ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Down

Author Topic: 4 channel Cat snakes  (Read 3416 times)

Dan Mortensen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 835
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #30 on: December 23, 2019, 05:07:35 pm »

The sample 4 Pair from Elite Core came today and it's more like 3', which was very generous.

It's super flexible like the Gepco, maybe even more, although the jacket doesn't quite seem like the Gepco so maybe Gepco doesn't make it.

Looking at the ends there does seem to be a jacket around each individual CAT cable, and it does look like there's a shield under there in each individual, too, and maybe one around the whole bundle under the jacket.

It doesn't look like there's any longitudinal spacer, or maybe any kind of spacers, between the pairs within each CAT cable. (What's a shorter way of differentiating the 4 individual cables from the assembly contained by the outer jacket?)

It's going to be after the holidays until I can dissect it to see what's going on, and I'll take it to Blue Jeans cable to see if they are interested in/able to terminate it, if I want to proceed. They have a Fluke DTX 1800 (think that's the right number) where they measure every cable to confirm it meets spec.

It does look promising as a 4 in 1 cable, although I'm going to be thinking about the lack of spacers between pairs. Additionally, it's sold and labeled as a CAT6 cable, but all the others I've seen have needed longitudinal spacers of some kind to meet the higher speed spec, as opposed to CAT 5e. That is puzzling.
Logged

Brian Bolly

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 477
  • Baltimore/Amsterdam
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #31 on: January 14, 2020, 04:56:28 am »

It depends on whether or not you need shielded.

Link/Eurocable makes a 4x or 6x CAT6 STP and Gepco makes a 2x or 4x CAT5e UTP

Other than the TMB, those are the only two I'm aware of. 

I own one of the Link/Eurocable snakes that's 275' long.  It coils neatly into a 1/4 pack trunk, but I wouldn't try to put it on a reel - it does have a fair amount of stiffness to it, and as Mac mentioned these types of cables have a decent diameter to them.  But, it's been rock solid and I have no real complaints about performance at all.

I wanted to bring this back up since I went back and looked at what I actually bought, which is not what's listed in the LINK catalog.  I bought S/FTP that is shielded.  And Dan, if you're looking for cable to test, you might try some of this.  Here's the data sheet:

https://www.linkusa-inc.com/Portals/0/Reference/CUSLK%204CAT6SFTP.pdf
Logged

Sam Costa

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 343
  • 408-849-6420
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #32 on: January 14, 2020, 12:20:27 pm »

Hi all,

I have a Soundcraft Expression Si3 that I run a cat6 STP cable with and I bought a "backup" cable that's still wrapped up. I also have to provide lighting so I run a separate DMX line for that. I have been thinking of getting a 4 channel cat snake so I can just run 1 line and be done with it. Even though I would only need 2 cat lines I would have 2 backups lines or future expansion.

Who makes 4 channel Cat snakes? I see TMB makes some but haven't seen much more in my searches.
I have also thought of just get something like the Rat Sound cat boxes but I wouldn't have a true back up line if something goes wrong.

Steve, Elite Core Audio makes a 4ch Cat6 snake. Shoot me a DM and I'll get you pricing.
Logged
Being a productive member of society and encouraging others to do the same.

Dan Mortensen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 835
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #33 on: January 14, 2020, 06:06:03 pm »

I wanted to bring this back up since I went back and looked at what I actually bought, which is not what's listed in the LINK catalog.  I bought S/FTP that is shielded.  And Dan, if you're looking for cable to test, you might try some of this.  Here's the data sheet:

https://www.linkusa-inc.com/Portals/0/Reference/CUSLK%204CAT6SFTP.pdf

Hi Brian,

Thanks for revisiting this. Interesting that you were able to get something not in the catalog.

I called them and got an operator but the staff was already gone for the day. Thanks for the link. (No pun intended....)

