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[Riley Casey]

Not sure I'm convinced that folded horns crossing over into phenolic diaphragm voice horn drivers sound better than modern systems but an interesting video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_vEhgzQtIQ

[Art Welter]

Not sure I'm convinced that folded horns crossing over into phenolic diaphragm voice horn drivers sound better than modern systems but an interesting video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_vEhgzQtIQ

Crossing to compression drivers at ~500Hz was pretty much the way it was done, and it didn't sound that great.
The Dark Side of the Moon tour was 1972-73, the Martin MH212 Phillishave wasn't introduced until 1977.
The first time I ever heard 12" midrange horns in the USA was that same year, kind of a transition to the "modern" era of sound, dedicated "low mid" from ~250-1250 was a game changer.

Those EV1829 drivers only weighed 7 pounds apiece and cost a fraction of what the 25 pound JBL 2482s did.
Certainly a lot easier to muscle to the top of the stack!

Art

[Keith Broughton]

Not sure I'm convinced that folded horns crossing over into phenolic diaphragm voice horn drivers sound better than modern systems but an interesting video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_vEhgzQtIQ

I stumbled across this vid yesterday and it is quite interesting. 28 inputs on a console is almost not workable these days!
As for the speakers, it would be interesting to hear with the "Philishave" mids.
Back in the day, we were doing bar gigs with 4 Martin subs, 2 Martin mids, 2 JBL 2350 horns and 2 - 2 pack "bullets" All HH800 power.
Time alignment? Ya...right... Adjust the position of the speakers (LOL)
Unfortunately it was an Ashley crossover but all in all, it worked pretty well!

[Dan Mortensen]

HAH, thanks for posting this.

It was fun* seeing the A&H 6 channel mixers. Those were the first mixers I bought when starting my sound company (think I bought six or so), and when they came I couldn't believe what a pile of shit they were, individually and collectively.

As shown in the video, the cases were wooden boxes although the box in the video looks a lot classier than the ones I briefly had. Those were rough, thin wood (the bottom was like 1/8" thick) with the open circuit board screwed to the frame. Not a lot of EMF shielding. Or maybe any.

The only inputs and outputs on the thing were all RCA phono jacks, with XLR inputs via connectors (and presumably transformers) potted into the cheapest, hardest plastic tubes connected to really stiff plastic wire with molded RCA on the end. I don't remember the outputs, actually, and I don't want to watch the video again.

The one in the video seems to have the faders slightly recessed from the face plate; I don't recall that mine was like that. I remember it being all flush mounted.

I think I bought them from Hamilton Brosius' firm in Massachusetts or somewhere like that (I was and am in Seattle), and they were gracious enough to refund my money in full when I sent them back about 24 hours later.

That A&H would send that out as a commercial product gave me an animus towards them that was briefly put aside when they introduced an 8 bus mixing console designed for PA in the '90s, maybe, that used the same IC for each subgroup and aux group (paired on 1 chip) which resulted in about 30db or more bleed between sub and aux when signal was present in either one.

Apparently they're making good product these days, but I will never have an A&H product in my inventory. Still pissed off about those two things.

That's quite the collection of obsolete stuff that guy has. More power to him. It's funny to see the odd things that people can get into, sad and distressing when that kind of mania extends into politics.

*Clearly not fond memories, so not actually fun.

[John Roberts {JR}]

HAH, thanks for posting this.

It was fun* seeing the A&H 6 channel mixers. Those were the first mixers I bought when starting my sound company (think I bought six or so), and when they came I couldn't believe what a pile of shit they were, individually and collectively.

As shown in the video, the cases were wooden boxes although the box in the video looks a lot classier than the ones I briefly had. Those were rough, thin wood (the bottom was like 1/8" thick) with the open circuit board screwed to the frame. Not a lot of EMF shielding. Or maybe any.

The only inputs and outputs on the thing were all RCA phono jacks, with XLR inputs via connectors (and presumably transformers) potted into the cheapest, hardest plastic tubes connected to really stiff plastic wire with molded RCA on the end. I don't remember the outputs, actually, and I don't want to watch the video again.

The one in the video seems to have the faders slightly recessed from the face plate; I don't recall that mine was like that. I remember it being all flush mounted.

I think I bought them from Hamilton Brosius' firm in Massachusetts or somewhere like that (I was and am in Seattle), and they were gracious enough to refund my money in full when I sent them back about 24 hours later.

Ham Brosious and AudioTechniques was located in Connecticut.

That A&H would send that out as a commercial product gave me an animus towards them that was briefly put aside when they introduced an 8 bus mixing console designed for PA in the '90s, maybe, that used the same IC for each subgroup and aux group (paired on 1 chip) which resulted in about 30db or more bleed between sub and aux when signal was present in either one.

That was early days and those were pretty inexpensive SKUs IIRC.  If those are the mixers I am thinking of the channel controls looked like trimpots, so not very robust.

