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Author Topic: Looking to run a single Danley DBH 218 on a Crown Itech 5000HD  (Read 10914 times)

Jake R. Trutt

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Re: Looking to run a single Danley DBH 218 on a Crown Itech 5000HD
« Reply #10 on: October 17, 2014, 02:38:58 am »

I would run the amp in the 2x4 ohm mode-so parallel the inputs.

With the Danley DBH218 BE SURE to set the switch in the 2x4 ohm position AND BE SURE to wire it correctly!!!!!!!!!!!

In the 2x4 ohm position-1 driver is on pins 1 and the other driver is on pins 2.

So you need a 4 conductor NL4 cable.

Make sure you have the proper polarities on the output of the amp. (ie + amp to + NL4 at speaker end.)

In the 1x2ohm position-both drivers are paralleled on pins 1.

So NL4? And flip the dip switch just like the LS series. Huh cool, thanks for the info Ivan, I do have some questions below for you though.

I Techs are current-limited to meet specifications for AC power draw and the cord sets used and the amp design optimized for 4 ohm, 2 channel loading.  Because we're talking about current limiting, a user will be ahead to power ITechs at 208v-240v.

IIRC the 5000HD ships with a 20 amp IEC to 20 amp Edison cord in the USA.


 

I'm actually thinking about purchasing one of these for the club I work for but we'd like to do it on a single 15 amp if possible. We were thinking about using the 4050HD in stereo (we have 1 2450 driving our current subs) as that's the highest QSC amp we can think of that runs off a 15 amp plug. If not, running 2 Danley 118 would be our next choice but we massively dislike the aesthetic and would not fit our setup, unless they were on their side, which we still wouldn't necessary like doing without installing a custom grill, but the two 118s would cost us more to equal the same power (by spec sheet it should equal 3 118's and beat even the 3 down low, but I don't know, hence why I'm asking you, since you know a lot about the Danleys. We will run whatever gives us the most for the money but wanna stick on a 15 amp plug. It's pretty complicated and messy, which I don't like.. but I know the powered 218 variant has a 20 amp plug too, although if there was a spec sheet on power draw and if it wasn't enough to pop a 15 (at 1/8 sig and constant voltage, etc etc) then we'd go for that, even though it'd go against CC and some create some electrical violations, we would do it if it was our last option.. We used Yorkvilles, the ls1208's, they punched but buying 2 more just didn't make sense when we could spend a little extra and get the Danleys that, from every source and spec sheet, outperform 4 easily and are probably the equivalent of 6-8.

So I know it's crazy, but if anyone can help with a 15a amp, I'd be supremely grateful. Otherwise we will use the QSC 4050HD/4050A for it. By calculations it'd put out 136.64 db consistently (using the frequency we are aiming for downlow, it's like 144 consistently at 100hz I believe, which is nice, but we are looking at down low specifically, the extra power is definitely nice though) with the 1300w to each speaker at 4 ohms, which is still plenty higher than our LS1208's (with our 2 it's roughly 125 db constant from our measurements and 4 would only get us to 128-130 while having to run another amp and not getting the higher db at the other hz that will be played (our main goal is the hz that kicks/rattles your chest, hence the hz we are looking for, but sounding good all around is a bonus too as it'd be less working around in our driverack or 31 band eq and crossover if needed), which we can't do at the venue, and it'd still be 6db less than the 4050HD combo and 10db less than the targeted range with the DBH218), but we'd like to run it at least at its rms value.. Idk, what would you guys suggest? I'm really new to other amp companies as we have QSC so close to us in LA, but I'm willing to accept anything.

It is a 30A venue but only the one. So we split the power half to our tops, which are plenty enough to overpower the 1208's and be slightly less if not on par with the DBH218 (by my calculations at their rms output).. They need a full 15a to run as well for their rms and 20a for their programming (which we have never got into but use it for overhead). I know we will have thermal compression, and because of that it won't be consistently those numbers. However, the higher sensitivity offsets it as the DBH218 has a much higher sensitivity.

