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[Mac Kerr]

Sorry to hear of your trials and tribs

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Mac

[Jesse Balfour]

Well I suppose we have different definitions of whats acceptable output from a sub. Interesting though I've used the nx720p and would take it anyday over the ELX118p. Yorkville crams a lot of value into their NX series boxes if you ask me. As stated, in this room the sub is indeed being fed from an external crossover. And for a self powered box with internal processing you really shouldn't have to use an external dsp or setup for aux fed sub to get the most out of it.

The house dj brought his mackie 15" back and we A/B'ed them, no contest the EV output considerably less volume and less LF extension when both were set to unity.

But I digress...I'm glad you're happy with them.

[Jesse Balfour]

Well I suppose we have different definitions of whats acceptable output from a sub. Interesting though I've used the nx720p and would take it anyday over the ELX118p. Yorkville crams a lot of value into their NX series boxes if you ask me. As stated, in this room the sub is indeed being fed from an external crossover. And for a self powered box with internal processing you really shouldn't have to use an external dsp or setup for aux fed sub to get the most out of it.

The house dj brought his mackie 15" back and we A/B'ed them, no contest the EV output considerably less volume and less LF extension when both were set to unity.

But I digress...I'm glad you're happy with them.

Ahhhh! I think there lies your prob. These subs have an "undefeatable" 100Hz crossover built into the sub at a 24db/slope roll off, if your running an external x-over with the same slope you would be running into horrible phase issues with the sub, hence the lack in volume and punch. Try running the sub straight from your board and I would bet you will end up with a shit load more volume and thump.

[Jesse Balfour]

Ahhhh! I think there lies your prob. These subs have an "undefeatable" 100Hz crossover built into the sub at a 24db/octave slope roll off, if your running an external x-over with the same slope you would be running into horrible phase issues with the sub, hence the lack in volume and punch. Try running the sub straight from your board and I would bet you will end up with a shit load more volume and thump.

Ahhhh! I think there lies your prob. These subs have a " non defeatable" 100Hz crossover built into the sub at a 24db/octave slope roll off, if your running an external x-over with the same slope you would in effect be running a 48db/octave slope possibly causing horrible phase delay issues with the sub, hence the lack in volume and punch. Try running the sub without the external x-over. and I would bet you will end up with a shit load more volume and thump.

[Bryan Mac Berntsen]

Thanks for the review.  I think you clearly presented the situation and dilemma in which you were testing and drew your opinion.  I was personally looking to purchase a pair myself considering the price, size and weight and most important high SPL.  I read a few reviews on another forum that said they performed adequate but far below advertised SPL.  Two reviewers even metered them in the mid 120's real world which is still decent for the price, but I think its a crummy marketing ploy to show higher than produceable volumes.  I guess they were too good to be true!!!  Guess Im gonna keep looking!!!

[john sanders]

Again, a well written and accurately explained review that I found to be informative, fair and balanced.

[George Friedman-Jimenez]

In the review, I think the apparent use of two LPFs, one in the external crossover and one internal nondefeatable, invalidates the observation of lack of SPL of the ELX118. That criticism of the review seems well taken, and is likely to be correct. The OP no longer has the subwoofer and did not test it without the external crossover to disprove the double crossover explanation of his observation. The redundant crossover problem does not, however, invalidate the observation of lack of low frequency extension, which I also noted on critical listening to the ELX118 in the store. Therefore, I would limit the conclusions of this review only to the lack of low frequency extension, and look to others' experiences regarding the SPL issue.

[Loren Aguey]

In the review, I think the apparent use of two LPFs, one in the external crossover and one internal nondefeatable, invalidates the observation of lack of SPL of the ELX118. That criticism of the review seems well taken, and is likely to be correct. The OP no longer has the subwoofer and did not test it without the external crossover to disprove the double crossover explanation of his observation. The redundant crossover problem does not, however, invalidate the observation of lack of low frequency extension, which I also noted on critical listening to the ELX118 in the store. Therefore, I would limit the conclusions of this review only to the lack of low frequency extension, and look to others' experiences regarding the SPL issue.

I never followed up on this but here it is. We didn't end up getting rid of the EV sub. Its still there. When the sub was opened the packaging was thrown away and the seller won't take returns without original packaging.

As for the double high pass theory, I actually did try bypassing the dbx 223xl after Jesse mentioned it but I did not perceive any noticeable difference in output or performance. Its less a matter of how loud it gets(although again, not very loud before it goes into protect), its more a matter of how it sounds and how it does not offer the LF extension that is advertised in the specs.

That criticism of the review seems well taken, and is likely to be correct..

Please elaborate on this. I was fully upfront about the conditions and still feel I was unbiased about all the subs I mentioned in the review and realistic about the expectations. Regardless if the the sub was in an admittedly "outmanned" situation, two tops with one sub is not unheard of and I stand by the fact that the sub with those advertised specs should perform better.

[George Friedman-Jimenez]

OK so you are saying you did try the sub without the external crossover and did not hear a difference in output (SPL?) or performance (sound quality?). So the double Low Pass Filter (not high pass) of the 100 Hz internal crossover and the LPF in the external crossover then does not explain the low output that you observed. How did you observe this, did you A/B the sub just below clipping with and without the external crossover or did you switch the external crossover on and off without adjusting the gain? Was the Boost switch on or off when you listened?
I am not questioning your observation of lack of low frequency extension or uneven sound quality. I observed the same when I listened to the sub in the store. Without boost mode, it sounded very peaky around 60-80 Hz, which is exactly what the FR graph in the manual shows now that I look at it. With an additional external LPF in addition to the internal 100 Hz LPF, I can imagine it would be even peakier with or without boost mode. With the boost mode on, the peak would be lower, but still nowhere near flat response in the frequency range of interest. On paper it looks flattest with the boost mode on, and the crossover looks to be around 90 Hz not 100. Have you tried it with boost on and the external LPF off, with the external HPF for your tops set around 90?

[Loren Aguey]

OK so you are saying you did try the sub without the external crossover and did not hear a difference in output (SPL?) or performance (sound quality?). So the double Low Pass Filter (not high pass) of the 100 Hz internal crossover and the LPF in the external crossover then does not explain the low output that you observed. How did you observe this, did you A/B the sub just below clipping with and without the external crossover or did you switch the external crossover on and off without adjusting the gain? Was the Boost switch on or off when you listened?
I am not questioning your observation of lack of low frequency extension or uneven sound quality. I observed the same when I listened to the sub in the store. Without boost mode, it sounded very peaky around 60-80 Hz, which is exactly what the FR graph in the manual shows now that I look at it. With an additional external LPF in addition to the internal 100 Hz LPF, I can imagine it would be even peakier with or without boost mode. With the boost mode on, the peak would be lower, but still nowhere near flat response in the frequency range of interest. On paper it looks flattest with the boost mode on, and the crossover looks to be around 90 Hz not 100. Have you tried it with boost on and the external LPF off, with the external HPF for your tops set around 90?

There was no A/B process. I have a spare aux on the console so I wired in an aux fed sub setup and just went with it for the night. Its the same band I mix every week and my observation was that bypassing the high cut filter did not make it any better of a sub. Even when having more control over the amount of signal sent to the sub my main issues with the sub remained. Again, sound quality, usable output, and frequency response.

Now its certainly possible that using measurement software you could find there is slightly more output or better frequency response when feeding the sub a full range signal, but my guess is that it would be negligible.

After my first night with this sub the boost seemed to make it more susceptible to going into protect mode, so I've left it off ever since and just go easy on it.

[ProSoundWeb Community]