In your use, the solid wire has held up well? How often do you coil/uncoil it, and how many cumulative times do you think it's been coiled/uncoiled/coiled? I'm also curious about the stiffness. If it's like the TMB...

I was thinking this morning about how many things I've left undone this year, and examining that Elite Core quad cable is one that I came up with. One thing or another has prevented that examination but I will try to get to it soon.

Thanks again.
Logged

Dan Mortensen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 835
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #34 on: January 15, 2020, 03:53:12 am »

The sample 4 Pair from Elite Core came today and it's more like 3', which was very generous.

It's super flexible like the Gepco, maybe even more, although the jacket doesn't quite seem like the Gepco so maybe Gepco doesn't make it.

Looking at the ends there does seem to be a jacket around each individual CAT cable, and it does look like there's a shield under there in each individual, too, and maybe one around the whole bundle under the jacket.

It doesn't look like there's any longitudinal spacer, or maybe any kind of spacers, between the pairs within each CAT cable. (What's a shorter way of differentiating the 4 individual cables from the assembly contained by the outer jacket?)

It's going to be after the holidays until I can dissect it to see what's going on, and I'll take it to Blue Jeans cable to see if they are interested in/able to terminate it, if I want to proceed. They have a Fluke DTX 1800 (think that's the right number) where they measure every cable to confirm it meets spec.

It does look promising as a 4 in 1 cable, although I'm going to be thinking about the lack of spacers between pairs. Additionally, it's sold and labeled as a CAT6 cable, but all the others I've seen have needed longitudinal spacers of some kind to meet the higher speed spec, as opposed to CAT 5e. That is puzzling.

Got some time tonight when it didn't snow (2-4" expected before tomorrow) so dug into it and took some pictures.

Here it is showing the coil radius that it is happy to maintain without help:



Not bad. Like I said, it's pretty flexible.

The chopped end, as is:



The wire, which we'll see closer in a minute, does indeed appear to be 23 gauge, which seems pretty stocky:

Stripping off the decently sized jacket



There is indeed an overall shield around the individually jacketed bundles, but there is no drain wire for the shield. Is an unterminated shield useful?

Unwrapping the shield, we see the four individually jacketed CATs, plus the tiniest little bit of center padding, which seems to be folded paper or something, with not much 3D presence (like a plastic spacer would have and maintain)



Removing the jacket from one of the four CATs, we see the four pairs within the wire are individually foil shielded along with a drain wire.



And removing a twisted pair from the fairly thick foil shield



we see no padding/spacers at all. Not that that is necessarily negative; the foil is quite thick compared to other foils I've seen and must be what allows them to achieve CAT6 speed, and probably reduces/eliminates the pair-to-pair capacitive issues from certain types of handling that we think are the cause of AES50 data/sync disruption.

Finally, taking the insulation from the wires shows they are indeed solid



and pretty stocky.

I'm grateful to Elite Core for sending a nice sample so quickly and really like the feel of this cable, but I'm not capable of reliably terminating RJ45's and am not quite ready to jump in as I'm concerned about Elite Core's testing of finished cables to verify they meet spec.

Sam, do you have any knowledge of that, or does anyone have any measurement data for finished cables from Elite Core?

I'd also like to see the Link cable and see how its construction compares before buying 250'. Also, unlike many people ITT, I think that if one of the CATs went bad in either an overall jacketed cable like these or in a bundle of individuals, I'd rather replace the whole bunch of them, since they'd all be the same age with the same handling, and if one went bad I wouldn't leave others of its type and age in with a new replacement. Better to start fresh. YMMV.

Logged

Helge A Bentsen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 982
  • Oslo, Norway.
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #35 on: January 15, 2020, 05:02:24 am »

Pro tip on Link Eurocable Cat multicores.