Sorry to the OP for asking this in his thread, but I am curious.
« Last Edit: October 17, 2014, 03:05:15 am by ianzchurchill »
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Ivan Beaver

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Re: Looking to run a single Danley DBH 218 on a Crown Itech 5000HD
« Reply #11 on: October 17, 2014, 08:13:12 am »

So NL4? And flip the dip switch just like the LS series. Huh cool, thanks for the info Ivan, I do have some questions below for you though.

I'm actually thinking about purchasing one of these for the club I work for but we'd like to do it on a single 15 amp if possible. We were thinking about using the 4050HD in stereo (we have 1 2450 driving our current subs) as that's the highest QSC amp we can think of that runs off a 15 amp plug. If not, running 2 Danley 118 would be our next choice but we massively dislike the aesthetic and would not fit our setup, unless they were on their side, which we still wouldn't necessary like doing without installing a custom grill, but the two 118s would cost us more to equal the same power (by spec sheet it should equal 3 118's and beat even the 3 down low, but I don't know, hence why I'm asking you, since you know a lot about the Danleys. We will run whatever gives us the most for the money but wanna stick on a 15 amp plug. It's pretty complicated and messy, which I don't like.. but I know the powered 218 variant has a 20 amp plug too, although if there was a spec sheet on power draw and if it wasn't enough to pop a 15 (at 1/8 sig and constant voltage, etc etc) then we'd go for that, even though it'd go against CC and some create some electrical violations, we would do it if it was our last option.. We used Yorkvilles, the ls1208's, they punched but buying 2 more just didn't make sense when we could spend a little extra and get the Danleys that, from every source and spec sheet, outperform 4 easily and are probably the equivalent of 6-8.

So I know it's crazy, but if anyone can help with a 15a amp, I'd be supremely grateful. Otherwise we will use the QSC 4050HD/4050A for it. By calculations it'd put out 136.64 db consistently (using the frequency we are aiming for downlow, it's like 144 consistently at 100hz I believe, which is nice, but we are looking at down low specifically, the extra power is definitely nice though) with the 1300w to each speaker at 4 ohms, which is still plenty higher than our LS1208's (with our 2 it's roughly 125 db constant from our measurements and 4 would only get us to 128-130 while having to run another amp and not getting the higher db at the other hz that will be played (our main goal is the hz that kicks/rattles your chest, hence the hz we are looking for, but sounding good all around is a bonus too as it'd be less working around in our driverack or 31 band eq and crossover if needed), which we can't do at the venue, and it'd still be 6db less than the 4050HD combo and 10db less than the targeted range with the DBH218), but we'd like to run it at least at its rms value.. Idk, what would you guys suggest? I'm really new to other amp companies as we have QSC so close to us in LA, but I'm willing to accept anything.

It is a 30A venue but only the one. So we split the power half to our tops, which are plenty enough to overpower the 1208's and be slightly less if not on par with the DBH218 (by my calculations at their rms output).. They need a full 15a to run as well for their rms and 20a for their programming (which we have never got into but use it for overhead). I know we will have thermal compression, and because of that it won't be consistently those numbers. However, the higher sensitivity offsets it as the DBH218 has a much higher sensitivity.

Sorry to the OP for asking this in his thread, but I am curious.
OK there is a lot here.

The one thing you have not considered is the efficiency of the amps.  All you are looking at is the rated power and the type of plug. 

When you are saying "down low" in freq-exactly what does that mean?  What freq?  THere may be better options that can get you louder with less power. 

You say the 118s won't look right-exactly what does that mean?  Is it is a size thing?  WHat are your size limitations for installing?  That can make a big difference in what cabinets to choose.

The powered DBH218 comes with a 20A POWERCON plug on the amp-but a regular edison 15A on the cable.

When looking at amps-you can always change the AC plug to a 15A plug.  Some amps come with 20A plugs to satisfy the UL requirements-even if the particular usage  does not need it.

I am assuming you have MEASUREMENTS of the response of your current speaker system-so that you are comparing specific freq to specific freq?

If not-then your calculations could be way off if you are using the "simple numbers" to try to attempt to do comparisons.

You say you are interested in down low-and then you mention that you are interested in chest punch.  Those are very different freq and about an octave apart.

