Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Tim Weaver]

Why not a Behringer / Midas (x/m)R-18 or a Soundcraft Ui-24r.  IPad mini on a hard cable for the local monitor mix of the kbd player has control.  Otherwise hard wired touch screen of some type...

Yes, more capability than required but that is rarely a problem...

Because it's not needed.

I have 3 Yamaha CL5's in the main system and the band uses phones or whatever to control their own iem's.

This "extra" monitor rig is for the rare occasion (like a funeral) that a guest walks up and wants to play the piano. If I have a small standalone system that just works with no training involved, and no rebooting of stuff, or anything like that then anyone, whether I'm there or not, can use the rig.

I need a small mixer to submix 3 keys and one vocal for one powered monitor. And I need it to be the most idiot proof thing on the planet.


I'm with you guys in that I love digital mixers. I adopted digital in the late 90's and was one of the first people around my area to do any wireless control of a mixer using a laptop on my personal 03D. But this particular setup just doesn't need a digital mixer.


I am going to get the MultiMix 10. I will see if I can re-route the front input to the rear, but if not the front input isn't a deal killer.

[Brian Jojade]

Unlike the Music Group units, the UI24r can run standalone with no network, wifi or tablet required by using a local HDMI monitor and USB mouse. I've tested several small portable monitors and they work if they are native 720p or better
The whole package could be racked in 3 spaces with small monitor in front and mixer behind with connections facing the rear.

HDMI monitor and a mouse seems like way more of a cumbersome solution than a simple tablet with an ethernet jack on it.  But that's just me.

It's unfortunate that even though these little mixers can be easily remotely controlled, there isn't a big enough market for someone to build simple quality hardware interfaces for them, as that would be perfect in this scenario.  If someone could design a base of hardware controllers that could be easily programmed to control these complex little digital mixers, it would be nothing short of amazing.  There are so many cases similar to the OP where I need something simple like 5 channels of control and maybe an aux bus on the channel.  But, a touch screen interface isn't really practical, and the extra knobs on the mixer are just a source for inexperienced users to muck things up.

I love using the X-Touch with my X32 Rack when I need a small set of controls.  But even that gives WAY too much control to the inexperienced user. Being able to build off of something like that in an even simpler config would be a dream come true.

[Russell Ault]

{...} Yes, more capability than required but that is rarely a problem...

It is often a problem when designing a system that random strangers are expected to use with minimal training.

{...} If someone could design a base of hardware controllers that could be easily programmed to control these complex little digital mixers, it would be nothing short of amazing. {...}

Unfortunately the sort of thing you're describing typically has a terrible business case.

A digital mixer is basically three parts: I/O, processing, and UI (e.g control surface and/or app). Processing components are so cheap they're practically free, and the development doesn't have to cost much, either (although it can if you want it to). Most of the cost in I/O is in the analogue components which can pretty easily be engineered to a whole range of different price-points.

By contrast, even poor-quality pots and buttons are relatively expensive, and linear pots even more so, so producing physical control products to a price-point becomes a challenge even at scale. Worse still, UI design is hugely more complicated than circuit design (because the preferences of electrons are much more clearly defined than the preferences of humans), so the fixed costs of developing such a product will be relatively large, which makes amortization a problem in such a niche market.

By way of example, there have been any number of modular MIDI controller systems that have come and gone over the years. Even despite leaving most of the actual UI development to the end user, the companies behind these systems tend not to stick around for very long (and the ones that do often charge eye-watering prices).

-Russ

[Jason Glass]

I need to buy a keyboard submixer. 3 stereo keys, 2 mics from a leslie (under the stage) and a vocal. It needs at least one aux out to drive a local monitor.

I guess the venerable old Alesis Multimix still does the job, but is there anything else out there that I don't know about? I'd like to have 3 stereo channels plus the mono with mic pre channels.

Basically I need it for when a guest comes to play keys and/or sing for things like funerals and weddings. I'm going to put a little powered speaker there and make the whole key rig a little easier to deal with.

https://apb-dynasonics.com/product/prospec-2u6m2s/#1

[Caleb Dueck]

HDMI monitor and a mouse seems like way more of a cumbersome solution than a simple tablet with an ethernet jack on it.  But that's just me.

It's unfortunate that even though these little mixers can be easily remotely controlled, there isn't a big enough market for someone to build simple quality hardware interfaces for them, as that would be perfect in this scenario.  If someone could design a base of hardware controllers that could be easily programmed to control these complex little digital mixers, it would be nothing short of amazing.  There are so many cases similar to the OP where I need something simple like 5 channels of control and maybe an aux bus on the channel.  But, a touch screen interface isn't really practical, and the extra knobs on the mixer are just a source for inexperienced users to muck things up.

I love using the X-Touch with my X32 Rack when I need a small set of controls.  But even that gives WAY too much control to the inexperienced user. Being able to build off of something like that in an even simpler config would be a dream come true.

You've just described most of the full featured DSP units - QSys, Tesira, Symetrix, Xilica.  Physical controllers, iPad, Android (sometimes), computer, IP; customized GUI based on the end user, their skill level, and exactly what parameters they need. 

Someone that needs the capability of a full FOH console - needs a full FOH console, and has the expertise to use it. 
Someone that needs basic functionality - needs a specific interface(s) customized to them that controls the number-crunching DSP brain. 

 

[Brian Jojade]

You've just described most of the full featured DSP units - QSys, Tesira, Symetrix, Xilica.  Physical controllers, iPad, Android (sometimes), computer, IP; customized GUI based on the end user, their skill level, and exactly what parameters they need. 

Close, but not quite.  GUI isn't the most desirable interface.  Physical UI is what is often preferred.  THAT'S what I'd love to see.

[Caleb Dueck]

Close, but not quite.  GUI isn't the most desirable interface.  Physical UI is what is often preferred.  THAT'S what I'd love to see.

For wall mount - what about a standard wall controller with physical buttons/knobs/whatever, with something like an Ashly RW-8C, FR-8, or A&H IP-8? 

[Craig Hauber]

You've just described most of the full featured DSP units - QSys, Tesira, Symetrix, Xilica.  Physical controllers, iPad, Android (sometimes), computer, IP; customized GUI based on the end user, their skill level, and exactly what parameters they need. 

Someone that needs the capability of a full FOH console - needs a full FOH console, and has the expertise to use it. 
Someone that needs basic functionality - needs a specific interface(s) customized to them that controls the number-crunching DSP brain.

many years ago I made a "busy-box" of knobs and switches to control Shure p4800's for live use using the remote level and mute connections.  Worked well for other brands DSP's as well.
Also used a 6-Decora cutout rack-panel to mount various manufacturers wall controllers along with their companion DSP for portable use as well.

I would use DSP's of that type for mixer-mixing and PA drive at festivals as well as direct V-O-G and external playback for between-act announcements and promos without having to use a console.
I am sure there's much better universal control options available now within the Q-sys universe.

[Scott Helmke]

Because it's not needed.

Surprised nobody has linked a listing for an old Midas Legend or something.   

[Tim Weaver]

Surprised nobody has linked a listing for an old Midas Legend or something.   

Gotta love the mission creep when a bunch of soundguys have been idle for over a year! 

[ProSoundWeb Community]