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Author Topic: Punch-down tool for stranded wire  (Read 1696 times)

John Lackner

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Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« on: January 26, 2022, 12:07:44 PM »

i am looking for a punch-down tool for punch-down tool that works with stranded wire. Whirlwind had one but it's no longer available. Is there any other manufacturer that is making one?
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Steve-White

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #1 on: January 26, 2022, 01:38:48 PM »

What is a punch-down tool?  Can you point me to an example please?  Link, picture or make/model.
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Brian Jojade

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2022, 02:40:58 PM »

It's the punch down block that needs to be able to accept stranded wire. I don't know that using a different tool would make stranded wire work properly, as every cat5/6 punch down connection I've seen is for solid wire. (M66 and 110 are the 2 common styles, with 110 being the more current)

 There may be other types of punch downs that can work with stranded wire of different types, each of course then requiring the specific tool for that connection.
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Brian Jojade

Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #3 on: January 26, 2022, 06:25:20 PM »

It's the punch down block that needs to be able to accept stranded wire. I don't know that using a different tool would make stranded wire work properly, as every cat5/6 punch down connection I've seen is for solid wire. (M66 and 110 are the 2 common styles, with 110 being the more current)


Correct, it's not a matter of the tool but the block that takes stranded and the tool designed for it. If you look at how the "pins" on an M66 and 110 block work, they squeeze the wire crushing the insulation. The wire has to be solid for that to work. Stranded, being soft would just mush- insulation and all- and not allowing the insulation to break or crush so the clip would contact the wire.


I do remember the Whirlwind blocks as interesting but never had any experience with them.

-Hal
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Bill Meeks

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2022, 03:11:22 PM »

What is a punch-down tool?  Can you point me to an example please?  Link, picture or make/model.


Cable Matters 110 Punch Down Tool with 110 Blade --

https://www.amazon.com/Cable-Matters-Punch-Down-Blade/dp/B0072K1QHM
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Mac Kerr

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2022, 03:52:05 PM »


Cable Matters 110 Punch Down Tool with 110 Blade --

https://www.amazon.com/Cable-Matters-Punch-Down-Blade/dp/B0072K1QHM

That is a punchdown tool, but I don't see where it is labeled "suitable for stranded wire". 110 punchdown blocks  rely on solid wire to make a good connection.

Mac
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Craig Hauber

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #6 on: January 27, 2022, 07:07:58 PM »


Correct, it's not a matter of the tool but the block that takes stranded and the tool designed for it. If you look at how the "pins" on an M66 and 110 block work, they squeeze the wire crushing the insulation. The wire has to be solid for that to work. Stranded, being soft would just mush- insulation and all- and not allowing the insulation to break or crush so the clip would contact the wire.


I do remember the Whirlwind blocks as interesting but never had any experience with them.

-Hal

IIRC the Whirlwind punch-down products were by ADC

https://www.adckcl.com/in/en/solutions/broadcast/
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Craig Hauber
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Bill Meeks

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2022, 09:20:05 AM »

That is a punchdown tool, but I don't see where it is labeled "suitable for stranded wire". 110 punchdown blocks  rely on solid wire to make a good connection.

Mac

Agreed. I've never seen one for stranded wire either. Instead, I was simply posting a link to a typical punch down tool as Steve was asking what one was. I assume he was serious, but perhaps I missed his intent and he was being facetious.
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Steve-White

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2022, 09:25:30 AM »

Agreed. I've never seen one for stranded wire either. Instead, I was simply posting a link to a typical punch down tool as Steve was asking what one was. I assume he was serious, but perhaps I missed his intent and he was being facetious.

No, really wondering.  I thought I knew what he meant and wanted to be sure.  Telephone/network style terminal block wire punch-down tool.  Wasn't sure if it could have been some kind of crimping device - punch down onto a connector to lock the wire into it.  Because of the mention of stranded wire.

Thx for thinking about me!  :)
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Erik Jerde

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2022, 10:08:34 AM »

i am looking for a punch-down tool for punch-down tool that works with stranded wire. Whirlwind had one but it's no longer available. Is there any other manufacturer that is making one?