Link has a range of LKG LK connectors for these. They are crimped + glued to the cable and connects the overall shielding to chassis earth. I made a touring rig with LKG connectors in the doghouse and stage rack with fanout on the inside for network (and power, I had a power + network hybrid). Ran one cable for network + power, one connector in each end and done. Made for a quick setup and teardown.
Logged

brian maddox

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2587
  • HeyYahWon! ttsss! ttsss!
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #36 on: January 15, 2020, 11:10:55 am »

Pro tip on Link Eurocable Cat multicores.

Link has a range of LKG LK connectors for these. They are crimped + glued to the cable and connects the overall shielding to chassis earth. I made a touring rig with LKG connectors in the doghouse and stage rack with fanout on the inside for network (and power, I had a power + network hybrid). Ran one cable for network + power, one connector in each end and done. Made for a quick setup and teardown.

I've a friend whose rig uses these only it adds 2 audio pairs for analog comms or whatever.  So two Cat5e, two Audio pairs, and power in one connector.

Very handy.  The cable ends up being a little beefy, but it's flexible and "one run and done" is super nice.
Logged
"It feels wrong to be in the audience.  And it's too peopley!" - Steve Smith

brian maddox
bdmaudio@gmail.com

'...do not trifle with the affairs of dragons...

       ....for you are crunchy, and taste good with ketchup...'

Dan Mortensen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 835
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #37 on: January 25, 2020, 04:38:29 pm »

Pro tip on Link Eurocable Cat multicores.

Link has a range of LKG LK connectors for these. They are crimped + glued to the cable and connects the overall shielding to chassis earth. I made a touring rig with LKG connectors in the doghouse and stage rack with fanout on the inside for network (and power, I had a power + network hybrid). Ran one cable for network + power, one connector in each end and done. Made for a quick setup and teardown.

I've been communicating with Link USA, and over the course of daily back and forth for a couple/few days they mentioned these connectors, and that they can ship the cable with connectors installed and tested. When I asked what kind of devices they had to connect to the connectors (stage box, fanout, what?), that seemed to be a hard question and they stopped communicating.

Do you have pictures or links?
Logged

Helge A Bentsen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 982
  • Oslo, Norway.
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #38 on: January 26, 2020, 06:53:35 am »

I've been communicating with Link USA, and over the course of daily back and forth for a couple/few days they mentioned these connectors, and that they can ship the cable with connectors installed and tested. When I asked what kind of devices they had to connect to the connectors (stage box, fanout, what?), that seemed to be a hard question and they stopped communicating.

Do you have pictures or links?

Link has a nice custom shop, they manufacture cable systems and breakout boxes per your design.
Part of my previous day job was designing and selling cable systems for the Norwegian distributor, designed and sold several systems.
A common solution was a 19" panel with LKG connector wired to ethercons/xlr/powercons, one for FOH and the other for stage. Also sold some ADS boxes (one of their standard boxes) with connectors for those who needed to mount LKG breakouts inside doghouses or wanted to have a box on the floor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0JTN-Llb-c
https://www.linkusa-inc.com/Portals/0/Reference/lkg.pdf


Logged

Dan Mortensen

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 835
Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #39 on: January 27, 2020, 04:56:55 pm »

Link has a nice custom shop, they manufacture cable systems and breakout boxes per your design.
Part of my previous day job was designing and selling cable systems for the Norwegian distributor, designed and sold several systems.
A common solution was a 19" panel with LKG connector wired to ethercons/xlr/powercons, one for FOH and the other for stage. Also sold some ADS boxes (one of their standard boxes) with connectors for those who needed to mount LKG breakouts inside doghouses or wanted to have a box on the floor.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0JTN-Llb-c
https://www.linkusa-inc.com/Portals/0/Reference/lkg.pdf

Thanks, Helge, that is much more complete than what they sent.

You're finding that the CAT connectors within the MASS shell are holding up well?
Logged

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: 4 channel Cat snakes
« Reply #39 on: January 27, 2020, 04:56:55 pm »


Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5   Go Up
 



Page created in 0.054 seconds with 23 queries.