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Author Topic: First Impressions  (Read 4084 times)

Jake Scudder

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First Impressions
« on: December 27, 2010, 05:38:31 pm »

The software is ugly.  Not a deal breaker but it will be interesting to see what the finished product looks like.

The WYSIWYG editor seems good.

I like being able to attach more than one thing without a "hack".

I'm not a tree-view user but I agree that it is silly for the new software to be alienating many who are.

I visit PSW almost every day.  I don't read much of the content.  I peruse for interesting threads or theater topics I might chime in on. I rarely post anymore.  I doubt much will change with the new software.  If the new forums get rid of the riff-raff and encourage some of the more seasoned lurkers to come out of the woodwork, I'd participate more.  I don't think that's the goal of the new software so I have my doubts.


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Silas Pradetto

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2011, 12:09:12 pm »

I hate that I can't quote one thread.

I hate the whitespace and the awful theme. Doesn't anyone know CSS anymore????

I agree with Jake, I don't read all the crap, I look to help people out with their issues by posting.

If this is how the new forum is going to work, I can see myself retiring from PSW.
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Chad Curll

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2011, 01:58:16 pm »

I hate that I can't quote one thread.

Buh? Can't quote a single post? Or a line of replies? You can nest as many quotes as needed; looking for some clarification here.
Quote
I hate the whitespace and the awful theme. Doesn't anyone know CSS anymore????

Well, it isn't CSS that's the problem. Feel free to download Firebug and Web Dev Tools for Firefox and play around with the CSS if you've got something specific in mind; this is, of course, the default theme and won't remain.

Quote

I agree with Jake, I don't read all the crap, I look to help people out with their issues by posting.

If this is how the new forum is going to work, I can see myself retiring from PSW.

That's a bit harsh. We want you to stick around. This is a stress test/beta, we need members to help get the forums correct. With all due respect, you're being a bit childish about some issues that we are more than willing to work/currently working on. Especially since that was your very first post here. We'd really appreciate it if members played around with the software, give us detailed feedback on what we can fix (and not just "eh, everything"), and let us work on it.

If we just flipped a switch, I'd understand the anger. But, we're giving a long, long transition window to try to accommodate as much as possible :)
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Mike Locke

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2011, 10:51:01 pm »

With all due respect, you're being a bit childish about some issues that we are more than willing to work/currently working on. Especially since that was your very first post here. We'd really appreciate it if members played around with the software, give us detailed feedback on what we can fix (and not just "eh, everything"), and let us work on it.

If we just flipped a switch, I'd understand the anger. But, we're giving a long, long transition window to try to accommodate as much as possible :)

It's not childish, and what are you doing bashing your client?

The forums are valuable for their immense amount of knowledge, both historically and living.  Unless there is a change to the old posts not being carried over the negatives far outweigh the positives of this experiment.

Mike
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Ned Ward

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2011, 11:18:42 pm »

Quote
Unless there is a change to the old posts not being carried over the negatives far outweigh the positives of this experiment.

Sorry,  but that's a deal breaker. I get as much information out of old archived posts as I do from new ones. Also, the whole idea is to have people SEARCH for the answers before asking again what is the best kick drum, are JBL JRX speakers any good, etc. Not having that information cataloged as part of the new forums not only diminishes the value of the "revamped" site, but also will make it hard for those who stay to answer inane questions (like my first ones) since they can't tell people to search first.

I'm not a programmer so I don't know what's entailed in bringing those posts over; even if they were locked and read only it would be worth it. Otherwise, you're really asking for a lot of information to be redone from a group of people who had no problem with the old UI.
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Andy Peters

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #5 on: January 07, 2011, 07:31:25 pm »

Quote
Buh? Can't quote a single post? Or a line of replies? You can nest as many quotes as needed; looking for some clarification here.

Nested quoting test.

Yes, it seems to work, sorta, but the user has to enter the higher-level quotes manually. When you hit "reply" to a post that has quotes in it, all but the most-recent post is tossed.

Doing it manually, for some reason I was not able to enter author=andy in the markup.

So it sorta works, but it still sucks.

-a
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Chad Curll

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2011, 08:22:18 pm »

It's not childish, and what are you doing bashing your client?

The forums are valuable for their immense amount of knowledge, both historically and living.  Unless there is a change to the old posts not being carried over the negatives far outweigh the positives of this experiment.

