ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Down

Author Topic: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?  (Read 3932 times)

(Brian) Frost

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 348
How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« on: June 02, 2007, 04:11:02 am »

I have been running sound for 12 years professionally and have never needed to use redundant psu's, but have had them on plenty of gigs.  Today I was using the onboard psu of my crest hp8 and suddenly mid gig, the smell of magic smoke and the board psu lights went out.  No more board!    

What Im really concerned about is whether getting it fixed means that there is a problem with the board that will repeat itself later or if this was just a fluke full moon kinda thing.  

Ill be calling crest monday morning, but this further shakes my faith in crest products (i have blown up more CA series amps than I can count).  

Logged
Frost

Owner, Narnia Productions

www.NarniaProductions.com

Chicago IL


Good is good but not as good as better

Kim Watson

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 312
    • http://www.polarisaudio.co.uk
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2007, 05:55:42 am »

Hey Brian

Recently we have had 2 supplys go down. A&H GL3300 luckerly had a GL3 in the van with supply so stole that. turned out to be a crack on the board. and we also have had a DDA CS8 supply go down, but that console has redundent supplys which saved the day.

We also have a Soundtrax megas... (still going) and that supply was built like a tank! only recently has Capacitors needed resoldering to the board. lost one of the rails... easy to fix though.

So it does happen

Kim Watson
Logged
Have a great day!

Kim Watson
=============================
FOH/Monitors/System
www.polarisaudio.co.uk
www.myspace.com/kimsoundchick

Bennett Prescott

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 8924
    • http://www.adraudio.com
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2007, 09:59:18 am »

I've lost supplies on two boards, fortunately it was never show-threatening. A Midas H3000 dropped both its supplies on me during line checks the day before an opera, the rental company flew their tech down with a toolkit and a replacement in carry on and had the board and two supplies back up and running by the end of the day, one of them was really busted so he took it back with him the next day.

I've also lost a DDA CS3 power supply. There was no backup, but we were just measuring, so we made do without it.

Both boards were older and well used. Neither failure seemed to have anything to do with the innards of the board itself.
Logged
-- Bennett Prescott
Director of North American Sales
ADRaudio d.o.o.
Cell: (518) 488-7190

"Give me 6dB and I shall move the world." -Archimedes

Chuck Augustowski

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 154
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2007, 11:09:08 am »

Question: How reliable are console power supplies?

Answer: In Pro Gear = Very - BUT - Do you believe in Murphy's Law?

Suggestion - Always have a Spare/Back Up Supply for your consoles and a backup plan for every piece of gear that is critical in your system.  Hopefully you will never need them.

Chuck Augustowski
APB-DynaSonics

Logged

Langston Holland

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 908
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2007, 11:45:20 am »

Cowardly Lion: I do believe in spooks. I do believe in spooks. I do! I do! I do! I do believe in spooks. I do believe in spooks. I do! I do! I do! I do!

Wicked Witch of the West: You'll believe in more than that before I'm finished with you!

I've noticed that all the lights on my 40 channel Crest X-VCA get a little brighter with both power supplies on. Maybe the use of dual supplies causes them to last longer due to halving their current requirement?
Logged
God bless you and your precious family - Langston

Soundscapes <><

Tim McCulloch

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 0
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2007, 01:36:03 pm »

Hi Brian-

We run Crest *001 pro series amps and have for a long time.  In the last 5 years no Crest required a trip back home.  We've sent Crown a couple of casualties.  In 10 years I can only think of 1 major Crest failure at showtime.

All the desk PSU issues I've had that were actually the PSU itself involved Soundcrafts.  Dropped the +17v rail one time, +5 another.  Cable issues also with Soundcraft and a TAC Scorpion.

We had an issue with a Yamaha M3000 right out of the box.  A short in one of the Littl-lights took out a fuse inside the console, taking out control and most audio.  Wasn't the PSUs fault, but it sure looked like it at first.

Good luck, and let us know how this works out.

Tim Mc
Logged
"Will you stand by me against the cold night, or are you afraid of the ice?" Crack The Sky

Dave Dermont

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2011
    • http://www.geocities.com/livesound101/
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2007, 02:52:12 pm »

I have never been hit by lightning, but I still take shelter from thunderstorms.

The only time I have ever lost a supply was when something weird happened with the incoming AC line voltage.

This is why I don't hook up switchers and/or redundant supplies. I don't even plug the backup supply in.

This way, if any weirdness only takes out the supply, backup is happily waiting to provide service, usually after issues with said weirdness are addressed. I find that plugging in the backup supply and swapping the cable takes far less time than chasing around for a third backup.

You know, "hope for the best and prepare for the worst", and all that.
Logged
Dave Dermont - Chief Lizard, LAB Lounge

WARNING: Dates In Calendar May Be Closer Than They Appear

Rob Burgess

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 682
  • Montreal, QC, Canada
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2007, 03:09:50 pm »

I've had two supplies fail on me in the past three years.

