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I just can't find a suitable amplifier (for serial connection) for MARTIN AUDIO

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Tim Verhoeven:

--- Quote from: Leo Neri on June 15, 2022, 06:56:17 AM ---I donít know for sure if there is a built-in crossover, if not, then there are amplifiers with a crossover. I was interested not in the general opinion, but in the recommendation of which amplifier is suitable in this case (all mods are named) - 1 MARTIN AUDIO BLACKLINE X118SUB and 1 MARTIN AUDIO Blackline X15

--- End quote ---

If you only have one of each then this is a good amp: https://www.thomann.de/be/crown_xti_6002.htm
If you have a stereo setup then 2 of the Crowns is an option or just one of this : https://www.thomann.de/be/lab_gruppen_plm_12k44_sp.htm

Matthias McCready:

--- Quote from: Leo Neri on June 15, 2022, 07:04:41 AM ---You are right, but MARTIN AUDIO will offer me their solution and it is too expensive for me, and other MARTIN AUDIO brands will not offer (it is not profitable for them). I hope that someone else's experience with this equipment will help me. After all, we are not all rich

--- End quote ---

Well if saving money is the name of the game here are few ideas:

1. Have you thought about getting an x12 instead the x15?

Since you are purchasing a sub, that sub will go lower and louder than the x15's do. Typically 15" isn't adding any real low-end, and on 2-way boxes it often means a weird crossover, and a box that doesn't mate as well with the subs.

You can save some money by getting the 12" and it would be a better sounding system.  :)

2. Have you considered just getting 1 top?

Having a 2nd top provides more coverage, and stereo imaging, but it does not provide much of an increase in volume.

Overall, due to the physics of frequency, additional tops can cause comb filtering without additional gain; while adding subs, placed closely together, can cause summation (increased volume).

Depending on the music genre (getting into the bass heavy genres such as EDM, Hip Hop etc) the sub to top ratio increases. Like having 4 subs to  1 top.

So if you got an x12 over an x118 that could be cheaper (that might me some amp money).

3. Are you charging enough for services?

To the point, hopefully if you own a system, you are getting paid for it. A good rule of thumb is that you should charge your client enough for your equipment that could rent equivalent equipment if yours was broken or unavailable.

When I was younger I bought a system without thinking about ROI, that was a mistake, and I didn't make my money back on it. These days when I want a system I rent one, I rent systems much nicer than I could afford to own, and I pass my cost of rental onto the client.

This is advantageous for me as:

A) I don't have money tied up in equipment.
B) I don't have to store the equipment.
C) I don't have to repair the equipment.
D) I don't have to transport the equipment (if it is a large setup).

^ All of the above elements will cost you money.

4. If you grow, is this the system you want?

As systems grow you may want more subs or larger tops. In that vein sometimes spending a little more for a nicer model on the front end gets you in a box that you can grow with. IE when you want to add a sub, you don't need to start the whole system from scratch again. Sometimes spending more upfront can save you money in the long run.

----

As far as amplification goes, get the proper amplification recommended by the manufacturer (the manual does recommend their own amp yes, but it also recommends how much power you should have).

Probably a better question(s) for you to ask though, rather than what amp for what speaker is:

1) What is the size of area you are trying to cover (feet, meters)
2) What SPL are you trying to achieve for this area?
3) What is your genre/application (ie how bass heavy are we?).
---
4) What is your budget?

These 3 questions (and yes the 4th, although that should really come last), if followed will guide you to the correct speaker for your purposes.

Respectively these questions answer:
1) What coverage pattern(s) are needed? How large of a system(s) are need?
2) How loud does it need to go? Miss this one and you will not enough "rig for the gig." Speakers or amps going up in blue smoke is expensive!!!
3) This helps define the sub to top ratio.
4) This helps define the manufacturer/model that are viable options, which can achieve the desired SPL/Coverage.

Leo Neri:

--- Quote from: Tim Verhoeven on June 15, 2022, 07:27:36 AM ---If you only have one of each then this is a good amp: https://www.thomann.de/be/crown_xti_6002.htm
If you have a stereo setup then 2 of the Crowns is an option or just one of this : https://www.thomann.de/be/lab_gruppen_plm_12k44_sp.htm

--- End quote ---

Thanks, I'll take a look and compare with the solution from MARTIN AUDIO

Leo Neri:

--- Quote from: Matthias McCready on June 15, 2022, 10:33:06 AM ---Well if saving money is the name of the game here are few ideas:

1. Have you thought about getting an x12 instead the x15?

Since you are purchasing a sub, that sub will go lower and louder than the x15's do. Typically 15" isn't adding any real low-end, and on 2-way boxes it often means a weird crossover, and a box that doesn't mate as well with the subs.