Mike

We've asked repeatedly for members to find content they enjoy/use/need and to bring it over -- no one has brought a single item to our attention.

http://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/board,20.0.html
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Bennett Prescott

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2011, 12:10:35 am »

We've asked repeatedly for members to find content they enjoy/use/need and to bring it over -- no one has brought a single item to our attention.

http://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/board,20.0.html
Chad,

That's because there's not one or two posts. There's all of them. When I want to find that discussion about, say, Aviom from two years ago... well, I don't need it now, but when I do, it's going to be gone.
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-- Bennett Prescott
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Phil LaDue

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #8 on: January 08, 2011, 01:50:27 am »

Are you seriously suggesting we backup whole topics to this site?
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Philip LaDue
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Chad Curll

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #9 on: January 08, 2011, 09:39:36 am »

Are you seriously suggesting we backup whole topics to this site?

I'm suggesting the members, at the minimum, let us know what they want saved so we can do what we can to save that material.
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Bennett Prescott

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #10 on: January 08, 2011, 10:23:55 am »

Chad,

Is there any chance that with this forum software we could get "indented flat view"? I've seen it elsewhere, where replies to a post are indented slightly below the post, to three levels or so. Lets me keep the reading convenience of flat view with the referential integrity of threaded.
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-- Bennett Prescott
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"Give me 6dB and I shall move the world." -Archimedes

John Roberts {JR}

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #11 on: January 08, 2011, 11:21:01 am »

Quote from: Phil LaDue on Today at 01:50:27 am
Are you seriously suggesting we backup whole topics to this site?
I'm suggesting the members, at the minimum, let us know what they want saved so we can do what we can to save that material.

I'm suggesting the members, at the minimum, let us know what they want saved so we can do what we can to save that material.

OK, here's an idea that might work if you can code it up...

Instead of having Karma accounts and votes for members, how about a Karma count for individual posts.

People get to vote when they read a post and vote "it's a keeper" or "it's a waste of bits", after some fair amount of time, the posts that get no love fall off the end of the world, and the posts that get enough love, live on.  Perhaps even rank them with highest + votes rising to the top of the list. 

I make many posts that I would vote to deep six myself, after a quick splash. While I hate investing time in a long technical response that is never seen again after a few days.

Post count, or even love for a poster is not enough. Good people can make bad posts, and some drive-bys are worth keeping. (Like the exchange between Whitlock and the DI guy). 

or not....

JR
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EvanKirkendall

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #12 on: January 08, 2011, 11:24:04 pm »

We've asked repeatedly for members to find content they enjoy/use/need and to bring it over -- no one has brought a single item to our attention.

http://forums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/board,20.0.html

I'd start with backing up this:

http://srforums.prosoundweb.com/index.php/i/6178/




Evan
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Ned Ward

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2011, 02:01:50 pm »

Chad -

You're not getting a lot of responses to this because it's an inane question. We need all of the PSW backed up because we don't know what we don't need. Being able to google search the PSW has been invaluable to me as I've learned to search first, search again, ask later. There's way too much information that is hidden in threads that people may use now, but as they move up may need later. Or people may be on one piece of equipment, but suddenly find themselves in front of a different mixer at a show.

Asking members to do all of the hard work when we are reluctantly being asked to shift to a design no one asked for isn't exactly epitomizing customer service - more like rubbing salt in our wounds.

If you'd like to earn yourself karma, figure out how to back up/save all posts at least from LAB, LAB Lounge, Product Reviews, Road Test and Basement. It's really worth the effort and will make the new site one people will come back to vs. shunning and complaining over.
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Brad Weber

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2011, 01:52:07 pm »

I was optimistic about the new forum.  I like the ease of working with attachments, the visual look has gotten better than it was initially, etc.  However, the new is wearing off already and I am getting more confused about how and why this transition is occurring.

My primary issue is regarding existing information.  I agree with the views already expressed, many times I'll run into something, do a search and find something from a past post that is still relevant.  I don't know what I may need next month or next year so I can't tell you that now.  My only response to the request of what to migrate would be "everything".  At least for me, potentially losing something that I may not realize I need now but that may be of tremendous value in the future more than offsets any potential advantages I've seen.

I also think the parallel old and new forums potentially lead to someone just starting a discussion or being in the middle of a good discussion in the old forums only to have it suddenly disappear one day.  There is no reason to increase what will be lost in the transitions, so how about either mirroring threads and posts on both versions while they are both running or cut off posting on the old forums?

