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Author Topic: how about some FOH console recommendations  (Read 6086 times)

Darin Brunet

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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #20 on: July 06, 2010, 02:15:59 pm »

Chris,

My priority #1 would be to get a professional to analyze the space you have, even if done by the engineering prints. You simply MUST get the acoustic space done correctly. I cannot stress this point enough to you and your "decision makers".

~No amount of EQ will make up for bad acoustics~

See my comments in the RTA thread to get an understanding. You said you own a small recording studio, you should know how important this truly is. If the acoustic space is not dealt with properly, you are simply wasting money.

Once the acoustic space is dealt with, select the loudspeaker system to give the required coverage at the required sound level and frequency response. It will be monumentally easier to get good sound. If flying is required, use a certified rigger.

Choose the best quality cabling you can, using the right type of cables for the application. Remember to run enough cabling. It is easier to do this once than two or three times to get it right. Consider your current needs and future needs.

How many performers are there on stage? Do I need a drum sub-mixer on stage or 3-7 mic lines back to FOH to mix the drum kit there? What about a podium or lectern, if any? Do I need a mid-side mic setup for recording the sermon or a Countryman headset, or BOTH, using an automixer? Is there a choir, do they need micing? If so, how? Will there be soloists that need a wireless handy or a headset? Point is, run enough cables. Since there is no trench from the stage to FOH, CAT5e or CAT6 based digital snake is probably the way to go. Some snakes are fiber based, and may prove easier to install and also have greater range, if needed. I have used the ProCo Catalyst and Momentum systems, both are very good quality. ProCo also has an IEM system, the mo8me that is very flexible.

Since you mentioned Avioms, have you considered the ProCo mo8me, Roland RSS M48's or the MyMix from Movek? I think as long as your musicians are comfortable with them, IEMs are the way to go. If they aren't, give them time to get used to them. They can feel a bit isolated if not mixed correctly. You may need to add an "audience/ambience" mic to mix into the IEMs.

Select the appropriate amplification for your needs, using high quality units. I, personally, like the Crown and QSC products. You do not need the "highest-end" stuff, just good reliability. I choose to remote mount my amps to keep speaker cable length to a minimum. I also choose to remote mount my wireless receivers and run balanced line back to FOH. Again, my preference.

Once this is all considered, make a selection of mixing desk to meet the required channels/busses/auxes, etc.

I think you should be able to meet your requirements with your stated budget. Good luck and God bless. May His Kingdom be increased through your efforts.
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Chris Harwood

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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2010, 08:47:16 pm »

Meeting Thursday night and you all have helped a lot.

I think I've got a solid handle and using some pics/ideas from db audio and video  (thx Ivan) I think help to visually illustrate my point.

I totally agree with the comments above, but was needing the "wording" how to explain it.  I KNOW acoustic treatment is mandatory (as done in my studio too), but this is new territory for the "decision makers".  But I DO believe they will understand.

I know God has given my knowledge in this area for a reason, and able to find answers in forums like this.  This is NOT coincidence...but I won't get into testimony!

I guess I should apologize for my silly first question  (which console??...), but that seems to interest the most at the church at this point, and I was getting out of order in the planning by asking.

God bless you guys!
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Don Sullivan

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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2010, 12:59:14 pm »

Please Please consider a digital console such as the Yamaha M7. Having been through the training exercise with very technically challenged volunteers, the issue of competency is not as large as you fear, and the ability to recall EQ / Compression and other settings, as well as LOCK certain settings is worth every penny, not to mention the savings on external gear like compressors, effects, etc.

Also, look at the head-worn microphones such as the Countryman, AT and others as your pastor primary mic. Get a real pro to evaluate your room and work with you, Call Tom George at 8th day sound in Ohio, or another competent system designer in your area.
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Chris Harwood

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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #23 on: July 09, 2010, 12:29:58 pm »

so the enemy tried to throw some "symptoms" my way and my throat was way too inflamed to meet with the Pastor Thurday night.  Once these "symptoms" go away, I will be scheduling a new meeting.

Meanwhile, it is giving me time to "relax" and absorb more of what info needs to be passed along.
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Chris Harwood

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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #24 on: July 12, 2010, 12:30:13 am »

Pastor offered to my wife this evening at a meeting (she's also his personal assistant), that he wants to make sure the treatments and speakers are done right.  Turns out, a neighboring church, just built, went thru some "fix it" acoustical treatments to "fix" their sanctuary which apparently turned out horrible after the build, negating to do what's needed DURING the build.  Also mentioned that the cement contractors made a mistake and a trench WILL be cut... at a heavily reduced price (but I'd pray for free).

Ya gotta love our God!

More to continue.  I KNOW this will be to the glory of Him!
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Darin Brunet

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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #25 on: July 12, 2010, 01:04:02 pm »

Excellent! Chris, this is a wonderful thing! God certainly can open the eyes of people. I hope the Pastor and you can get the changes that are needed in the sanctuary system approved by the other decision makers. It would be a blessing to avoid the problems that other builds have gone through.

Get the acoustic space correct and the loudspeaker system will sound its best. I suggest that you select the best CD loudspeakers you can find/afford. Get them set up properly for the required coverage and minimize reflections. Centrally locate your subs (if used) either in a ground stack or flown, avoiding comb filtering and "power alley" the best you can. No system is perfect but you certainly should maximize your investment dollars by getting the best performance from each piece of equipment you purchase.
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Re: how about some FOH console recommendations
« Reply #25 on: July 12, 2010, 01:04:02 pm »


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