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Author Topic: LAB Sub vs SRX728  (Read 13641 times)

Antone Atmarama Bajor

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #20 on: December 04, 2006, 03:35:09 am »

     I always thought the Term musical sounding referred to the extra harmonic goodies and irregularities that give the speaker a characteristic sound.

    The term musical is often used to describe Guitar and bass guitar speakers and cabs.

    The term Accurate is normally used to describe reference audio.

    From what I've read about Open backed Horns (and maybe scoops too), there is an uneven load on the driver in the negative stroke so there is an amplitude distortion issue much like the squares law distortion of J-Fet transfer curves.

    But this type of waveform more closely resembles that of a stringed instrument (Larger + swing than -).

    I guess the only way to know for sure is to look at what happens to a sine wave fed into the thing.

    I guess its related to the same type of voodoo musicality that dipole (Open Back) speaker have for some people.

    I'm guessing this mainly applies to acoustic music reproduction, as acoustic instruments are 3 dimensional entities that radiate portions of their energy in multiple directions (At least ones with resonant bodies).  And have a complex interaction with their environment.

    Sealed Horns, and speaker cabinets.  By nature and Design focus their energy (unless the enclosures are quite live) in one direction.  By nature they can not sound just like an acoustic instrument.

    By having the rear wave reflecting off other surfaces I think perhaps it can help trick the ear into thinking the sound from the speaker has more depth and realism.

    I think even Siegfried Linkwitz mentions on his site that dipole speakers need to be a certain distance away from walls to work their magic properly.  I wonder if this the case with the Bassmaxx subs.

    I haven't actually heard the things so I can't give any subjective feedback on them.

Antone-



 
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Tim Duffin

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #21 on: December 10, 2006, 11:04:37 pm »

Nathan Lehouillier wrote on Tue, 28 November 2006 23:07

Hi Tim,


I don't know what you are testing but testing speakers
until you hear the coil bottom out is a good way to ruin
them. I fail to see why you post on this forum. You
obviously have a skewed view of what many of the people
hear have shown you and have some resentment for it. Confused

Nobody here has demonstrated the capability to show me anything new which is recognized by modern acoustic theory, therefore it is all just a bunch of people defending their purchases so they don't suffer from buyers remorse.  Great, Tom Danley designed a sub for this forum which almost sounds as good as his BT7 design from the 80's.  Except this design is for do it yourselfers, weighs more and can't be stacked correctly, explain to me again why anybody would want one?

To the OP I have never tested the LAB or the 728.
I have however run systems containing each of these speakers.
If you were to set up an experiment as you have laid out
the 728 would fall short in a few categories.
1) The 728 will require way more power to achieve the same
  output.

yes....your point?  Everyone knows that 728s need lots of power, duh.

2) The 728 will not achieve as high output even with more power.

Wrong-- when used in groups, front loaded subs become more directional than horns and with enough of them can create a linear wavefront which equates to one large diameter direct radiator.  I do not have 728's, I have the 4719x subs-- 4 of them in a 2x2 formation each with 2500wrms each are much louder than 4 labhorns or 4 B1's.  I have heard them side by side on the same day, at the same event with the same amps on different stages-- And this was outside on grass.  

3) The 728 will have higher distortion levels in and above
  its normal power range.

Technically, everything that a horn sub puts out could be classified as distortion because it requires digital delay to align it with the other mf and hf speakers--again, your point?  And dont try to tell me that all the peaks and valleys of the above graph are "musicalities".  That is also distortion, technically, because its output is not faithful to the input signal.  

What are you looking for?

I have owned the best possible horns and sold them because they aren't good for anything except saying that you have "BT7's"  and are not a good business choice because they are ugly.  I am not looking for anything-- I am trying to hopefully stop someone from making a terrible mistake.  


Tim
SPL Sound





Tim McCulloch

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #22 on: December 11, 2006, 12:17:38 am »

Quote:

Technically, everything that a horn sub puts out could be classified as distortion because it requires digital delay to align it with the other mf and hf speakers--again, your point?


Without a doubt, this is the biggest bunch of shit I've read from you, Duffin, and you've posted a lot of inaccurate and just plain wrong things.

Tim "taking a lil FOH break from Buckcherry, 3Days Grace, and Crossfade" Mc
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Dave Rickard

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2006, 01:21:13 am »

Tim Duffin wrote on Sun, 10 December 2006 21:04

I have the 4719x subs-- 4 of them in a 2x2 formation each with 2500wrms each are much louder than 4 labhorns or 4 B1's.  I have heard them side by side on the same day, at the same event with the same amps on different stages-- And this was outside on grass.  

If I recall the thread correctly, others present came to a different conclusion.  I've been wrong before, though.
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Dave
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"The wrong piece of gear, at the right price, is still the wrong piece of gear."

"If you don't have good stuff at each end of the signal chain, (mics and speakers) what you use in between is just turd polish."--Dave Dermont

Tim Duffin

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #24 on: December 11, 2006, 04:37:06 pm »

there was no thread on this event-- the event happened last summer and nobody from either camp posted about it including me.  I prefer to keep untainted real world comparisons to myself so I can have the satisfaction of knowing what really happens without waiting for some one sided "shoot out". Laughing

T

Al Limberg

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2006, 05:16:45 pm »

Well I can certainly appreciate a man who doesn't let the facts get in the way of his opinions.

?;o)
Al
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Pascal Pincosy

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2006, 05:18:19 pm »

Truthiness  Rolling Eyes
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Dave Rickard

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #27 on: December 12, 2006, 02:59:57 am »

Tim Duffin wrote on Mon, 11 December 2006 14:37

there was no thread on this event-- the event happened last summer and nobody from either camp posted about it including me.  I prefer to keep untainted real world comparisons to myself so I can have the satisfaction of knowing what really happens without waiting for some one sided "shoot out". Laughing

T



I see. I was referring to the thread earlier this year "Looking for LOUD!!!! subs", specifically regarding providers named Manas and Van Duker.

I guess I hadn't thought of "keeping things to yourself" as one of your defining attributes. Laughing

Cheers,
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Dave
Yorkville dealer

"The wrong piece of gear, at the right price, is still the wrong piece of gear."

"If you don't have good stuff at each end of the signal chain, (mics and speakers) what you use in between is just turd polish."--Dave Dermont

Nathan Lehouillier

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #28 on: December 14, 2006, 09:48:58 pm »

Hello Tim,

Good to see you will never change. Rolling Eyes
By the way what does signal delay and distortion
have to do with each other. Wake up it's called
Speaker processing even your super subs can benefit
from time alignment. Now I will try the block this
morons post feature.


Nate KDS&L
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Tim Duffin

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Re: LAB Sub vs SRX728
« Reply #29 on: December 14, 2006, 10:40:38 pm »

No, thats incorrect-- although I was the individual to book both of those other providers you mentioned at a large festival this past summer.  Still, there was no post about this event-- does there need to be?

T
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