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Author Topic: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer  (Read 12234 times)

Russell Ault

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #30 on: November 12, 2020, 02:25:53 PM »

[...]
My hope is that this unit will spur some manufacturer to put out a slightly larger variant with more direct control. Add in input and output PEQ, variable HPF, compression and automixing and you'll corner the market on breakout mixers, lol. Heck, throw in AEC and auto mix-minus and you'll nab the hybrid streaming market, too.

This is a big part of what bugs me. From a manufacturing standpoint these features would have added little to the cost of development and nothing to the cost of manufacturing (except, perhaps, for the AEC). Honestly, if this thing had the internal logic of an X-Air I'd have been much more willing to forgive the non-motorized faders and lack of surface controls (because those are expensive), but it bugs me to see a piece of equipment that appears to have been artificially hamstrung by design.

[...]
With this I can replace 3-5 mixer types.

1) Client needs a small sound-system for whatever, 2x K12's a mic and an iPod hookup; no one has 1/8" jacks anymore so the BT is fantastic, the faders and no controls are perfect for pre-setup; label; and push faders. Zed10FX isn't that (too many controls, no BT).
2) Client needs small setup for a singer-songwriter or small trio, or tiny band, or whatever... Nearly all require monitor sends and reverb. But needs to be simple enough for client & musician to use. The compressor and 4-band EQ + HPF are icing on the cake. Sure i'd like PEQ & advanced comp settings, but I'm happy with just some basics.
2b) Same as above, but there's now someone who can mix from their phone/tablet and can run an entire act/stage at a festival
3) USB interface for SMAART or tracks, or recording, whatever.
4) Backup mixer in gig-bag.
5) Corporate breakout room (one lectern mic, maybe sound, maybe
6) DJ like Matt said...
[...]

I'm not in the PA provider business so I don't ever deal with 1, 2, or 6 (actually, as a freelancer, I'm technically in the business of trying to convince clients that 1 and 2 should never happen :D ), but if I had to pick a single solution for 2b through 5 I would way rather have some kind of X-Air. I love physical faders, but unless I'm line-mixing a musical I'll trade them for a PEQ and a real compressor on every channel every single time. Personally, I curse under my breath every time I'm stuck using an analogue console because of how limited the solutions are, and I feel like the FLOW 8 would have me cursing just as much.

-Russ
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Brian Jojade

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #31 on: November 12, 2020, 06:30:43 PM »

This is a big part of what bugs me. From a manufacturing standpoint these features would have added little to the cost of development and nothing to the cost of manufacturing (except, perhaps, for the AEC). Honestly, if this thing had the internal logic of an X-Air I'd have been much more willing to forgive the non-motorized faders and lack of surface controls (because those are expensive), but it bugs me to see a piece of equipment that appears to have been artificially hamstrung by design.

If they would have just cut a few sliders into the Xair and sold that as an option, that would be awesome too.  I dislike the Xair becasue there's NO option to control anything without an additional hookup.

Having 8 sliders and a main volume control as the only external knobs would be incredible. If you want access to more, then bring out the tablet and have at it.
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Brian Jojade

Russell Ault

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #32 on: November 12, 2020, 08:26:44 PM »

If they would have just cut a few sliders into the Xair and sold that as an option, that would be awesome too.  I dislike the Xair becasue there's NO option to control anything without an additional hookup.

Having 8 sliders and a main volume control as the only external knobs would be incredible. If you want access to more, then bring out the tablet and have at it.

Well, I mean, they kind of did with the X-Touch, but I get that that's not quite what you're looking for.

I would guess that the problem is one of economics: DSP is almost free, I/O can be made quite cheaply, but physical controls are expensive to design, expensive to prototype, and expensive to manufacture. There's a reason the X-Touch costs almost twice as much as the XR12 its controlling, and I would guess that an XR18 with the controls you're looking for wouldn't be all that much cheaper to manufacture (especially once R&D costs are factored in) than an X32 Producer, which would make it a hard sell.

-Russ
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Brian Jojade

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #33 on: November 12, 2020, 08:51:06 PM »

Well, I mean, they kind of did with the X-Touch, but I get that that's not quite what you're looking for.

Yes, the X-touch coupled with the XR12 is close, but that's still too many buttons and too many connections.

Literally, if they offered an Xair 12 with 8 channel controllers and one big knob for master volume and that's it, The X-touch mini is pretty close. The few extra buttons could be ignored. Too bad it doesn't work with the little mixers or I'd have a bunch of them.
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Brian Jojade

Steve M Smith

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #34 on: November 13, 2020, 03:08:50 AM »

If they would have just cut a few sliders into the Xair and sold that as an option, that would be awesome too.  I dislike the Xair becasue there's NO option to control anything without an additional hookup.


