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[Dan Richardson]

Yet in reply #4, they refer to using the 1/4" input, so they must be using a converter.
Though he wasn't explicit about it, I think what Mike was getting at was to use the mic input, not the Hi-Z Instrument 1/4" input.

Nope. He says in the first post that a hiZ mic works. He's clarifying here that he thinks that's because it bypasses the preamp, indicating that the preamp is busted.

[LarryCottrill]

Use a standard XLR mic cable.
That mic does not require phantom power, it is a dynamic "shotgun" mic.
The long tube is tuned with the openings along the sides to cancel sound pick up
from the sides in relation to the sound picked from the front.

Mike - OK, my later-than-late night description of what I'm doing is maybe not very clear here.

I know and agree with everything you have just said. As I mentioned somewhere back there, I used to use the mic perfectly successfully back in my "serious amateur" filmmaking days. Later, I acquired the preamp, just to get more control over the front end - it worked beautifully, and as a bonus, the external preamp just sounds a heck of a lot better than the front end of anything else I have. So, I know about the cable (apparently I need to order a new one for comparison) and am trying to use it.

OK, so, you're trying to use a mic preamp in a manner that bypasses the mic preamp, yet you're puzzled that there's not much gain?
As Mike C says, use a standard mic cable into the mic input and you won't need to mess around with replacement tubes or getting either preamp or mic serviced.

I am doing two different things - one works as it always has, and one does not. (One note I will add: all this stuff has sat unused for years until a year or so ago when I dusted it off and started trying to use it. Like riding a bike, I am very familiar with how to set it up and what I know from experience that it should do.) One setup is the preamp in its 'bypassing' mode with a high-Z cable, so it plugs into the 1/4" 1920s phone patch jack and an inexpensive cardioid mic, also from the 1970s. The rear end of the preamp is still in line, so I have use of the GAIN and OUTPUT controls, filters, etc. that the little preamp affords. This works fine, highly sensitive, lots of signal, etc. The problem with it is that word cardioid - it is hopeless in a non-lab situation where you have room noise, etc. - so, that's not the solution I want.

The second mode is a low-Z setup using the fabulous DL-42 and the standard XLR cable (which is 50 years old, just like everything but the ultra-modern ART preamp from the early 2000s). It is conventionally set up, plugged into the XLR Input jack of the preamp. All this does is route the signal through the 12AX7 preamp circuit first. I hope this clarifies what's going on here.

They are.

Dan - That's right; even later-than-late, you got it.

Larry

[LarryCottrill]

Nope. He says in the first post that a hiZ mic works. He's clarifying here that he thinks that's because it bypasses the preamp, indicating that the preamp is busted.

Right, Dan - I missed your post, so went back into pontificating. I am now 76 years old, and have spent a lifetime trying to explain myself. Apologies to all.

I can now add a couple of points: First, I decided to check the 9VAC power supply - showed better that 10VAC, unloaded. Just something I thought should be done, and trivially easy.

Second, I have a 12AX7 (might even have an -A suffix, if I'm lucky) ensconced in an old 'scope I tore up for experimentation. This was the horizontal amplifier, and the last time I saw the thing running, it was scanning at any rate chosen, so it must be good - ha.

Larry

[Craig Hauber]

Right, Dan - I missed your post, so went back into pontificating. I am now 76 years old, and have spent a lifetime trying to explain myself. Apologies to all.

I can now add a couple of points: First, I decided to check the 9VAC power supply - showed better that 10VAC, unloaded. Just something I thought should be done, and trivially easy.

Second, I have a 12AX7 (might even have an -A suffix, if I'm lucky) ensconced in an old 'scope I tore up for experimentation. This was the horizontal amplifier, and the last time I saw the thing running, it was scanning at any rate chosen, so it must be good - ha.

Larry

Does the mic work good with any other preamp?  Like the one in any basic analog mixer, PA system, recorder etc...  Beg/borrow/steal temporarily if you don't have a proper balanced XLR mic input available.  You're not looking for "hand selected premium tube warmth" at this stage, just verification that the mic itself along with your cable isn't the problem first.
Also pull apart that XLR and check the connections inside.  I have a bunch of ancient 8412 belden cables that started acting weird due to the rubber insulation getting hard and crumbly inside.  Others are just as good as the day they were made so it depends on what the cable's been exposed to in that 50 years and how hard they were used. 
If the EV mic has that custom screw-on pin type connector it is easy enough to dismantle and put new cable onto it.  I've always made a short one that stays with the mic,  just long enough to get to the floor where you can add on a normal XLR mic cable to get across the stage or studio -and one that can handle the abuse better.

[Mike Caldwell]

IF you really need to use the XLR to 1/4 inch cable the plug should be a mono TS and at the XLR pins 1 and 3 need to be tied together.

[LarryCottrill]

Does the mic work good with any other preamp?  Like the one in any basic analog mixer, PA system, recorder etc...  Beg/borrow/steal temporarily if you don't have a proper balanced XLR mic input available.  You're not looking for "hand selected premium tube warmth" at this stage, just verification that the mic itself along with your cable isn't the problem first.

Of course, that's an excellent tip. My little workshop audio amp is equipped with a low-Z magnetic input (RCA jack like for a phono cartridge) - I can rig an XLR jack onto it and see what I get.

