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Author Topic: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)  (Read 1081 times)

Ed Taylor

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2020, 04:47:24 pm »

Senny does make a transmitter that plugs into a regular mic.
yep..have a couple of them...really like them and they pull double duty cause I use them on the main out of mix console when I want to hit  a powered speaker (usually a bose L1 compact) downfield at an outdoor wedding.
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JohnPinchin

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2020, 05:52:43 pm »

I'd look at it from a different perspective and think about what is the best mic for the purpose within budget.         If you need a wireless mic for live vocals with an excellent gain before feedback then the pool available to choose from isn't very big, so pick the best available.  There are loads of mics that sound better but aren't practical so why compare to them - just compare with mics that would work for live vocals.  I'm using 945's and like them but you might want the 965 if you're sticking with sennheiser as that will give a more detailed sound at the loss of a little gbf. 

The signal losses due to wireless are another issue altogether but if the singer feels they need one then you have to work with that if you can. 
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Russell Ault

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2020, 07:33:03 pm »

[...] It takes a $3000 wireless system to approach the sonic quality of a $30 mic cable.  Seriously. [...]

You forgot about Line 6.  ;D

-Russ
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Scott Bolt

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2020, 08:34:42 pm »

To start with...

It takes a $3000 wireless system to approach the sonic quality of a $30 mic cable.  Seriously.

The M-160 is a very, very different animal from the e935 capsule.  It's really an apples to cantaloupes comparison so I'm not surprised you found a difference.

FWIW, an e935 (without the wireless) is about $160.  What did you pay for a new M-160?  Let that sink in.

My thoughts?  You have your priorities backwards.  In a "loud rock band", unless you're playing 60'x40' stages, the drum kit cymbals bleed into every open vocal mic (and listen to your tom mics, they'll be full of cymbals).  What you put up over the bronze is, IMHO, largely immaterial until you've achieved isolation from the vocal mics and even then, a product with the relatively fragility of the M-160 would be a distant 3rd choice for me.

I think you need to audition other Sennheiser wired mics to find the capsule you want.

I take it your use is not live, or why the RME products?
OMG.  I think I have literally typed much of your response to others in the past!

To the OP,

The e935 is a very nice mic IMO.  I have only used the wired version, but it is certainly not a bad mic.  I certainly like it better than an SM58 (please, no one hit me with any rotten fruit ;) ).  Your ribbon mic should absolutely provide better replication of a good vocal; however, they are also notoriously fragile, and generally pick up way too much stage noise.

I think there are better mics out there than the e935; however, I think it is one of the better dynamic mics.  If I were asked to sing on one, I would feel quite good about it.  Try working the channel eq on your mixer for the e935 to try to get a similar sound to the ribbon mic. If you have a digital mixer with a 4 band full PEQ, you should be able to get a very serviceable sound from the mic.

... and to Tim's point, unless you are on a stage that is quite large, it is very likely that the vocal mics are already getting more cymbals than you really want in the mix.  I am a big fan of vDrums and drum shields for exactly this reason (most of my gigs were on small to medium stages).

As in all things, YMMV.
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Tim Hite

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2020, 08:37:10 pm »


Back on topic:
I am aware that wireless in general is a compromise, but would different capsule make a big difference ?
So my question is if the difference in sound comes from the fact that it's wireless and then capsule doesn't matter much, or does it come more from the capsule and "upgrading" the capsule would make a significant difference ?

Yes, the capsule will make a difference unless you're using really lousy wireless, and even then it may. Senny G4, the capsule definitely makes a difference.

If you're going to test capsules, then all else should be equal, which was the point of Tim Mc's and my earlier posts. Using a cable levels the playing field and it's generally easier to come up with wired versions of mics as opposed to a bunch of wireless capsules and adapters (different threads for different manufacturers). The plug-on TX units are a valid way to explore and may be more relevant. If the artist demands something not available in wireless capsule form, a plug-on may be the way to go.

I happen to really like using the e935/945 in wired form. The sound nice with minimal work on my end, and the price is nice. I keep other mics around to satisfy client needs. Shure KSM8 is another capsule I like and have had good results with from both a sound and performance perspective.
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Geert Friedhof

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2020, 10:51:27 pm »

I think you are focussing on the wrong things that might make your band sound better.
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John L Nobile

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2020, 11:53:11 am »

I think you are focussing on the wrong things that might make your band sound better.

I agree with that but a singer would say something different

I find the nuances of a mic get lost on stage with a loud band and sketchy room acoustics. I focus on how well the singer's voice sits in the mix and the stage sound rejection of a mic.
I've gone from a good sounding room to a very bad one and went from a "low" stage volume to loud bands in my house gig. Now my KSM9's don't sound as great as they used to and it's tough to get enough monitor level for some bands. I've changed one capsule to an SM86. It doesn't sound as nice as the KSM9 soloed but it works better in the room and on stage. When things get normal I'll change the other 3.

But if you have the luxury of low stage volume and good acoustics, then the by all means use the mic that sounds best by itself.
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Chris Grimshaw

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2020, 12:08:47 pm »

I don't think there's a stage in the world where a non-operatic singer could use a ribbon mic at a couple of feet distance and achieve minimal spill/feedback.

Chris
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Mal Brown

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #18 on: August 08, 2020, 01:44:09 pm »

Have played about with the Snn 935 and 945.  Vastly preferred Audix vx-5. Next on my list for eval - If we get back to live application is the T'funken M-80 - That was good enough for Petty's last tour ...  worth a shot.  at here are plenty of high end wireless solutions out there.  I'm darned glad I don't have to fund one ;-)
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Russell Ault

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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2020, 04:00:38 pm »

I don't think there's a stage in the world where a non-operatic singer could use a ribbon mic at a couple of feet distance and achieve minimal spill/feedback.

Eh, it all depends. For feedback, there are plenty of plays (and even the odd musical) that are reinforced with boundary mics that are a heck of a lot further away from the performer than a couple of feet. Of course, at that distance, you're capturing the stage, not just the performer, but if your stage sounds good then that's not a problem. Don't think I'd try it with a rock band, but folk acts do the "three singers, three instruments, one microphone" thing all the time.

-Russ
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Re: Vocal mic comparison and question (with sound samples)
« Reply #19 on: August 08, 2020, 04:00:38 pm »


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