ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7   Go Down

Author Topic: Sliders in consoles  (Read 15132 times)

Ivan Beaver

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9534
  • Atlanta GA
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2021, 03:37:13 PM »

My early career was on a Biamp 2442.  First console was an EV Tapco C-12.  I don't know where they are today with regard to dust and dirt in linear pots - in the early days that was the difficult part in manufacture - keeping the dirt out.
Among the differences between the P&G faders and the cheap stock faders was the location of the carbon track.

The normal ones had the track on the bottom, so dirt, dust (and beer) would settle on it.  The P&G had the track on the side, and an open bottom.  So most of the trash would simply fall through the fader.  And when you moved it, it would kick the trash out and it would fall to the bottom of the console.  Normal faders just pushed it out of the way for a little bit.

 There were other differences (such as much more robust construction) as well.
Logged
A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

Ivan Beaver

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9534
  • Atlanta GA
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2021, 03:42:11 PM »

A photo of my 2442 back in the late 80s.  I modified it to have another aux send.
Logged
A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

duane massey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1727
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2021, 03:51:00 PM »

We built consoles as early as '73 with sliders. As an indication of our ignorance, the very first one (hand-wired with discrete preamps) had the sliders wired upside down, so the gain increased when you lowered the slider. First time we took it out was for a band from the UK, and the engineer was really happy to see a console with sliders, as he had never used one. At the end of the show he told us that he thought maybe they should be the other way around. We changed them the next day.
Logged
Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

Brian Jojade

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3391
    • HappyMac Digital Electronics
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2021, 04:00:13 PM »

https://www.local695.com/magazine/the-way-we-were-mixers-past-present-part-1/

Here's a fun little page that shows a Westrex RA-1424 from 1954.  So mixers with sliders have been around at LEAST that long.

When did they become commonplace? Well, that's hard to define exactly, but by the mid 70's there were many examples on the market.

The PM1000 was an awesome beast.  I had one that I bought as part of a package deal from a studio built in 1982 back in 2000.  Bummed that I never really could put it to good use to it and finally sold it for a huge pile of money. :)
Logged
Brian Jojade

Steve-White

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 1582
  • Fort Worth
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2021, 04:10:49 PM »

A photo of my 2442 back in the late 80s.  I modified it to have another aux send.

Great picture, love that processing rack.  Makes the 2442 smaller than they were.  The stuff I used had MXR & Biamp EQ's, Ashly SC-50 compressors and the legendary Deltalab DL4.  That was a fun toy back then.  At a club ~1982, they had a 2442 up in the crows nest over the waitress station at the end of the bar.  SM58 TB mic in the booth.  During a break, I put the TB mic on the Aux bus, shoved it between my legs and ripped one, and caught the circulate switch on the DL4 at the right time - had it all the way opened up to 1024ms.  The singer/leader and I always had a thing going - all in fun.  He always made it a point to call me out on screwups.

He returned to the blacked out stage first at the end of the break, club packed.  I knew his routine between sets, always showed up with a fresh glass of water and set it beside the drum kit on the bass players rack.  So, this time as he came through the side stage door alone, I faded the break music down slowly as to not be noticed and shifted it over to monitors, pulled the FOH feed.  Then just as he set the glass of water down, the light man hit him with the spot and I muted the music and opened up the DL4 into the monitors with that nice loud fart.  Still makes me chuckle thinking about that one - Larry looked like a cross between a line backer and Charles Manson.  We got the Neanderthal Death Stare.  :)

Not taking anything away from today's technology and methodology - but, some of that old junk sounded pretty good back in the day.  :)

Back in the late 70's and early 80's when the trapezoids came into the scene - arena shows with a 25' tall column of traps on each side of the stage with a ground sub cluster sounded great on lots of shows I saw.  Not as good as today's best, but pretty damm good.
Logged

duane massey

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1727
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #15 on: June 25, 2021, 08:53:32 PM »

Used a pic of one of our consoles for the cover of an album, released in 1975.
https://www.facebook.com/202315778989/photos/pb.100040815045854.-2207520000../10150138507828990/?type=3

Logged
Duane Massey
Technician, musician, stubborn old guy
Houston, Texas

John Roberts {JR}

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 17176
  • Hickory, Mississippi, USA
    • Resotune
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #16 on: June 25, 2021, 09:58:15 PM »

Among the differences between the P&G faders and the cheap stock faders was the location of the carbon track.

The normal ones had the track on the bottom, so dirt, dust (and beer) would settle on it.  The P&G had the track on the side, and an open bottom.  So most of the trash would simply fall through the fader.  And when you moved it, it would kick the trash out and it would fall to the bottom of the console.  Normal faders just pushed it out of the way for a little bit.

 There were other differences (such as much more robust construction) as well.
The dominant mechanical feature was the dual drill rods that the slider was guided by, providing a smooth feel. In addition the P&G could be disassembled for cleaning and reassembled without affecting the feel.

By the 90s there was a Japanese fader (Alps) with two drill rods for similar smooth slider feel, and then an even cheaper Korean version (Jung poon).

JR 
Logged
Cancel the "cancel culture". Do not participate in mob hatred.

Woody Nuss

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 248
  • Santa Monica, CA
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #17 on: June 26, 2021, 06:20:50 PM »

First one I remember is the Uni-Sync Trooper and Trooper II
Logged

Ike Zimbel

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1057
  • I'm not a newbie, I just play one on the internet!
    • Zimbel Audio Productions
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #18 on: June 26, 2021, 07:59:47 PM »

First one I remember is the Uni-Sync Trooper and Trooper II
I think I remember those...didn't they make a monitor console? I think it had very small faders...3" maybe? Also, didn't they have a feature where you could link to consoles and make one?
Logged
~Ike Zimbel~
Wireless frequency coordination specialist and educator.
Manufacturer's Representative (Canada)
Radio Active Designs
Pro Audio equipment repair and upgrades.
~416-720-0887~
ca.linkedin.com/pub/ike-zimbel/48/aa1/266

Mike Caldwell

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 3089
  • Covington, Ohio
    • Mike Caldwell Audio Productions
Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2021, 11:51:46 PM »

This is a quibble, but the PM-1000 (also the first console I used with sliders, ca. 1978) actually has a very clever arrangement of a rotary pot controlled by the slider mechanism. IIRC, there's a gear on the pot shaft and a toothed belt that is connected to the slider.

I think the fader actually slid the pot on a track and gear on the pot shaft was mated to toothed solid
gear track.

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: Sliders in consoles
« Reply #19 on: June 26, 2021, 11:51:46 PM »


Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7   Go Up
 



Site Hosted By Ashdown Technologies, Inc.

Page created in 0.047 seconds with 23 queries.