Thereís some confusion and assumptions going on here because you didnít specify what type of punch down terminals youíre trying to use.  The whirlwind tool was for ADC QPC punch down terminals.  They could take stranded wire as they were designed for use with mic cable.  Itís a completely different system from the telco oriented 66 and 110 block systems.  I havenít used QDC in years but a quick search shows that Clark Wire has the ADC tools listed on their website so theyíre probably still available.  Youíd need to contact them to find out for sure.
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John Lackner

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2022, 07:27:02 PM »

Thereís some confusion and assumptions going on here because you didnít specify what type of punch down terminals youíre trying to use.  The whirlwind tool was for ADC QPC punch down terminals.  They could take stranded wire as they were designed for use with mic cable.  Itís a completely different system from the telco oriented 66 and 110 block systems.  I havenít used QDC in years but a quick search shows that Clark Wire has the ADC tools listed on their website so theyíre probably still available.  Youíd need to contact them to find out for sure.

It's for stranded "install" mic cable, sometimes called control cable. Going from mic input wall plates to the terminal block. Thanks for the info.
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Mac Kerr

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #11 on: January 29, 2022, 09:26:49 PM »

It's for stranded "install" mic cable, sometimes called control cable. Going from mic input wall plates to the terminal block. Thanks for the info.

If by "install mic cable" you mean 8451 I don't think it will be reliable in a punch down.

Mac
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2022, 02:51:05 PM »

If by "install mic cable" you mean 8451 I don't think it will be reliable in a punch down.

Mac


I have used older 66 style blocks and punched 8451, I use the non cutting side of the tool making sure the wire is completely seated in the IDC then a pair of nippers to do my trim.  To finish a blast with some air to make sure no stray clippings and a clear cover.   The older, larger blocks have 5 or 6 rows so if you have a bridging application, like in a conference room it's a convenient and clean way to bridge.  You can also do fault isolation with the bridge clips and the whipped cream is you can use your butt set to troubleshoot. 
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Steve-White

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2022, 06:39:38 PM »

Maybe it would work if the wired were tinned first?
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Mac Kerr

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2022, 07:48:58 PM »


I have used older 66 style blocks and punched 8451, I use the non cutting side of the tool making sure the wire is completely seated in the IDC then a pair of nippers to do my trim.  To finish a blast with some air to make sure no stray clippings and a clear cover.   The older, larger blocks have 5 or 6 rows so if you have a bridging application, like in a conference room it's a convenient and clean way to bridge.  You can also do fault isolation with the bridge clips and the whipped cream is you can use your butt set to troubleshoot.

I admit I'm old, but 8451 connections I've done were on Christmas Trees.

Mac

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Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #15 on: February 03, 2022, 02:09:08 AM »


I have used older 66 style blocks and punched 8451, I use the non cutting side of the tool making sure the wire is completely seated in the IDC then a pair of nippers to do my trim.  To finish a blast with some air to make sure no stray clippings and a clear cover.   The older, larger blocks have 5 or 6 rows so if you have a bridging application, like in a conference room it's a convenient and clean way to bridge.  You can also do fault isolation with the bridge clips and the whipped cream is you can use your butt set to troubleshoot.


I've never done that, but I remember a post long ago from somebody who worked in broadcast. He said he had no problems with it but there were comments from people who reported intermittents.


As for tinning, that not only would make the stranded solid but of course eliminate the insulation. If you then do like Scott suggests (actually you could use the cutter blade) it should work. But that's a lot of work.


-Hal
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Brian Jojade

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #16 on: February 03, 2022, 02:36:37 AM »

Maybe it would work if the wired were tinned first?

You should never tin wire that will be used in a compressed setting.  The compression can cause fractures that end up corroding and result in a poor connection over time.
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Brian Jojade

Hal Bissinger/COMSYSTEC

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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2022, 03:49:28 AM »

You should never tin wire that will be used in a compressed setting.  The compression can cause fractures that end up corroding and result in a poor connection over time.


I defer to your judgement.  :)


-Hal
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Re: Punch-down tool for stranded wire
¬ę Reply #17 on: February 04, 2022, 03:49:28 AM ¬Ľ


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