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Author Topic: RCF HDL6A and KS118  (Read 1135 times)

Jonathan Talassazan

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RCF HDL6A and KS118
« on: August 30, 2022, 01:49:27 AM »

Hi All!

Iím looking to expand my setup. A bit of an overview about what I do. Mainly larger size weddings 300-800 people with live musicians performing along side of me DJing. Currently my setup is 2 KW152s and 2 KS118 subs. For events larger than 400 people the rental company I go with provides 2 KLA 12s and 2 KW181s.

Iím looking to expand my setup so I can cut the rental cost and Iím not really a fan of the KLAs. VRXs sound pretty nice but I want to expand to RCF as Iíve heard their column line Arrays and I fell in love with the sound.

My question is. Would 4 HDL6s and 2 KS118s be able to handle events of up to 800 people? If not, what can it handle? 600? Would I need another sub for 800 people?

All feedback is appreciated
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Chris Grimshaw

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Re: RCF HDL6A and KS118
« Reply #1 on: August 30, 2022, 01:15:31 PM »

I think the big question is this: define "handle".

To give two examples that would illustrate my point:

Here's an old video of my PA system (as it was then) in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXuV-Cl0hmI
That was producing 85dBC-slow at about 280' from the stacks. 2x 15" subs and 1x (2x10"+HF) per side, and running on a single 13A supply.
With approx 10,000m^2 available in that stadium and 2(m^2)/person, you might estimate that PA system could "handle" 5000 people.

It can't, unless they are all:
- Quiet
- Willing to put up with low SPLs (relative to a typical concert) at the back


An opposite example:

A venue I used to work at regularly (a few times a week for a couple of years) has 4x stacks of Nexo Alpha per side. Something like 3x 2x18" subs, 6x 15" low-mid, and 6x (2x10"+HF) mid/high boxes. Per side. Big pile of Camco Vortex driving the stacks, and a couple of 32A 240V mains supplies keeping things going.

Venue capacity: 1200.

For loud and/or bass-heavy events, there was another 4x 2x18" subs and 6x 15" low-mid boxes that could be brought out.

Brought to full power, that system could be brutally loud.


So, how would you define "handle"?
More specifically, how many decibels at what distance?


Chris

PS - Whatever you do, 2x HDL6/side will likely have less grunt than what you have now.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2022, 01:27:20 PM by Chris Grimshaw »
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Jonathan Talassazan

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Re: RCF HDL6A and KS118
« Reply #2 on: August 30, 2022, 01:45:10 PM »

Thank you for the response!

By handle, I guess I mean would it be enough? The weddings are, well, weddings. A sea of people on the dancefloor, and other guests around the room socializing. We play a lot of international music, mixed with house, and EDM. As well as having live musicians mixed in with the DJ.

You mentioned I would have less grunt than I do now, But I'm not sure what that means. I want to get something that really sounds good and delivers, but I dont want to go the KLA route like my friends and the rental company I use.

I guess I can ask the question: How would 4 HDL6a (2 Per side) paired with 2 KS118 subs compare against 4 KLA12 (Again 2 per side) paired with 4 KW181 subs?

I think the big question is this: define "handle".

To give two examples that would illustrate my point:

Here's an old video of my PA system (as it was then) in action: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZXuV-Cl0hmI
That was producing 85dBC-slow at about 280' from the stacks. 2x 15" subs and 1x (2x10"+HF) per side, and running on a single 13A supply.
With approx 10,000m^2 available in that stadium and 2(m^2)/person, you might estimate that PA system could "handle" 5000 people.

It can't, unless they are all:
- Quiet
- Willing to put up with low SPLs (relative to a typical concert) at the back


An opposite example:

A venue I used to work at regularly (a few times a week for a couple of years) has 4x stacks of Nexo Alpha per side. Something like 3x 2x18" subs, 6x 15" low-mid, and 6x (2x10"+HF) mid/high boxes. Per side. Big pile of Camco Vortex driving the stacks, and a couple of 32A 240V mains supplies keeping things going.

Venue capacity: 1200.

For loud and/or bass-heavy events, there was another 4x 2x18" subs and 6x 15" low-mid boxes that could be brought out.

Brought to full power, that system could be brutally loud.


So, how would you define "handle"?
More specifically, how many decibels at what distance?


Chris

PS - Whatever you do, 2x HDL6/side will likely have less grunt than what you have now.
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Paul G. OBrien

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Re: RCF HDL6A and KS118
« Reply #3 on: August 30, 2022, 06:37:15 PM »

Currently my setup is 2 KW152s and 2 KS118 subs. For events larger than 400 people the rental company I go with provides 2 KLA 12s and 2 KW181s.
Per side? If it's not then I don't see how that is anything but a sideways step at best, the KS118 may be a little better sub than the KW181 but the KLA12 isn't much more than K12 turned sideways.. which is a downgrade from a KW152.

Wedding are weddings which is to say your primary focus is good sound on the dancefloor, but in any room that can hold 800ppl I'd want at least four good 18" subs.. and then tops to match.  I guess that is the question... is 4 hdl6a enough? I have no direct experience but I suspect it may be a bit light and 6-8 boxes with lifts would be a better target. The closest I have been to that is an event where I used the Yorkville PSa1 tops with the PSa2S subs, that was 2 tops(4x6" + 2x1"/box) over a single double 15 sub per side, that was for about 300ppl in an appropriately sized room and I wouldn't call it overkill.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2022, 06:49:31 PM by Paul G. OBrien »
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Mike Caldwell

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Re: RCF HDL6A and KS118
« Reply #4 on: August 30, 2022, 08:08:40 PM »

Keep in mind at your larger 800 plus weddings not all 800 people will want to be listening to full on dance party volume levels in the entire room.....but when it comes time for the wedding party to speak they will all want to hear that clearly, so maybe think about some delay fills
that only have the spoken word parts of the reception in them so people in the back can clearly hear that. The people that want to party on the dance floor will make their way to the front.

Actually that all applies to any size wedding reception.

Tim McCulloch

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Re: RCF HDL6A and KS118
« Reply #5 on: August 30, 2022, 11:35:41 PM »

That's quite a variety for a wedding - traditional live wedding music, EDM, bands.  That means everything is a compromise of some kind.

I'd start by reviewing the amount of area - width and depth - you need to cover and list all loudspeakers that provide the nominal coverage needed, and what mounting or suspension options exist to put them up where they need to go.  Then edit out those not capable of supplying the SPL or needed bandwidth for the program material.  THOSE are your choices.

Also consider transportation, handling and storage, as well as how you can dress up the rig for more formal affairs.  Side consideration:  can you rent more gear, locally, if you have to add on to your rig for an event?

Edit ps:  What you like about the KW152 will largely not exist in the HDL6.  I generally like RCF products and have used their HF transducers in a proprietary design... but the HDL series (up to the 20a, at least) just doesn't sound 'right' to me.  I'm also not a fan of using small numbers of compact line array elements and calling it a speaker system, but that's for another time.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2022, 11:38:48 PM by Tim McCulloch »
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Re: RCF HDL6A and KS118
¬ę Reply #5 on: August 30, 2022, 11:35:41 PM ¬Ľ


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