I personally miss tree view, with the way some discussions go here it was the only way I could follow some of them.  And several times now, if I create a response that requires scrolling in the response box it keeps jumping back up to the top of the text, for example I can't see what I am typing now, if I scroll down to where I am in the text then as soon as a key is released it jumps back up in the response.  I have to scroll down, type, then scroll down again to see it, then try to fix anything blindly, then scroll down to check it.  Or maybe that's just for me to try to keep my response shorter!

Added: A very minor point but how can people have 0 posts shown in the info next to their post?  They at least have that post.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2011, 05:24:45 pm by Brad Weber »
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John Roberts {JR}

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2011, 10:36:53 pm »

I'm suggesting the members, at the minimum, let us know what they want saved so we can do what we can to save that material.

Since this is a few days old perhaps you view of things has evolved.

People want to be able to search the old data base "when" they need to find something.

Asking them to tell you what to save is like asking which days of the newspaper to microfilm for future use, or which chapter of the encyclopedia to buy.

 My earlier  suggestion for a self organizing post karma valuing system is only useful going forward. Going back the wheat is mixed in with a great deal of chaff.

You are not going to get a list of things to save, the sentiment is to figure out some way to save it all.

I might suggest a compromise where say the saved archive is of some fixed size (if that is the cost problem) and every year some stuff that isn't searched and considered low value gets deleted, to make room for new stuff that is considered high value and worth saving (say by something like my post Karma system).

So start out with a X Gig archive and over time it gets refined based on what people actually search or grade highly based on new post Karma. ...  But archive stays X gig large.

=====

Or perhaps offer to give the archive to somebody else to save,,, and perhaps let them extract value from it by merchandising somehow.  Somebody thinks there's value there and the customer is always right, even when wrong.

JR

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Ned Ward

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2011, 10:40:36 pm »

as a question, how many gigs are the archives if someone wanted to host the old archives? 10GB? 5? 20?
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Bill Mynatt

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #17 on: January 22, 2011, 11:15:52 am »

Buh? Can't quote a single post? Or a line of replies? You can nest as many quotes as needed; looking for some clarification here.
Well, it isn't CSS that's the problem. Feel free to download Firebug and Web Dev Tools for Firefox and play around with the CSS if you've got something specific in mind; this is, of course, the default theme and won't remain.

That's a bit harsh. We want you to stick around. This is a stress test/beta, we need members to help get the forums correct. With all due respect, you're being a bit childish about some issues that we are more than willing to work/currently working on. Especially since that was your very first post here. We'd really appreciate it if members played around with the software, give us detailed feedback on what we can fix (and not just "eh, everything"), and let us work on it.

If we just flipped a switch, I'd understand the anger. But, we're giving a long, long transition window to try to accommodate as much as possible :)

Chad, I didn't like you before I read how you treat respected members of this community.  Now I really don't like you.  It's ironic that there is so much professional collaboration on a portal ran by amateurs.  I know I know, if it's so easy why don't I do it?  Well I'm smart enough to not get committed to a project that I don't have the knowledge or resources to handle.  I wish you would have done the same.

Bill Another Person Unhappy With the New Forum Mynatt
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Brad Weber

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Re: First Impressions
« Reply #18 on: January 22, 2011, 12:36:21 pm »

That's a bit harsh. We want you to stick around. This is a stress test/beta, we need members to help get the forums correct. With all due respect, you're being a bit childish about some issues that we are more than willing to work/currently working on. Especially since that was your very first post here. We'd really appreciate it if members played around with the software, give us detailed feedback on what we can fix (and not just "eh, everything"), and let us work on it.

If we just flipped a switch, I'd understand the anger. But, we're giving a long, long transition window to try to accommodate as much as possible :)
I realize this is an older response but the more recent posts made me look at it in a different light.  This forum has a user base who for the great part work in situtations where everything has to work right the first time.  Where you try to get all the relevant input from your users and find out what they want and expect before doing anything.  Where 'beta testing' in real use with your clients is rarely acceptable.  Basically, the approach being applied to the new forum launch is an approach that would not fly in the world the forum users live in.  This may leave the impression to many forum users that the forum creators do not understand them or how they work.

Personally, I think the long transition window may be causing more confusion and problems than it is solving, especially with the PSW main Forums page linking to the 'test' forums and the 'non-test' forums being called the "old" forums.

A minor point, but wasn't it noted some time back that spell check was a matter of loading some software or module?  Is there a reason that has not happened? (Ironically, I had to edit the post due to a spelling error in the last sentence)
« Last Edit: January 22, 2011, 12:38:56 pm by Brad Weber »
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