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Author Topic: Good but inexpensive front wash  (Read 4295 times)

Steve Ferreira

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #20 on: January 04, 2023, 01:48:46 PM »

That’s one I was looking at too. Let me know how it is when it arrives. If it checks out I may grab a dozen.
I picked up 6 cheap chinese mini movers this year based on a post here. I’ve been happy with them for the type of gigs they’re used on.
Cheers.

The light came in. Since I live in Canada I also got dinged by DHL for customs, wish all the pricing was up front. The light arrived faster than what I expected.

Pros:
Arrived in a good package to protect during shipping.
Solid weight to the light. Feels like a top tier company built fixture.
Manual is easy to read and the light does exactly what the manual says.
Much brighter than my current lights and has a wider beam angle.
Fixture is RGBA+UV
Has 2 DMX channel modes 6 & 10 channel modes.
Powercon & 3 pin XLR in/outs. Also comes with 1 cable of each.

Cons:
As I pressed the "menu" button for the first time the back display screen got tilted and the buttons kinda got jammed into the metal housing. I lined everything up and noticed that the 2 screws next to the display screen where loose. I tightened those up and everything is great now.

I liked the fixture enough to purchase another 9 fixtures that same week bringing my total to 10 fixtures. I only need 8 fixtures, 2 will be back ups incase anything happens to the others.

FYI..... Chamsys carries Shehds lighting in their fixture library for a bunch of this manufacturers lights.
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Bradford "BJ" James

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2023, 09:54:29 AM »

Thanks for the update Steve. Think I may grab a few to try too. I’m close enough to the border that I can have them delivered there, and pick them up.
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Steve Ferreira

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2023, 01:46:11 PM »

I should have sent them to a PO Box in Buffalo..... oh well. Waiting on the other 9 fixtures now.
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Tracy Garner

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #23 on: January 06, 2023, 11:27:08 AM »

18 x 18-watt LEDs, Powercon and DMX through for $77.44? How do they do it so cheap? Do they charge you 200 bucks for shipping?

I bought some similar  18x18 powercon in/through dmx in/through included the powercon to edison and short DMX cables. I ran a couple of them on the covered deck three weeks straight 24/7 for the holidays.
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Mike Monte

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #24 on: January 09, 2023, 06:59:30 AM »

My 2022 goal was to upgrade my spartan/totally-lame/basic lighting rig to accompany my PA.

After much research/suggestions (both online and talking to gigging bands) I settled on Rockville battery-par-61 lights.
I ordered 8 fixtures for a two tree wash.
I was looking for lights that included amber, a hard-wire or battery option, wireless remote, low volume fan, guarantee, etc.
My selling point: I spoke to a muso buddy of mine that leads a wedding/corp band that gigs the Boston circuit 50+ times a year and he suggested I look at them as they "look good and hold up well".
I used them once on a gig a couple of weeks ago and was satisfied.
After January 1st I plan to order 10 more of the same (to be used as two 4-fixture up-washes plus two spare units).
Followup to my OP:
I gigged the lights again on NYE and was satisfied with the results. 
I will order the additional 10 this week (now that I'm in my FY 2023 budget).
Review:
The lights are battery powered and stayed on from 6:30pm-12:30am (I used solid-color amber) although I had them wired & ready to plug in...just in case....  At the end of the night the power indicators show approximately 40% left.
Each light came with its own wireless remote.  I set up each tree with one master & 3 slaves...worked like a charm.
I am now searching (Marketplace, etc.) for a used plastic (SKB, etc.) keyboard case to transport the two trees.  Something will turn up - I'm patient.

A few days ago I "dug out" the 8 cheap-chinese-ebay-purchased par 60's that I bought 4 or so years ago to compare.  These "things" were $199(?) for all 8 - what a DEAL!
I didn't get too far into the comparison because when I turned-on the chino-junks the fan noise they generated was extremely loud - so much so that I could never use them for an indoor wedding/party.
(I picked one up and held it at different angles to see if the fan-exhaust could be of some use to circulate air for a band on stage - no dice.)
I will use them as "sacrificial-pars" for applications deserving of such.

     
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Lee Douglas

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #25 on: January 17, 2023, 05:54:03 PM »

Followup to my OP:
I gigged the lights again on NYE and was satisfied with the results. 
I will order the additional 10 this week (now that I'm in my FY 2023 budget).

Well, my interest is piqued.  The convenience!  How do they do with video?  Any flickering?
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Steve Ferreira

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #26 on: January 18, 2023, 10:12:42 AM »

The light came in. Since I live in Canada I also got dinged by DHL for customs, wish all the pricing was up front. The light arrived faster than what I expected.

Pros:
Arrived in a good package to protect during shipping.
Solid weight to the light. Feels like a top tier company built fixture.
Manual is easy to read and the light does exactly what the manual says.
Much brighter than my current lights and has a wider beam angle.
Fixture is RGBA+UV
Has 2 DMX channel modes 6 & 10 channel modes.
Powercon & 3 pin XLR in/outs. Also comes with 1 cable of each.

Cons:
As I pressed the "menu" button for the first time the back display screen got tilted and the buttons kinda got jammed into the metal housing. I lined everything up and noticed that the 2 screws next to the display screen where loose. I tightened those up and everything is great now.

I liked the fixture enough to purchase another 9 fixtures that same week bringing my total to 10 fixtures. I only need 8 fixtures, 2 will be back ups incase anything happens to the others.

FYI..... Chamsys carries Shehds lighting in their fixture library for a bunch of this manufacturers lights.

