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Author Topic: Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario  (Read 2169 times)

jimstolz76

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Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario
« on: April 06, 2011, 07:14:11 pm »

Hey guys!

I do mostly resi custom AV/lighting/control/security/everything installs, but have dabbled in pro audio for years and we're getting more and more commercial jobs coming across our plate.  I'd love a push in the right direction for this job we just surveyed.

Here's the scenario.  It's a golf course restaurant that has an existing distributed audio system (Crestron, Yamaha, QSC, JBL, etc).  They often have live bands play outside on their patio, just outside of the dining area.  The bands bring their own PA system. 

The issue they have is that the sound gets lost in the outdoors and the seating area are wraps around the outside of the building.  They would like to be able to send the audio into the distributed audio system which already has speakers lining the seating area.

Their idea was for two "input jacks" (they called them) that the band could "plug into".  Well ok, but the rack is probably only 50' away and I'd love to find a wireless solution that doesn't involve us wrapping conduit all over the outside of this nice building.

My thought is a transmitter that can be connected in one way or another to a line out on their PA.  Details of that portion can be figured out later.  I'm just looking for a wireless system that has a transmitter that is either a self contained "box" or maybe rackmount and we can put in a small case that they can plug in with their gear when they play.

Does this make sense, or does it sound like I may be going in the wrong direction?

If this makes sense, can anyone suggest a couple specific models I can do research on?  I've been scouring through Shure's site and it seems like my only real option may be a bodypack transmitter - which may be fine, if not a little hack-ish.   :P

Thanks guys!
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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2011, 07:32:07 pm »

Hey guys!

I do mostly resi custom AV/lighting/control/security/everything installs, but have dabbled in pro audio for years and we're getting more and more commercial jobs coming across our plate.  I'd love a push in the right direction for this job we just surveyed.

Here's the scenario.  It's a golf course restaurant that has an existing distributed audio system (Crestron, Yamaha, QSC, JBL, etc).  They often have live bands play outside on their patio, just outside of the dining area.  The bands bring their own PA system. 

The issue they have is that the sound gets lost in the outdoors and the seating area are wraps around the outside of the building.  They would like to be able to send the audio into the distributed audio system which already has speakers lining the seating area.

Their idea was for two "input jacks" (they called them) that the band could "plug into".  Well ok, but the rack is probably only 50' away and I'd love to find a wireless solution that doesn't involve us wrapping conduit all over the outside of this nice building.

My thought is a transmitter that can be connected in one way or another to a line out on their PA.  Details of that portion can be figured out later.  I'm just looking for a wireless system that has a transmitter that is either a self contained "box" or maybe rackmount and we can put in a small case that they can plug in with their gear when they play.

Does this make sense, or does it sound like I may be going in the wrong direction?

If this makes sense, can anyone suggest a couple specific models I can do research on?  I've been scouring through Shure's site and it seems like my only real option may be a bodypack transmitter - which may be fine, if not a little hack-ish.   :P

Thanks guys!

A "board mix" will likely not contain all the sound(s) necessary for a decent remote mix.  Anything such as drums and guitars (through amps) will be weak in a remote mix due to the live sound from the stage being a more than significant part of the "local" mix.  When I have had to send a full(er) mix to a remote location I have  simply used a couple of permanently mounted choir-type mics to pick up the sound to be sent to the remote location.

Lectrosonics "camera" units are good wireless sends.  But what you're sending is more important.
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jimstolz76

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Re: Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2011, 07:38:35 pm »

A "board mix" will likely not contain all the sound(s) necessary for a decent remote mix.  Anything such as drums and guitars (through amps) will be weak in a remote mix due to the live sound from the stage being a more than significant part of the "local" mix.  When I have had to send a full(er) mix to a remote location I have  simply used a couple of permanently mounted choir-type mics to pick up the sound to be sent to the remote location.

Lectrosonics "camera" units are good wireless sends.  But what you're sending is more important.

That's a good point.  Since this is an outdoor setup, would it be out of the question to set up a couple "choir-type" mics to pick up a fuller mix of everything?

Sounds like they need two separate mixes.  Maybe what I need to suggest is that THEY provide the PA system and it would include a mixer and wireless setup.  Then the band would have to do a separate soundcheck just for the "remote" mix.  It's probably going to be more than they want to do, but I'll make whatever suggestion needs to be made.

Just point me in the right direction and try not to bash me too badly!

j/k... my love of pro sound is inversely related to my experience with it.   :)
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Henry Cohen

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Re: Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2011, 09:36:08 pm »

Hey guys!

I do mostly resi custom AV/lighting/control/security/everything installs, but have dabbled in pro audio for years and we're getting more and more commercial jobs coming across our plate.  I'd love a push in the right direction for this job we just surveyed.

Here's the scenario.  It's a golf course restaurant that has an existing distributed audio system (Crestron, Yamaha, QSC, JBL, etc).  They often have live bands play outside on their patio, just outside of the dining area.  The bands bring their own PA system. 

The issue they have is that the sound gets lost in the outdoors and the seating area are wraps around the outside of the building.  They would like to be able to send the audio into the distributed audio system which already has speakers lining the seating area.

Their idea was for two "input jacks" (they called them) that the band could "plug into".  Well ok, but the rack is probably only 50' away and I'd love to find a wireless solution that doesn't involve us wrapping conduit all over the outside of this nice building.

My thought is a transmitter that can be connected in one way or another to a line out on their PA.  Details of that portion can be figured out later.  I'm just looking for a wireless system that has a transmitter that is either a self contained "box" or maybe rackmount and we can put in a small case that they can plug in with their gear when they play.

Does this make sense, or does it sound like I may be going in the wrong direction?

If this makes sense, can anyone suggest a couple specific models I can do research on?  I've been scouring through Shure's site and it seems like my only real option may be a bodypack transmitter - which may be fine, if not a little hack-ish.   :P

As this is a stationary and fixed application, I would strongly recommend you investigate all options for running either copper or fiber: Wireless will never be as reliable as a wired (glassed?) interface, and there are jacket chemistries (direct burial, weather and UV resistant, etc.) that preclude the need for conduit. Are you prepared to do an initial frequency coordination to select the right frequency, with an additional one or two as spares, and who'd be coordinating with the live acts bringing in their own wireless?
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Henry Cohen

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g'bye, Dick Rees

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Re: Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2011, 09:54:20 pm »

That's a good point.  Since this is an outdoor setup, would it be out of the question to set up a couple "choir-type" mics to pick up a fuller mix of everything?

Sounds like they need two separate mixes.  Maybe what I need to suggest is that THEY provide the PA system and it would include a mixer and wireless setup.  Then the band would have to do a separate soundcheck just for the "remote" mix.  It's probably going to be more than they want to do, but I'll make whatever suggestion needs to be made.

Just point me in the right direction and try not to bash me too badly!

j/k... my love of pro sound is inversely related to my experience with it.   :)

There will be little chance that a system can be set up which will really provide more than a faint approximation of the "live" sound without a qualified sound person to work the equipment for whatever bands come in.  It all boils down to the standards of those paying the bills.  Certainly you can pipe sound around at will, but whether the sound is worth piping around is the bigger question for me.  What are their real expectations?  Are they willing to pay the freight?

They'll really need a sound person........
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Re: Help with finding a wireless system for this scenario
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2011, 09:54:20 pm »


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