ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 11   Go Down

Author Topic: New Sound System  (Read 32106 times)

Shad Hall

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 175
New Sound System
« on: July 28, 2008, 04:36:17 pm »

Hi,

I was able to take some pictures of the sanctuary yesterday for this thread.  This Fall, we are looking towards purchasing a new sound system and being the head of the [technical] media department, I am doing my homework now to be prepared for the day of purchase.

The room is about 30' x 50'.


index.php/fa/276/0/


Here is the system that I've compiled for your feedback.

============================================================ ===
1. Mixer Board: $1299
  Allen & Heath PA28
 
2. Cable Snake: $499
  Horizon Concert Series 150' 16-Channel/4-Return Snake

3. Voice Mic's: $159
  Shure SM58A

4. Instrument Mic's: $139
  Shure SM57A


5. Mic Hoodies: $10-25
  Color-coded foam Windscreens for mics.
 

Project Totals:
$1800 (Mixer, Snake)
$640 (SM58A Mics x4)
$420 (SM57A Mics x3)
$25 (Mic Hoodies)

--------------------
$2885 Sub Total
$222 Tax (7.75%)

--------------------
$3107 Grand Total
============================================================ ===


There is a poll on the front page of the site that asked people what they thought was the most important part of a sound system was and here are the results: http://www.prosoundweb.com/index.php/about/results .  I voted for the "Operators".

Do you think the aforementioned items are the answers to our situation?

Thank you,
Shad

Logged
Shad Hall
Live Sound Tech
Roseville Community Church - Mackie 808-S
Elim Trinity Church - A&H GL2800
Sacramento, CA

"I'm an idealist. Get used to me wanting something better."

Shad Hall

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 175
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #1 on: July 28, 2008, 04:38:02 pm »

index.php/fa/277/0/
Logged
Shad Hall
Live Sound Tech
Roseville Community Church - Mackie 808-S
Elim Trinity Church - A&H GL2800
Sacramento, CA

"I'm an idealist. Get used to me wanting something better."

Shad Hall

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 175
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #2 on: July 28, 2008, 04:39:35 pm »

index.php/fa/278/0/
Logged
Shad Hall
Live Sound Tech
Roseville Community Church - Mackie 808-S
Elim Trinity Church - A&H GL2800
Sacramento, CA

"I'm an idealist. Get used to me wanting something better."

David Sumrall

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 268
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #3 on: July 28, 2008, 07:38:10 pm »

Hey Shad,

First things on my list would be......

1. Move the plant in front of House left speaker.
2. Adjust the config some so you can get the house right and house left speakers to be on the same plain and to have the same angle hitting the audience vs one on the floor and one shooting from up on high.

Then I would see how the system performs for your needs.

What are the issues you are having that have you looking at upgrades??

More 57's and 58's are always good to have around. What mics do you have now??

I've never been a fan of the colored windscreens. We use colored electrical tape when we need to color code.

Looks like you have some room issues that will make life interesting too I bet.

Are planning to keep the current speakers and powered mixer as part of the system??

I that helps a bit.

Good luck with everything!

David
Logged
David Sumrall
Audio Engineer
Gateway Church
Soutlake Texas
GatewayPeople.com

Sean LaRussa

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 65
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #4 on: July 28, 2008, 08:03:50 pm »

Shad, the prices you have listed seem to be a bit high.  Be a good steward and be sure to get prices from different places.  You should definitely be able to get better prices on that gear (for example, I know my favorite supplier, Full Compass, carries the SM58 mics for $99 - and possibly even lower if I call my rep there and get the "church" price).  Just to be clear, I do not work for Full Compass, but I have bought a LOT of gear there over the last few years (in the last year alone we had some major upgrades and spent over $80k with them) and they consistently have the best price and incredible service.  You can also call them and let them know what you have now and what you want to do and they can help you decide what would be best for your situation.
Logged

Guest

  • Guest
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2008, 08:20:41 pm »

Other things I would consider:
Are you going to use your Mackie mixer amp as your amp? I don't believe the PA28 has an amplifier in it. What are you not happy with about your system now? David is right about getting the speakers on the same plain. What kind of cabinets are those? Some good cabinets can go a long way too! Sean is right as well the prices you have quoted can definitely be beat!
Good Luck
Logged

Shad Hall

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 175
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2008, 08:39:31 pm »

David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38

Hey Shad,

First things on my list would be......

1. Move the plant in front of House left speaker.


To make this comment, we have to agree that though there is poorly balanced speaker placement, it is where it is. Now, having that plant in front of the speaker on the left works as a cheat more or less to keep from being too much for the people in the first couple of rows and as you probably noticed from the picture with the sound board, I do not have individual master channel controls. Come to think of it, that plant probably will only absorb a small amount of volume, but it does work if that is hard to believe.
David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38


2. Adjust the config some so you can get the house right and house left speakers to be on the same plain and to have the same angle hitting the audience vs one on the floor and one shooting from up on high.

That's a good idea and I'm sure there are multiple reasons this has never been taken care of, but my guess would be b/c of the rolling ceilings and everything is plaster. It's a pretty old church. Ironically, the sound is fine without echoing or other sound issues, because of learning how to work with that room over time.  However, with that said, I will definitely began to consider speaker and speaker placement options for the new system.  

David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38


Then I would see how the system performs for your needs.

What are the issues you are having that have you looking at upgrades??



We have maxed out the 6/2 (mono/stereo) channels with mics and instruments and need more.  By having 28 mono (+ additional stereo) channels, will give us room to expand and not feel constricted.  