One was a Crest X-Monitor board and the supply started giving me ozone on power up.  It was a loaner board with only one power supply but luckily I was close enough to the shop to call for another board.

The second was on a Series 5M (Hmm, monitors both times, maybe a message?).  The day before a festival I was tuning monitors and heard a fairly loud bang.  When I got back to the board all the lights were off.  Switched over to the backup supply and all was well.

Both times there were no power anomalies to speak of.  The first time I was running off a genny but nothing else was affected.  The second time was a 600v feed from the power company - once again the 5M was the only thing affected.

Sometimes shit just happens.

--
Rob

Logged
Give a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day.

Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.

Jason Tubbs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 517
    • http://www.xenu.net
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2007, 05:10:37 pm »

I've lost two that I can recall - an A&H GL3 supply back in '98 and a Crest (I'm sensing a theme here) X-8 supply back in '03.  The A&H was used when we bought it a couple of years prior, so it had been in use for some time.  The X-8 (pre-Peavey) was about five years old at the time.  In both cases, it was the supply and not the console.  

jt
Logged
"Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion"  - L. Ron Hubbard

Jens Brewer

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 307
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2007, 10:37:26 pm »

In 15 years of getting paid for making noise, I've only seen two PSUs go down; both were for Allen & Heath GL series consoles.  Still, you're only as good as your backup plan.
Logged

Scott MacAuley

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 420
    • http://www.screamersusa.com
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2007, 01:37:57 am »

Stop Freaking out!!!!!!!!!!! Shocked

Console supplies fail......CONSTANTLY. Just like anything else you throw around in your truck, or that gets bounced around in your truck, or gets exposed to varying atmospheres, humidity or just plain turn on and turn off, and lastly AGE, they break.
It's nothing to get too upset over. Supplies should be maintained like anything else. A slightly loose heat sink screw on a rack mount supply can cause mild overheating and eventual failure. The heat sink silicone dries out under the regulators
turning into an insulator allowing heat to build up blowing regulators. Bridge rectifiers simply wear out. Caps get old, start drying out demanding more current and adding hum.

Just to give you an Idea of what supply problems I ran into in last year before I stopped doing repairs, 4 Yamaha PM series supplies, 6 Soundtracs Supplies, 2 Soundtracs Solo's, 2 Allen and Heath supplies, numerous EV processors, Numerous Yamaha PCMs,
Numerous Quadraverbs, TDM crossovers, Klark Teqnique eq's, Biamp Eq's, Samson amps (all refused), the list goes on.
Get the supply fixed, while you are at it go through the console and make sure every thing is tight and clean. If it's old look for oxidized solder joints. If there are numerous problems like various sections not working (an eq here, a send there), you could also have a few bad chips drawing enough current in total to blow a supply. Once the supply is fixed make sure to find out exactly what was wrong with it. If any of it was age related,
have the other supply cleaned up too.
Good Luck. Smile

Added. Many power supplies these days are barely rated for what they are powering so you may already be running on the edge.
Logged
Screamers Audio Services
www.screamersusa.com

(Brian) Frost

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 348
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #11 on: June 04, 2007, 02:44:55 am »

The HP8 has only existed for 2 years.  This is a pretty new board.  Admittedly, I was unsing the onboard power supply, and I am interested infinding out what went wrong since the powercable was hot to the touch... board was working fine before it blew up.
Logged
Frost

Owner, Narnia Productions

www.NarniaProductions.com

Chicago IL


Good is good but not as good as better

Josh Evans

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 385
    • http://www.youtube.com/jevans111
Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2007, 07:18:32 am »


Enough to require the use of a back up power supply.

I have had failures on Allen and Heath, Mackie, Ramsa, Inovason, Midas H3000, DDA, and Yamaha.

Think about it if a channel dies just use another one and continue on with the gig.  However if the power supply dies then ur screwed.

Another thing to think about is all the new consoles that have a mini ATX computer built inside that use a standard off the self power supply.  There is a reason that there are so many market CPU power supplies.

Maybe a good rule of thumb is that is ur on a tour or mixing anything over 2000 seats (have a back up)!!!

I would also suggest having each power supply on different circuits. A good power supply will have indicators displaying if the power is good before cycling the console on. But then you are measuring ur voltage before you throw the switch right?

I also like what Dave Dermont said about not even plugging in the back up until needed. Ill add that to my mental notes for the future.

Im surprised Mark Herman has not replied as he has owned a couple desks in the past.
Logged
Joshua Evans

Outlinearrays.com
"Sound is what happens when air gets pushed"

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: How common is a PSU failure on a mixing board?
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2007, 07:18:32 am »


Pages: 1 2 [All]   Go Up
 



Page created in 0.035 seconds with 24 queries.