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Author Topic: Alternative Lab Sub Driver. Big $$  (Read 3942 times)

Steve Shafer

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Alternative Lab Sub Driver. Big $$
« on: October 02, 2006, 08:33:08 pm »

Granted this driver is rather expensive and it may not even fit in the Lab Sub Cabinet as currently designed.  However, I remember Mark Seaton stating something about having to have 2x's the Xmax of the Eminence driver to see appreciable gains.  

Just for fun, can someone model this driver in the Lab Sub?  What T/S parameters would have to be tweaked to make this driver more at home in the Lab Sub?

12" TC-5200 DVC +SP

Triple stacked ¾" tall ferrite magnets
• 400oz motor structure
• xmax of 30mm (one way linear travel)
• Dual (10") poly-cotton spiders with intergraded woven leads
• Extra spacing in-between spiders for lateral stability
• Extra clearance under the suspension for dynamic high excursions
• Detachable cast aluminum basket with high gloss power coating
• Massive 4" diameter, 8-layer, quad 1.2Ω aluminum voice coil (15",18" only)
• Massive 4" diameter, 8-layer, dual 2.4Ω aluminum voice coil (12" only)
• Ultra high thermal capacity titanium voice coil former
• 2000 watts sustained, 6000 watts dynamic
• High quality thermal flexible epoxies to ensure longevity
• Rigid lightweight brushed aluminum cone (+SP only)
• Anodized ultra lightweight black aluminum cone (+CP only)
• Vented flared pole piece
• Aluminum shorting ring
• Tall durable rubber surround allows for extreme excursion (+SP only)
• Optional competition package for even higher sensitivity and output. (+CP only)
• Dressed in a rubber magnet boot and gasket
• Hand built in our San Diego, CA factory

T/S Parameters

Qts 0.118
Qes 0.119
Qms 14.56
Fs 22hz
Res 4.8Ω
Ls 7.5mH
Lp 12.7mH
Rp 15.59Ω
Dia 254mm
Vas 50.ll
mms 355g
cms 140um/N
bl 45T*m
Spl 88.8dB

Steve S

Tamas Tako

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Re: Alternative Lab Sub Driver. Big $$
« Reply #1 on: October 04, 2006, 03:44:52 pm »

Dear Steve,

You can modell it yourself using the free downloadable Hornresp software, wich is superior for that purpose.

However FYI that driver has mutch more overal depth, than the LAB12, meaning it can not fit into the LABHORN enclosure.
It has to mutch BL for that design.



Steve Shafer

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How is BL factor a problem
« Reply #2 on: October 04, 2006, 06:56:22 pm »


Aside from the TC Sounds driver being too big to fit in the Lab Sub cabinet,  what would keep this driver from being a superb candidate for the Lab Sub and similar horn loaded boxes.

Also, if you will pardon my ignorance, when and why can you have too much BL factor in a horn loaded box or a front loaded box for that matter?

Given the incredible Xmax for this TC Sounds driver, it seems that this driver in theory could provide the performance benefits that Mark Seaton mentioned early in the Lab Sub initial builds by LAB members. Granted the TC Sounds drivers are too big to fit in the Lab Sub cabinet as currently configured, but these drivers once modified a bit  seem like they would be incredible horn loaded sub drivers

my .02

Steve S

Tamas Tako

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Re: How is BL factor a problem
« Reply #3 on: October 04, 2006, 07:50:39 pm »

Ok  Steve,

I apreciate your .02 Cents....
I attach the frequ response from the hornresp model of the LAB Horn with LAB12(black) and With that TC speaker(gray). (20Vrms@1m distance )

I don't want to tell you which one is better suited for this application. You can chose by yourself. The Math is not that easy: STronger motor= better speaker for every applications!

Question is, what is your goal with a the LABHORN? What would you like to change on it? Low frequency corner? Sensitivity? More flat response? More Power handling? SPL?

The LAB12 speaker was designed by Tom Danley with the goal in Mind to get the maximum achivable sensitivity and low freq. extension in that HORN. What you can increase is Power handling, and/or decrease Power compression to get more SPL out of this design (LABHORN), meaning you could use a driver with very similar T/S parameters, just with more power handling/ better cooling etc.

FYI to get the fully potential of the LAbhorn, one could stack  6 or even 8 LAbhorn elements together to get the right horn area.
In this case the efficiency is around 50% of the system, which can't be further increased.
You can stack up more cabinets to get more directivity and more total Power handling and thus you will get more SPL.

I hope this makes things clear.

all the Best,


The graph was made with the condition quarter space! This means, that for 4 LAbhorns in Halfspace (each driven by 20 Vrms) at a distance of 1 m you should add to this graph 6 dB!

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