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Author Topic: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.  (Read 2375 times)

zhaddeus richardson

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compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« on: July 01, 2007, 07:19:21 pm »

HELP!!!!!

CAN ANYONE GIVE SOME INSIGHT ON THE PROPER SETTINGS FOR THE COMPRESSOR/LIMITERS THAT OUR A PART OF OUR CHURCH SOUND REINFORCEMENT SYSTEM.. I HAVE TAKEN THE TIME TODAY TO GET ALL THE MODEL NUMBERS FOR THE MIXER BOARD, COMPRESSORS/LIMITERS FOR THE VOCAL MICS, AND COMPRESSOR FOR THE INSTRUMENTS.  ANY FEEDBACK WILL BE APPRECIATED SO THAT I CAN PROPERLY ADJUST THE SETTINGS TO GET CONTROL BACK OF OUR SOUND. TODAY THE SOUND WAS THE SAME. NO CONTROL OF THE VOLUME  AND LOTS OF FEEDBACK, AND THE WORSHIP LEADERS NOT BEING DISCERNABLE ONE FROM THE OTHER..  THANKS

MIXER:  "SPIRIT" by Soundcraft 32/8
wireless mic compressor/limiter: multicom pro xl audio interactive dynamics processor model# mdx 4600
there are a total of 8 wireless mics that are being compressed by 2 of these units
there are controls for the following actions:
expander/gate, trigger, gate, threshhold, enhancer, and ratio
INSTRUMENT COMPRESSOR MODEL IS :DBX PROJECT 1
i have no knowledge of how these are set except for what i have read on line. all input will be helpful
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Lisa Gantt

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2007, 11:17:30 pm »

Zhaddeus, I'll spare you the lecture that this is a temperamental piece of gear and you should uprgade; I know what it's like to work with what you have. So go to the Beheringer website; you can download the manual for this model and they walk you through setting it up in "Application hints" in the compressor section.

    There could be other things at play here as well (speaker placement, mic placement and pickup pattern, etc.) so be on the lookout for those as well. And this little unit has some squirrely buttons on it - be sure you are only using the compression if that's all you need. Our former sound tech used one of these with unexpected results sometimes.
    Lisa
   
   
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Chris Penny

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2007, 03:23:34 am »

I agree with lisa

Check you speaker and microphone placement first and then go and look at the manuals for the compressors, and find out what all of those controls mean.

Also to me it sounds like you are compressing your groups. Remember that while your groups may be compressed, anything from your aux feeds, such as monitor sends are not, and this may also be contributing.

The key with most of these dynamic type processors, as with any system, is to keep their operation as simple as possible, as complexity tends to cause complications. If you can, what about just removing them completely?
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Chris Penny
Lead Sound Person
Caringbah Anglican Church
http://www.stphils.org

David Sumrall

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2007, 12:03:13 pm »

Hey Zhaddeus,

Grettings from just down the road in Orlando.

Looks like you are still looking for help on this.

A few of us responded to your questions at ChurchSoundCheck.com

On the Multicom Compressor, it sounds like others have said that is being inserted on subgroups, which can hurt you if it is over done. One vocal mic could trigger a volume reduction in all of the 8 mics.

First try this.. push the in/out button on the two channels that are affecting vocals- this should disable the compression effect totally- but it will not remove the tone change of the sound in the behringer piece. Does it get any better? is it closer to normal or where you were before??

If it does then the compressor is probably being over used and adjusting the settings can help.

Ok now where is setting for the output volume on each channel?? It should start at zero. Turning this up above zero in a live situation can hurt you by messing with the gain structure and push you closer to feedback.

What is the setting for the limiter?? turn it to off for now. When it is working it should not be on all the time or limiting all the time. This may be hurting you by being set too agressivly.

Ok- turn off the enhancer and contour.

On the ration knob try setting it around 2:1 or 3:1 for starters. A higher ration compresses more.

Now that some other settings are in a starting place, start working with the threshold knob. This adjusts where the compressor starts adjusting the sound. The threshold may be set at too low a number and over compressing. Start with that knob all the way to the right with it compressing nothing hopefully then turn it to the left until you see it compressing about 2-3db
.

Turn the gate to off.

Ok try that and see if that helps some. This should at least hopefully get you in a starting place. From there you can adjust the threshold to compress a bit more as needed. But be careful not to overdo it in this set up. If one vocal is really sticking out really bad. Try using another comp channel as individual insert. You will probably have better results with this approach on all the 8 mics instead of the buss.

I would also suggest you getting a hold of the manual for this piece either in hard copy or online.

Let us know how it goes.

Good luck!

David Sumrall
Technical Director/A1
First Baptist Orlando




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David Sumrall
Audio Engineer
Gateway Church
Soutlake Texas
GatewayPeople.com

Aaron McQueen

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2007, 12:22:32 pm »

Quote:

wireless mic compressor/limiter: multicom pro xl audio interactive dynamics processor model# mdx 4600
there are a total of 8 wireless mics that are being compressed by 2 of these units


Quote:

Also to me it sounds like you are compressing your groups. Remember that while your groups may be compressed, anything from your aux feeds, such as monitor sends are not, and this may also be contributing.


Quote:

On the Multicom Compressor, it sounds like others have said that is being inserted on subgroups, which can hurt you if it is over done. One vocal mic could trigger a volume reduction in all of the 8 mics.


The MDX4600 is a 4 channel comp, so the way I see is that if he has 2 units he could have a comp inserted on each channel.  Just trying to clear up some confusion.  Zhaddeus, can you reply and let us know exactly how the comps are connected.  If they are inserted into each channel, pull out the insert cable and see if you get control of the volume for that mic.  Don't forget the set the gain properly, before adding the compression.  
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Gary Creely

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2007, 12:46:30 pm »

A compressor is a difficult thing to learn how to use in the context of a forum, we can give you some guidelines and principals but it is limiting at best on a forum. (no pun intended) If you could get some one on site to give you a hands on demonstration it would go a long way.  

I would how ever make a suggestion concerning the way the compressors are inserted. Compressing a group of vocals is a different animal than compressing individual vocals. Most churches need the individual variety of compression to deal with a couple problem vocals. I would suggest identifying the vocals that need the compression most, and compressing them with the unit currently compressing the sub group. In the end I think you will have a much improved result.

Gary
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Gary Creely
STEEPLE SOUND
http://www.steeplesoundavl.com


zhaddeus richardson

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2007, 02:53:39 pm »

we are in service this coming wednesday and i will take a look at how things are connected and reply to all then.. thanks for all the input
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zhaddeus richardson

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Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2007, 03:07:49 pm »

david.
your reply seems to be the most informative of all i have read. i really appreciate it. im sure that u have dealt with a sound tech leader who instead of showing you the way these devices work they tend to seem to like doing all the running around so that they think that they are being noticed and rewarded by the man of god of that house. i am really knowledgeable of the board and have a great ear . i have never been shown how to operate this equipment(compresser/limiter, eq's. i really dont think the sound leader really knows how to correctly set it. he knows alot but not it all.). i just know that it cant be set right because of the way things sound. question... could not having the amps up enough push u into feedback if the gains are turned up to compensate for the lack of volume. i would love to meet you and perhaps learn more than im learning hands on at my ministry
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: compressor/limiter info. wireless mic issue revisited.
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2007, 03:07:49 pm »


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