Update:
I ordered the lights and after 1 week I still hadn't received any notification if the lights had been shipped/backordered etc... I sent the company an email stating my concern and received an email with a tracking number. There was some confusion as to where the lights where coming from. First I was told China, then from the US warehouse. Once I started tracking the package it was indeed coming from China.
The lights arrived safe and once again in good packaging. Unpack all the lights for inspection and all is good, no dings, no loose screws. Power everything up and all works. The following weekend I set everything up on the T-bars and start to program and here is where I start to look for colour discrepancies as we all hear "The colours won't match on knockoffs, they don't dim properly, they flicker". I can 100% confirm that all lights have the same brightness, colour and all work as they should.

Very happy with my purchase and would buy from them again.
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Jeff Lelko

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #27 on: January 18, 2023, 10:33:57 PM »

...as we all hear "The colours won't match on knockoffs, they don't dim properly, they flicker". I can 100% confirm that all lights have the same brightness, colour and all work as they should.

As someone who's always on this soap box I'll be happy to elaborate a bit on my claims, but let me first say that I'm happy you found something that works for you.

So out of the box I'd really hope everything works properly and that the fixtures all perform in-family with one another.  Failing on such a basic level would be very disappointing - even for Direct From China (DFC) imports.

The issues with color matching generally manifest in one of two ways: either the color of the fixtures shift inconsistently over time, or buying one batch of lights now and another a year from now results in two distinct fixture lots with no ability to mix and match from the two.  The latter issue is far more common as most DFC fixtures are made to very low quality tolerances - part of why they can be had so cheaply.  As mentioned further up many name brand makers such as ETC calibrate every single fixture they make to account for both issues mentioned here which ensures the ability to buy or rent additional fixtures down the road with no concern about consistent matching.  This costs money - both in the cost of higher quality (tighter tolerance) components and the production time added for individual unit calibration.  Some units allow for field-adjusting of color calibrations ... some don't.

Touching a bit more on color shift, it can be common for LED fixtures with high hours to start varying in color reproduction as the various emitters begin to age.  This isn't exclusive to just DFC fixtures and has actually shown to be an issue in some of the earlier Mac Auras for example.  The nice part with the Mac Aura situation is that I can just buy a new emitter board for a couple hundred dollars and I'll be back to 100% of the fixture's original output.  With nearly all DFC imports there's no chance in getting replacement parts, so the fixtures are as good as toast if this problem begins to manifest.

The "dimming properly" concern has to do with how the fixture behaves when operating at less than 10 or 15% of its full potential output.  For rock and roll material this likely won't even matter, but for stage and studio work where a fixture might be projecting a very subtle fill in negative space with a deep color the performance at this level is worth big money.  This is especially apparent in the threshold of if/when the LED emitters "pop" on or off.  Good Broadway-quality fixtures can fully emulate the tungsten decay when fading out ... nearly all lower-dollar lights reach a point and then just "pop" off.  You'd need to put a DFC light next to something like an ETC Lustr fixture to truly appreciate the difference.

Flickering is generally a problem seen on camera and not with the naked eye.  For what it's worth even my ADJ Mega Par Hex lights - the cheapest in my inventory - do fine with this (though their low-level dimming is as to be expected).  It just depends on the fixture and what the PWM frequency of the dimming circuit is regarding whether or not this will be a problem.

...

Probably the most important thing to be asking though is - does it look any good?  All these LED fixtures will make light, just like any given loudspeaker will make sound.  Behringer sells plenty of Eurolive speakers at a tenth the cost of a Danley SM80, but a quick look at online reviews would say that there's no shortage of happy Eurolive speakers despite the fact we know these speakers won't hold a candle to the SM80.  Ignorance is bliss sometimes!  The fact of the matter though is that for many casual users a Eurolive speaker is enough to make music just like a DFC fixture is enough to make light.  There are plenty of photometrics on lighting equipment to help gauge if a fixture should look good just like if a speaker should sound good, but as we all know the metrics don't always tell the full story. 

Once the causal user or weekend warrior graduates to "events that matter" the Behringer Eurolives and DFC lights need to also graduate to pro-grade equipment for a number of reasons (rentability, reliability, maintainability, etc.), which is why I still refuse to hang my professional reputation on equipment that neither I nor the manufacturer can stand behind.

...off the soap box now...  ;D
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Dave Garoutte

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #28 on: January 19, 2023, 02:19:53 AM »


The "dimming properly" concern has to do with how the fixture behaves when operating at less than 10 or 15% of its full potential output.  For rock and roll material this likely won't even matter, but for stage and studio work where a fixture might be projecting a very subtle fill in negative space with a deep color the performance at this level is worth big money.  This is especially apparent in the threshold of if/when the LED emitters "pop" on or off.  Good Broadway-quality fixtures can fully emulate the tungsten decay when fading out ... nearly all lower-dollar lights reach a point and then just "pop" off.  You'd need to put a DFC light next to something like an ETC Lustr fixture to truly appreciate the difference.

If the dimming curve is linear, you won't notice a big change from 99% to 100% change, but from between 3% to 4% it's a 33% increase!  This is the major reason the higher end lights have selectable dimming curves, and/or 16 bit dimming.
LEDs don't actually dim, they just turn on and off really quickly.  At 100% it is always on, at 50% it's off as long as it's on, etc.  At lower PWM frequencies you start to get flicker at lower levels because the camera also is on and off.  If the off of the LED coincides with the on of the camera's CCD, you get flicker.
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Bradford "BJ" James

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Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2023, 09:53:02 AM »

We’re talking about a $100 light here guys. I would hope the $1000+ light is better.
The subject was “Decent but Inexpensive”. Is your idea of that a professional fixture?
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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Good but inexpensive front wash
« Reply #29 on: January 19, 2023, 09:53:02 AM »


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