David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38


More 57's and 58's are always good to have around. What mics do you have now??

I've never been a fan of the colored windscreens. We use colored electrical tape when we need to color code.


I have used 58's at other churches, but the mics here are absolute crap. ProSound, RadioShack, etc. It looks like people who new nothing about music, found a deal and stuck their hands in the cook's soup. typical. heh heh

Yeah, black windscreens would look better, but if the singers hand is covering up the color-coded tape system, then I have to be dead-on in knowing which person has which mic. This is not to imply laziness, because even when I worked on a 16 channel board system at a previous church, I had every single knob setting memorized just in case they got changed during the week for some reason.  It simply would be better than squinting in a lowly lit room at night during a Christmas play. Personal preference maybe is all it boils down to. =)

David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38



Looks like you have some room issues that will make life interesting too I bet.



In the first picture, there is a small 2-windowed room off to the right of the stage.  This is a tiled baptismal that may still work, but hasn't been used or tested in nearly 20 years. Our church bought this building from another church back in the day before I was around.  Anyway, there are plans to knock out that room and extend the stage for better musician placement.
David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38



Are planning to keep the current speakers and powered mixer as part of the system??


The speakers are good, clean and still produce crisp balanced tones, so I haven't looked into any new ones. However, now that you bring it up, I will look into it. It would be nice to have less gaudy speakers that produce the same levels. The powered mixer will be closeted for out door events as needed.

David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38



I that helps a bit.

Good luck with everything!

David


Thank you,
Shad
Very Happy

Logged
Shad Hall
Live Sound Tech
Roseville Community Church - Mackie 808-S
Elim Trinity Church - A&H GL2800
Sacramento, CA

"I'm an idealist. Get used to me wanting something better."

Shad Hall

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 175
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2008, 08:42:07 pm »

Sean LaRussa wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 20:03

Shad, the prices you have listed seem to be a bit high.  Be a good steward and be sure to get prices from different places.  You should definitely be able to get better prices on that gear (for example, I know my favorite supplier, Full Compass, carries the SM58 mics for $99 - and possibly even lower if I call my rep there and get the "church" price).  Just to be clear, I do not work for Full Compass, but I have bought a LOT of gear there over the last few years (in the last year alone we had some major upgrades and spent over $80k with them) and they consistently have the best price and incredible service.  You can also call them and let them know what you have now and what you want to do and they can help you decide what would be best for your situation.

Thanks! I'll check into that place. You're right, SM58 mic's are $99, but the SM58a's are $159 and from every review I read, it is the way for us to go.

I checked into that company you mentioned and they offer the same prices for the mixer and mics. As for the stage snake, a comparative model was the ProCo for $420 for the Horizon. However, I'll definitely keep in mind about checking into "church pricing" when dealing with a/v companies.

(Site book-marked.)
Peace,
Shad
Very Happy
Logged
Shad Hall
Live Sound Tech
Roseville Community Church - Mackie 808-S
Elim Trinity Church - A&H GL2800
Sacramento, CA

"I'm an idealist. Get used to me wanting something better."

Dan Costello

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 154
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #8 on: July 28, 2008, 09:22:53 pm »

Shad Hall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 20:39

David Sumrall wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 19:38


More 57's and 58's are always good to have around. What mics do you have now??

I've never been a fan of the colored windscreens. We use colored electrical tape when we need to color code.


Yeah, black windscreens would look better, but if the singers hand is covering up the color-coded tape system, then I have to be dead-on in knowing which person has which mic. This is not to imply laziness, because even when I worked on a 16 channel board system at a previous church, I had every single knob setting memorized just in case they got changed during the week for some reason.  It simply would be better than squinting in a lowly lit room at night during a Christmas play. Personal preference maybe is all it boils down to. =)



This is more of a general church-sound question and not picking on you, but is it really that big of a deal for church folks to put some masking tape on the board and label the channels "Vox L," "Vox C," "Vox R," etc or "Steve," "Joe," and "Wendy."? Everybody on the outside gets by w/o colored windscreens, why can't we?

And yes, my church has them, too. But one thing at a time.  Very Happy

-Dan.
Logged
Dan Costello

"Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.."

Shad Hall

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 175
Re: New Sound System
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2008, 11:51:25 pm »

Thomas Lamb wrote on Mon, 28 July 2008 20:20

Other things I would consider:
Are you going to use your Mackie mixer amp as your amp? I don't believe the PA28 has an amplifier in it. What are you not happy with about your system now? David is right about getting the speakers on the same plain. What kind of cabinets are those? Some good cabinets can go a long way too! Sean is right as well the prices you have quoted can definitely be beat!
Good Luck

Thanks for this particular. This thread may just prove that I have just enough knowledge to get myself into trouble.  Laughing

So I have the ability to mix sound, but evidently can learn a bit on the technical side. Very Happy

You're right, the PA28 does not have an amp in it, and I talked to someone today who suggested the Crown XTi 1000.  What are you thoughts on this one and what do I need to consider in researching a mixer amp?

As for your other question, the reason we are looking for a new system, is we've run out of inputs for the singers and instruments on a 6/2 (mono/stereo) channel board. =)

Thanks,
Shad
Logged
Shad Hall
Live Sound Tech
Roseville Community Church - Mackie 808-S
Elim Trinity Church - A&H GL2800
Sacramento, CA

"I'm an idealist. Get used to me wanting something better."

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: New Sound System
« Reply #9 on: July 28, 2008, 11:51:25 pm »


Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 11   Go Up
 



Page created in 0.024 seconds with 21 queries.