You can save some money by getting the 12" and it would be a better sounding system.  :)

2. Have you considered just getting 1 top?

Having a 2nd top provides more coverage, and stereo imaging, but it does not provide much of an increase in volume.

Overall, due to the physics of frequency, additional tops can cause comb filtering without additional gain; while adding subs, placed closely together, can cause summation (increased volume).

Depending on the music genre (getting into the bass heavy genres such as EDM, Hip Hop etc) the sub to top ratio increases. Like having 4 subs to  1 top.

So if you got an x12 over an x118 that could be cheaper (that might me some amp money).

3. Are you charging enough for services?

To the point, hopefully if you own a system, you are getting paid for it. A good rule of thumb is that you should charge your client enough for your equipment that could rent equivalent equipment if yours was broken or unavailable.

When I was younger I bought a system without thinking about ROI, that was a mistake, and I didn't make my money back on it. These days when I want a system I rent one, I rent systems much nicer than I could afford to own, and I pass my cost of rental onto the client.

This is advantageous for me as:

A) I don't have money tied up in equipment.
B) I don't have to store the equipment.
C) I don't have to repair the equipment.
D) I don't have to transport the equipment (if it is a large setup).

^ All of the above elements will cost you money.

4. If you grow, is this the system you want?

As systems grow you may want more subs or larger tops. In that vein sometimes spending a little more for a nicer model on the front end gets you in a box that you can grow with. IE when you want to add a sub, you don't need to start the whole system from scratch again. Sometimes spending more upfront can save you money in the long run.

----

As far as amplification goes, get the proper amplification recommended by the manufacturer (the manual does recommend their own amp yes, but it also recommends how much power you should have).

Probably a better question(s) for you to ask though, rather than what amp for what speaker is:

1) What is the size of area you are trying to cover (feet, meters)
2) What SPL are you trying to achieve for this area?
3) What is your genre/application (ie how bass heavy are we?).
---
4) What is your budget?

These 3 questions (and yes the 4th, although that should really come last), if followed will guide you to the correct speaker for your purposes.

Respectively these questions answer:
1) What coverage pattern(s) are needed? How large of a system(s) are need?
2) How loud does it need to go? Miss this one and you will not enough "rig for the gig." Speakers or amps going up in blue smoke is expensive!!!
3) This helps define the sub to top ratio.
4) This helps define the manufacturer/model that are viable options, which can achieve the desired SPL/Coverage.

--- End quote ---

Thank you for writing so much and spending your time on this! Let me clarify:
If I work with the EDM genre, then you recommend 12" tops and 18" subs, am I right? And also you suggest considering the option of 15 inch tops without subs, like the EAW RSX126 with a frequency range of 48 Hz to 20 kHz (although this is an active acoustic), but I heard a lot of good things about it..

Matthias McCready:

--- Quote from: Leo Neri on June 18, 2022, 06:19:27 AM ---Thank you for writing so much and spending your time on this! Let me clarify:
If I work with the EDM genre, then you recommend 12" tops and 18" subs, am I right? And also you suggest considering the option of 15 inch tops without subs, like the EAW RSX126 with a frequency range of 48 Hz to 20 kHz (although this is an active acoustic), but I heard a lot of good things about it..

--- End quote ---


For EDM you will want lots of subbage, and then some! In general most 18" subwoofers will go lower and louder than most 15" subs.

I would recommend 12" tops with as many subs as you can afford.

The reason I am recommending 12" over 15" for your application is because:

1) If you have a sub(s) taking care of your low end, you don't need a small speaker trying really hard to do the same thing. For example most powered speakers have an internal DSP option for "with sub." When this is engaged the top speaker doesn't focus on attempting to reproduce those freqencies, which gives it significantly more volume/power to focus on the stuff it is good at reproducing (say 100hz on up).

2) Anytime a speaker has more than two sizes of drivers (which is most speakers in existence ;-) ) there is a crossover going on. Roughly, a crossover decides that the high-frequency information goes to the tweeter/horn and that the lower frequency information goes to the woofer; this helps the speaker sound better, bu putting the driver in phase, and often keeps the drivers from going up in blue smoke.  ;) Most two-way boxes (woofer/horn), especially on the budget end of the speaker spectrum, can have kind of a weird crossover frequency that doesn't sound the most ideal. Thereby most budget friendly 12" boxes have a more reasonable crossover frequency.

---

As far as the EAW speaker you listed, I haven't heard it but....

the frequency spec is not a usable number for you.

It does produce 48hz, but at what volume compared to the rest of the speaker?

Almost any size speaker can technically produce 48hz (think of headphones or In-Ear-Monitors), but at what volume? If it produces 48hz at -40dB to the rest of the signal that is not very useful for you.

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