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[John Pinchin]

Hi,
In my continued debates about which way to go, with adding new gear I came across some 12" subs  (rcf 600 passive).

I can see how a horn loaded cab would kick out some useful bass with a 12" but surely a front loaded cabinet will struggle to provide useful low end (running at about 600W per cab for about 200 people indoors).

Am I totally misinformed or am I right in thinking subs should be at least 15" and preferably 18".

Thanks
John

[Tom Reid]

I had some Ramsa 12" subs that would rattle your innards.
Size matters.
However, engineers can create size in mnay ways.

[John Pinchin]

I once did sound for a band that had a load of the ramsa cabs (ws?)
12" tops and subs. 2 pairs of each for foh and another pair for side fills. They seemed to take a lot of hammer.

Not sure I'd get away with one sub per side though.

Cheers
John

[John Pinchin]

Just another thought - how would a pair of 12" subs on each compare to a single 18" on each side?
Would the combination give reasonable bottom while providing lots of flexibility for small gigs?  

Thanks
John

[Jason Dermer]

John,
Don't get hung up on the size of the speaker in the sub, listen to it and compare box size, output, musicality, and how low it goes to your budget. FWIW, most of the top competitors in last week's sub shootout http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/f/7/0/ utilized 12" or 15" drivers. If you had entered the building with the preconceived notion of subs needing to 18s you would have had your mind totally rearranged. The Bassmaxx Trip, with 3 12" drivers, was loud enough, while remaining one of the best sounding contenders, to bring noise complaints. In NYC. Across the street. Through 3 concrete walls. 5 floors above us.

Getting back to what you likely have the budget for, take a look at the JTR Growlers from the same threads, available for only $900.00 delivered. They use a 12" driver also, and were the big "little" (or is that little "big"?) surprise of the shootout. Top marks for sound quality, and huge output relative to size. Grab a pair and a PLX2 3602 or similar, set then up in the center so that they couple, and be amazed before Jeff realizes the goldmine that he is sitting on and doubles the price. Pretty soon you'll start doubting your top boxes and start over once again...

edit: SP