You need to be more specific about what you are mostly interested in.  The reason is that if you are willing to give up some of the low freq extension-you can get louder at the chest punch region.

It is all a trade off.

I think you are trying to tie different things together.  You are using the power ratings of the loudspeakers and trying to get amps for that size without really looking at the sensitivity at particular freq for a particular output.

BTW carrying out SPL number to 2 decimal places is completely worthless, even rounding out to a dB or 2 is more than enough.-since the individual speakers coming off of the assembly line vary by more than that.

The way I would approach the "problem" (you are talking about 2 separate issues here) is to figure out what amp can give you the most power for your available wall power.

And that is not going to be as easy as it seems-even if the amp has a 15A plug that does not mean it cannot pull more than that.

Then as a separate issue-find the loudspeaker that has the greatest output within the freq range you are MOST interested in (freq response measurements (not SPL meter measurements )or single number spec sheet numbers) are the ONLY way to tell that.

You also have to consider what looks good or will fit in your situation and price range.

Again-I look at the amps and the speakers as separate issues here.

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Ivan Beaver
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Jake R. Trutt

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Re: Looking to run a single Danley DBH 218 on a Crown Itech 5000HD
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2014, 02:33:18 am »

Yes Ivan, I know what freq I'm looking for, and we've done graphs for our LS1208 using a few different programs. Well, I know they are a good amount apart, the freq we are looking for is between 50-75 while getting down to 30 (hence why we coupled the LS1208's, so we could get lower). We would be willing to do a different highpass, say 40 or 45, if it is still a well rounded sound (mainly EDM, hiphop, and rap tracks at the club, with some disco and oldies vibes on specific days). We don't really need anything below 30 tbh. I know it's sorta complicated but the priority is basically 50-75 and then down to 30 (a better all around sound for the music we play) if we can get that after.

I've seen the response graph for the DBH218. Hence the numbers I projected. I'm not too much of a novice in that area. My calculations are going to be extremely close, given the room dynamic may change with Danleys tests and my live testing with the LS1208's, but that DBH218 should still stomp on at least 6 LS1208's all around.

Yes, it is space as well, but it's mainly aesthetics. I've shown the other employees the TH118 and the DBH218. It should put out roughly 3 TH118's in most of the ranges we will have it (freq range of 30-100hz, and maybe 125hz cutoff if it performs well on that level, I didn't really check that part of the response graphs posted on the Danley site, but it's not really necessary, it'd just be something to mess around with and see if we like the cutoff better).

Thank you for that information. I will definitely be looking into the powered version then. I know it's finicky with electricity, but we don't really have too many choices without drawing too much, so amp efficiency and speaker efficiency are essential. I'm not too good with amp efficiency, so I avoided that as I know I'm not too educated on that yet.

Oh and I know rounding it out the decimal points is worthless, but, in a real world situation, the math on paper will lose out 3-5db or even more if room placement is not adequate. There are a lot of factors, so I take the highest number and expect it to be within a margin of 5db of that. Also, that was just the straight number I copied from the calculations I was doing earlier.

Yes, I know it will pull more, which is why I was asking cause I don't have access to the graphs on amps with crown and them. And I don't know where to look for them really. The RMX4050HD will pull 11A at 1/8 on stereo 4 ohm load. I know the spec sheets for those pretty well.

That's kinda my dilemma. From what you've said, the powered version would be the best bet. Do you have a spec sheet on the powered amp of that speaker? If it draws 14a or less at 1/8 then we will definitely talk with our dealer and get that process started.
« Last Edit: October 18, 2014, 02:53:50 am by ianzchurchill »
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Tim McCulloch

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Re: Looking to run a single Danley DBH 218 on a Crown Itech 5000HD
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2014, 01:08:59 pm »



That's kinda my dilemma. From what you've said, the powered version would be the best bet. Do you have a spec sheet on the powered amp of that speaker? If it draws 14a or less at 1/8 then we will definitely talk with our dealer and get that process started.

How about talking with your deal for an in situ demo?
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Re: Looking to run a single Danley DBH 218 on a Crown Itech 5000HD
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2014, 01:08:59 pm »


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