Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Craig Hauber]

Not sure if this should be posted here or in installs, but the odds of knowledgeable electricians seeing it here seem better.

For an installation of self-powered speakers and TV sets around the upper perimeter of a large bar room, do the outlets have to be GFCI or served by a GFCI breaker?  They are dedicated circuits, 2 for speakers and 3 for TV's (11 receptacles total) all up high out of reach for any other use and hidden by the device.  All devices are commercial-grade and not consumer electronics (home stereo or video)
New ground-up build and commercial only, no dwelling units, offices or additional rentals attached.
-This is just a curiosity of mine as we plug into whatever is there but have been having issues with random tripping at one location but none of the others in the past have had GFCI -or any problems.

And by "GFCI" I have been going by assumption from pictures, but I now realize that it could be an AFCI?

[Stephen Swaffer]

Code generally does not require AFCI's in a commercial space unless there ae sleeping quarters-like dorms, etc.

In that described space, the only reason I can think of (other than local code "enhancements") would be if 2 prong receptacles were upgraded to 3 prong with the absence of a grounding conductor.

[Steve-White]

Typically "High up and out of reach" means no GFCI needed.

[Jonathan Johnson]

For GFCI, I believe they are only required in "wet locations" such as outdoors, garages, and basements, or if within 6 feet (horizontally) of a sink or bathtub.

But I'm not an electrician and I don't have a code book handy, so don't quote me on that. I'm only posting it because the fastest way to learn the truth is to tell a lie on the Internet.

[Craig Hauber]

Code generally does not require AFCI's in a commercial space unless there ae sleeping quarters-like dorms, etc.

In that described space, the only reason I can think of (other than local code "enhancements") would be if 2 prong receptacles were upgraded to 3 prong with the absence of a grounding conductor.

I think that's what it is.  "Local enhancements".
Two walls of the space contain a total of 5 glass "garage doors" that roll up and technically make the room a "patio bar". Even though it's contained within the structure under the same roof -and they just open up into enclosed patio spaces they are still classifying it as an "outdoor" area.

Some states don't think it's necessary while some do.

Either way the EC had the decency to put in breakers instead of GFCI receptacles, because it would be a real pain to get to them to reset. 

-Like the place I lived in once where somebody thought it was wise to bury a GFCI outlet behind the fridge!

[Stephen Swaffer]

If its considered an outdoor space then GFCI is required-that often where an inpsector's descretion comes into play-though the larger the AHJ the more likely they have defined these things to be consistent.

[Chris Hindle]

Either way the EC had the decency to put in breakers instead of GFCI receptacles, because it would be a real pain to get to them to reset. 

-Like the place I lived in once where somebody thought it was wise to bury a GFCI outlet behind the fridge!

Any chance the fridge had an ice-maker built in ?
But ya, behind an appliance is never any fun.
Chris. 

[ProSoundWeb Community]