I sometimes used to use my XR with just an X-Touch and no laptop or tablet. The only things you can't do, which needed setting up in advance, were selecting the effects and writing the scribble strips. I was considering a small rack case with the two mounted together, but ended up getting a Soundcraft SI Compact, followed by an M32R.


I think a bigger version of this Flow mixer with twelve XLR inputs and moiving faders would be great for the sort of things we used to use Mix Wizards for.


Steve.
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Alec Spence

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #35 on: November 13, 2020, 11:06:20 AM »

Yes, the X-touch coupled with the XR12 is close, but that's still too many buttons and too many connections.

Literally, if they offered an Xair 12 with 8 channel controllers and one big knob for master volume and that's it, The X-touch mini is pretty close. The few extra buttons could be ignored. Too bad it doesn't work with the little mixers or I'd have a bunch of them.

I sometimes used to use my XR with just an X-Touch and no laptop or tablet. The only things you can't do, which needed setting up in advance, were selecting the effects and writing the scribble strips. I was considering a small rack case with the two mounted together, but ended up getting a Soundcraft SI Compact, followed by an M32R.

I think a bigger version of this Flow mixer with twelve XLR inputs and moiving faders would be great for the sort of things we used to use Mix Wizards for.

Just these last two replies reinforce the issue that everyone wants a different interface - some want more controls, some want fewer, and there will never be the perfect interface.  I think that's why small/cheap digital mixer market is going to tend to be controlled by a separate device.

Yes, I'd love to be able to use some hardware controls with my XR18, but an X-Touch more than doubles the package size of the mixer, adds cables, and is quite pernickety to use for anything other than channel faders.

On the other hand, while my phone/tablet isn't tactile, Mixing Station is a comprehensive interface, is constantly being enhanced, and is so customisable that I *can* have exactly the interface I want, albeit not tactile.  Plus I can choose which device(s) to bring with it.  For some small events it'll just be my phone.  For others it will be a small/large tablet and/or laptop.  This is where surfaceless mixing excels, it leverages the interfaces you (probably) already own and cuts a whole load of cost from the core product.

Honestly, I don't think there'll ever be the "1402 killer" as, in digital world, it'll never be that compact, and it'll never have an interface to keep everyone happy.
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Scott Bolt

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #36 on: November 13, 2020, 04:42:45 PM »

Compared to my Zed 10fx which runs $330:

1)  Same number of "channels"
2)  A few less physical input types (no big deal)
3)  Has faders instead of knobs!
4)  Much better efx (especially reverb)
5)  More efx
6)  Has a compressor
7)  Has an output EQ
8)  10x2 USB recording capability (with a PC)
9)  Can be controlled wirelessly over bluetooth with a phone app
10) Can receive a bluetooth music stream from a device (like a phone)
11)  Can be powered via a battery or USB charger.
12)  Has individual clip LED's per channel
13)  Has 2 physical sends (monitors)

It appears to have some other nick nacks as well, but none I would ever consider using ;)

My venerable ZED 10Fx:

1)  Has more physical input fixtures (RCA's, 1/4" and XLR), but not many
2)  Has separate "listen" buttons for each input.
3)  Has more physical controls
4)  Doesn't "NEED" an app to setup.
5)  Has a single sweepable mid in the channel eq.
6)  Has a physical insert on the outputs.

Sweetwater has the Flow 8 at the same price as I would pay for another ZED 10fx.  I gotta say .... seems like a real no brainer.

The King is dead ...... long live the king :).  I think it is a nice little mixer.
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Daniel Levi

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #37 on: November 13, 2020, 04:53:30 PM »

I suppose buying it from Thomann even with shipping + tax would make it even cheaper, if it 199 in Germany with 19% VAT that would make it ~161 or ~$190, even with shipping at about $52 it still makes it cheaper, plus as it's USB powered there is no problems with it being the wrong voltage.
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Robert Lofgren

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #38 on: November 13, 2020, 05:22:29 PM »

Flow8 has solo on each channel, but only accessible from the app.

The thomann price is 197 + tax.

Quote
2)  Has separate "listen" buttons for each input.
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James Paul

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Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2020, 10:12:58 PM »

Bad on me if I may have missed it, but EFX to monitors ?
One device BT control at a time FYI.
'YouToobers', a 2020 burgeoning market segment, and MG evidently ready to respond it would seem.
From Flow to Wing, quite the niche products in search of a market IMO.
2 bits that the Flow is a no go for Art. Perhaps a new wunder-box compact from Uli & CO is worth a mention (Robert).

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ProSoundWeb Community

Re: NEW: Behringer FLOW 8 Digital Mixer
« Reply #39 on: November 13, 2020, 10:12:58 PM »


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