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Bose ControlSapce Designer - Design vs. Reality

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Brian McGrew:
Hi, guys!

Next week I知 off to tune a system at church that痴 using a Bose ConstrolSpace system.  Interesting enough, in all my years, I致e never come across a Bose system and know very little about it.  I知 finding it rather difficult to find answers on the innerwebs or Bose support.  So, my hope is there is some knowledge out here that can point me in the right direction!  But, I do have the ControlSpace Designer software and their design file, so I guess I知 a step ahead in trying to prepare.

The system has four PowerMatch 8500N amplifiers and a single ESP-4120.  I will attach a screenshot of the design.  The ESP and three of the amps are original from 2014 and the forth amp was added later (without the help of the integrator) in 2019.

The original engineering ddrawings show the DSP as stand-alone but the design does not show the ESP-4120 in the layout, however under Tools -> Set Master DSP, PM8500N1-1 is checked. 

All four amps are in the design.  Three of the amps have visible routing and DSP configurations but the fourth appears to just be sitting there unused, at least in the design file.  I知 told the fourth amp drives speakers on the balcony and is working properly.  I have already confirmed that the other three amps, at least in terms of i/o routing, match the engineering drawings from when the system was installed in 2014.

I have two questions (to start with):

1)    Is the ESP-4120 enslaved to and controlled by the master DSP amplifier or, should it be a separate entity in the design file?  In the designer under Sound Processors, I do not have this model as an option.  I am concerned the ESP is not being used and only basic DSP from the amps is in use.
2)   Since the fourth amp shows unconfigured in the design file, can I assume they致e just split or looped the signal somewhere and are using a default configuration with no DSP.  I will mention that all the amps does show a green signal LED when everything is in use.

A screenshot of the design from ControlSpace Designer is attached and I知 sure I値l have more questions but, I知 hoping not to walk into this blind.  I greatly appreciate any knowledge you can share!

Thanks!

-brian

Mac Kerr:

--- Quote from: BDMcGrew on August 20, 2023, 09:57:10 PM ---Hi, guys!

Next week I知 off to tune a system at church that痴 using a Bose ConstrolSpace system.  Interesting enough, in all my years, I致e never come across a Bose system and know very little about it.  I知 finding it rather difficult to find answers on the innerwebs or Bose support.  So, my hope is there is some knowledge out here that can point me in the right direction!  But, I do have the ControlSpace Designer software and their design file, so I guess I知 a step ahead in trying to prepare.

The system has four PowerMatch 8500N amplifiers and a single ESP-4120.  I will attach a screenshot of the design.  The ESP and three of the amps are original from 2014 and the forth amp was added later (without the help of the integrator) in 2019.

The original engineering ddrawings show the DSP as stand-alone but the design does not show the ESP-4120 in the layout, however under Tools -> Set Master DSP, PM8500N1-1 is checked. 

All four amps are in the design.  Three of the amps have visible routing and DSP configurations but the fourth appears to just be sitting there unused, at least in the design file.  I知 told the fourth amp drives speakers on the balcony and is working properly.  I have already confirmed that the other three amps, at least in terms of i/o routing, match the engineering drawings from when the system was installed in 2014.

I have two questions (to start with):

1)    Is the ESP-4120 enslaved to and controlled by the master DSP amplifier or, should it be a separate entity in the design file?  In the designer under Sound Processors, I do not have this model as an option.  I am concerned the ESP is not being used and only basic DSP from the amps is in use.
2)   Since the fourth amp shows unconfigured in the design file, can I assume they致e just split or looped the signal somewhere and are using a default configuration with no DSP.  I will mention that all the amps does show a green signal LED when everything is in use.

A screenshot of the design from ControlSpace Designer is attached and I知 sure I値l have more questions but, I知 hoping not to walk into this blind.  I greatly appreciate any knowledge you can share!

Thanks!

-brian

--- End quote ---

Please go to your profile and change your name to your real full name as required by the posting rules.

Mac
admin

Mike Caldwell:
Behind that rack looks like a fun mess!!!

Craig Hauber:

--- Quote from: Brian McGrew on August 20, 2023, 09:57:10 PM ---Hi, guys!

Next week I知 off to tune a system at church that痴 using a Bose ConstrolSpace system.  Interesting enough, in all my years, I致e never come across a Bose system and know very little about it.  I知 finding it rather difficult to find answers on the innerwebs or Bose support.  So, my hope is there is some knowledge out here that can point me in the right direction!  But, I do have the ControlSpace Designer software and their design file, so I guess I知 a step ahead in trying to prepare.

The system has four PowerMatch 8500N amplifiers and a single ESP-4120.  I will attach a screenshot of the design.  The ESP and three of the amps are original from 2014 and the forth amp was added later (without the help of the integrator) in 2019.

The original engineering ddrawings show the DSP as stand-alone but the design does not show the ESP-4120 in the layout, however under Tools -> Set Master DSP, PM8500N1-1 is checked. 

All four amps are in the design.  Three of the amps have visible routing and DSP configurations but the fourth appears to just be sitting there unused, at least in the design file.  I知 told the fourth amp drives speakers on the balcony and is working properly.  I have already confirmed that the other three amps, at least in terms of i/o routing, match the engineering drawings from when the system was installed in 2014.

I have two questions (to start with):

1)    Is the ESP-4120 enslaved to and controlled by the master DSP amplifier or, should it be a separate entity in the design file?  In the designer under Sound Processors, I do not have this model as an option.  I am concerned the ESP is not being used and only basic DSP from the amps is in use.
2)   Since the fourth amp shows unconfigured in the design file, can I assume they致e just split or looped the signal somewhere and are using a default configuration with no DSP.  I will mention that all the amps does show a green signal LED when everything is in use.

A screenshot of the design from ControlSpace Designer is attached and I知 sure I値l have more questions but, I知 hoping not to walk into this blind.  I greatly appreciate any knowledge you can share!

Thanks!

-brian

--- End quote ---
Caleb Dueck is a regular on these forums and he's been dealing/fighting a recent Bose install at a church.  If he doesn't see this first, you might consider reaching out to him.

Every PM8500 job I've encountered just has the bose speaker preset put into it but still remains a dumb 1:1 amp with which we drive from a Qsys core.  So I'm not familiar with more complex routing or multichannel applications.

I do know those 8500's run really hot and draw considerable power even at idle so when you have 36 of them in one room you can dim the local grid while heating the whole building!  -lol

Caleb Dueck:

--- Quote from: Craig Hauber on August 23, 2023, 11:39:03 AM ---Caleb Dueck is a regular on these forums and he's been dealing/fighting a recent Bose install at a church.  If he doesn't see this first, you might consider reaching out to him.

--- End quote ---

I didn't have any hand in that system; the integrator they chose used cheap Crown DSP amps instead of Bose amps, even they couldn't stand them.  The subwoofers (single 18") are horrible - low SPL output levels of mush. 

Some systems are so bad your best bet is to swap things out completely, or politely walk away.  Behringer, Bose, and similar fall into that category for me. 

Sorry I can't be of more help; I'll donate the gasoline if you supply the match! 

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