Also pull apart that XLR and check the connections inside.  I have a bunch of ancient 8412 belden cables that started acting weird due to the rubber insulation getting hard and crumbly inside.  Others are just as good as the day they were made so it depends on what the cable's been exposed to in that 50 years and how hard they were used.

I have done that to get a good look at both ends. I was looking at the solder points, of course, but in wiggling the wires about, I'd have noticed if the wire covering was flaky. My unused cables were never in a garage or attic - always buried in my lifetime of artifacts I have to navigate through to get anything done. Never subjected to 'extremes' at all. I could do end-to-end continuity checks while thrashing and bending the cables, even cross-talk checks the same way. But basically, the cable is fully flexible, clean and looks almost brand new. Also, my cables haven't had hard use in the field. Keep in mind that what I'm actually hearing is (as far as I can tell) full fidelity sound, not distorted, not crackly, etc. It's just a totally inadequate signal level - just as if it's coming through a high resistance.

If the EV mic has that custom screw-on pin type connector it is easy enough to dismantle and put new cable onto it.  I've always made a short one that stays with the mic,  just long enough to get to the floor where you can add on a normal XLR mic cable to get across the stage or studio -and one that can handle the abuse better.

No, the male connector is held into the rear die-cast housing by a single little screw, just as it would be held in a cable shell. So, it was easy to pull it out and inspect with a magnifier, and again, looks just like the day it was put together. This mike is mounted in the middle of a soft rubber cushion (sort of a 'diaphragm') within a metal ring that is cradled inside a springy wire cage via two tightening knobs - this lets you adjust its angle of elevation. The mic stand fitting is at the bottom of this cage (or the top, as it was used with an overhead boom on Hollywood sound stages).

You'd be surprised how many scenes in high-quality TV productions give you a little 'peek' at the tip of the black nose of a shotgun mic somewhere at the top edge of the frame. It's one of the most common flaws in setting up a shot, very easily missed until it's too late. When as kids we would try Super8 sound, we just set up the mic on an ordinary stand a few feet off to the side. This mic would never pick up a thing from the cameras (which ran pretty quiet, anyway, really).

Larry

[Mike Caldwell]

Of course, that's an excellent tip. My little workshop audio amp is equipped with a low-Z magnetic input (RCA jack like for a phono cartridge) - I can rig an XLR jack onto it and see what I get.

Probably not the best way to test!

In all you cables you don't have an XLR to XLR cable.
Do you have any other dynamic mics with an XLR output?

[LarryCottrill]

Probably not the best way to test!

In all you cables you don't have an XLR to XLR cable.
Do you have any other dynamic mics with an XLR output?

Actually, Mike, there IS another XLR cable - it came with the mic. It is a little 'coil cord' that will comfortably stretch to about 12 inches or so. It is less than 1/8-inch in diameter. Here's why they supply it:

The wire cage with a soft rubber ring I talked about is to isolate the mic from vibrations that happen to the stand, boom or whatever is being used. BUT - there's still the chance that a bump to the cable will send vibrations up. So, what they do is provide a stout clip fastened to the wire cage to hold the male end of this little coil cord pigtail, while the female end of it is plugged into the rear of the mic. The little coil cord just hangs loose between its two ends, making any vibration or movement in the full-size mic cord utterly inaudible at the mic. Cool, huh?

Now then, this little curly pigtail is just a miniaturized version of my mic cable, with the same standard male and female XLR ends. So, I tried plugging that between the mic (sitting right alongside the preamp) and the XLR input. The result was EXACTLY the same as when I had the full-size cable plugged in. (I had done end-to-end continuity checks on the pigtail beforehand.)

Larry

[Mike Caldwell]

I would say your at the point of needing a known good mic, cable and pre amp to do some process of elimination testing.

[Kevin Maxwell]

You'd be surprised how many scenes in high-quality TV productions give you a little 'peek' at the tip of the black nose of a shotgun mic somewhere at the top edge of the frame. It's one of the most common flaws in setting up a shot, very easily missed until it's too late. When as kids we would try Super8 sound, we just set up the mic on an ordinary stand a few feet off to the side. This mic would never pick up a thing from the cameras (which ran pretty quiet, anyway, really).

Larry

Most directors that I have worked with prefer seeing a tiny bit of the mic occasionally then having the mic too far away. On video (or on film with video assist) it is handy to see when the monitor is set so that you see beyond the normally used frame. I always get over scan and under scan mixed up as to which mode give me that image. This used to enable you to see that you are as close as you can get without being in the usable video being shot. I would really have liked to have a tiny monitor that I could hang from my boom pole so I can see how wide or tight the shot is at any given time. That is usually where the problem is, unless you know how wide the shot is you don’t know how close you can get and still stay out of the shot. 

I don’t know what situations you have used this EV DL-42 in, but a long shotgun mic like this is not the best mic to use in a small or medium size room with hard walls. A short shotgun mic is much better in that situation. Even a decent cardioid condenser mic, for close up shots with the mic just out of frame, will probably sound better than the DL-42.

But as others have said just test the mic into a mixer that has XLR inputs and test it against a regular hand held dynamic mic. Then you know if the mic has gone bad in some way.

[ProSoundWeb Community]