JR

Apparently they're making good product these days, but I will never have an A&H product in my inventory. Still pissed off about those two things.

That's quite the collection of obsolete stuff that guy has. More power to him. It's funny to see the odd things that people can get into, sad and distressing when that kind of mania extends into politics.

*Clearly not fond memories, so not actually fun.

[Dave Pluke]

HAH, thanks for posting this.

It was fun* seeing the A&H 6 channel mixers. Those were the first mixers I bought when starting my sound company (think I bought six or so), and when they came I couldn't believe what a pile of shit they were, individually and collectively.

Oh. You mean like this? Yeah, flakey circuit-board mounted pots in addition to your comments. Ah, the golden era of live Rock!

Dave

[TrevorMilburn]

Crossing to compression drivers at ~500Hz was pretty much the way it was done, and it didn't sound that great.
The Dark Side of the Moon tour was 1972-73, the Martin MH212 Phillishave wasn't introduced until 1977.
The first time I ever heard 12" midrange horns in the USA was that same year, kind of a transition to the "modern" era of sound, dedicated "low mid" from ~250-1250 was a game changer.
Art

I was lucky enough to experience the original Pink Floyd  Kelsey/Martin system several times - the first time at the Dark Side of the Moon premiere concert at the Rainbow Theatre in North London. This was, at the time, the loudest concert I had ever experienced (I thought the roof was going to come down with Nick Mason's drums during one of their oldies - the concert was in 2 halves (DSOTM and oldies) and despite the lack of mid cabinets the sound was pretty  good for the time, probably because the vocals didn't need to be very prominent in the mix and certainly way better than the WEM system they had used previously. The second time was at an open air concert at Knebworth, just north of London,  in 1975 - this time with the addition of the 2x15 Gauss mid cabs. There were issues with the sound the result of, amongst other things, the fact that the system only arrived back in the UK a day or so before the event and the fact that the additional long throw JBL festival horns were still being loaded with drivers on the morning of the concert. Overall the sound was pretty good - certainly for the time - and certainly man enough to cover the crowd, albeit at less than ear shattering levels. The third time was for a free Queen concert, this time in Hyde Park in London.in 1976 - this time, the system shone. Freddy Mercury's vocals were crisp and clear as they should be.
The use of the various  mid cabinets is discussed on the Martin Audio  History section of their website and discusses the demand for such devices to give more clarity to vocals - the various models ranged from a 2x12 angled cab which was superceded by a 3x12 angled version then these were themselves superceded by the ubiquitous Phillishaves 1x12 an 2x12 cabinets the latter cabs finally allowing vocals to cut through the mix.
I, myself, used a small Martin system in 1973 with 2x 1x15  JBL  loaded bass  bins and 2xVitavox Flares loaded with Vitavox drivers with custom passive x-overs built by Dave Martin all driven by HH TPA 100 amps. To say the system honked was an understatement!

[Dan Mortensen]

Oh. You mean like this? Yeah, flakey circuit-board mounted pots in addition to your comments. Ah, the golden era of live Rock!

Dave

WoW, Dave, that's exactly what I had in mind to do with those mixers.

How did they (you??) handle the flying XLR adaptors?

And you can confirm that the pots were flaky? Sure seemed like they would be.

The first mixers that I owned were Gately 6 channels, with rotary pots and optional hi/lo EQ on each channel, with internal Lundahl (I think) transformers and XLR chassis-mount inputs. I did a similar thing with four of them, to make 24 inputs mono/L-R (no pan pot, just buttons). The mixers were generally reliable and sounded good for the time. Eventually I turned the 24 channel format into 2 12 channel mixers with a split on each channel, and outboard 10db-30db stepped attenuators on each channel.

The whole business came as kits that I put together. I was much better at soldering in those days, my summers' day job at the University A-V repair shop requiring us to make a huge number of mic cables to exacting inspections by people who enjoyed cutting off connectors that didn't meet expectations.

The next mixer was a Soundcraft 1S, which had its own joys and pains.

That picture of yours does LOOK nice....

[Dave Pluke]

WoW, Dave, that's exactly what I had in mind to do with those mixers.

How did they (you??) handle the flying XLR adaptors?

We bought that console already configured (and well-used) from Anicom Sound in Minneapolis. They'd run some pretty cool shows with it. Think the last one before turning it over to us was Roxy Music. XLRs were routed to a panel on the back. Unit on the top was a 3-way crossover (think I still have that...). The mixer got parted out in the 80's and I have no idea to where.

Dave

[Al Rettich]

My back hurts watching that video. Interesting though. Come a long way, wondering what kind of PA will be next?

Not sure I'm convinced that folded horns crossing over into phenolic diaphragm voice horn drivers sound better than modern systems but an interesting video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_vEhgzQtIQ

[ProSoundWeb Community]