52:11 PM
FWIW
EDIT: Oh, and to add to my list:
2-prong to 3-prong AC adapters. THEY ARE NOT MEANT FOR LIFTING SAFETY GROUND!!! Why don't people get that?!?!?
Post by: Jordan Wolf on February 16, 2010, 09:54:26 PM
Post by: Jim Duyck on February 17, 2010, 02:57:48 PM
Post by: Sami Torvinen on February 17, 2010, 04:36:47 PM
This has happened to me twice: I ask for 8 channels of any good quality gates and get a rack full of 266XL's
Post by: Jeff Babcock on February 17, 2010, 04:55:38 PM
| Andy Peters wrote on Sun, 31 January 2010 22:38 |
Both the Philips head and slot-head screws need to be banned outright and replaced by hex or Robertson drive. Nothing like a screw that's designed to slip when overtorqued. -a |
Lots of Robertson stuff here in Canada thankfully. Too bad it is less common in the US.
We Canadians often say that America got stuck with the Philips simply because it is an American design and has been grandfathered in. The Robertson is a Canadian design.
Such a shame as the Robertson is superior in MANY ways.
Post by: gordon mcgregor on February 18, 2010, 02:47:12 PM
Post by: Patrick Tracy on March 03, 2010, 01:26:31 PM
| Mike Smith wrote on Thu, 28 January 2010 21:09 |
Speaking of Yamaha, those old Q2031 dual 1/3 octave EQs everybody used to use. Another case of higher expectations. More disappointment in less rack space. |
Yamaha Q2031A frequency response:
Red trace is bypassed, dark red is engaged with filters centered. Others are 1kHz at maximum and minimum with the range at both settings (12dB and 6dB).
Post by: Doug Fowler on March 03, 2010, 02:56:34 PM
..enough hate, already.... :-)