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Author Topic: PA upgrade advice  (Read 1295 times)

Phil Hatton

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PA upgrade advice
« on: August 20, 2019, 06:14:01 pm »

Hi all, first time poster here.  I find myself in a bit of a pickle over my next pa path.

I play in bands but also do the sound and Iíve always prided myself on having as good a pa as I can get.  I currently use 4 x Nexo ps8ís along with 2 x Nexo LS400ís along with their controller.  All powered by a full fat audio 6004.  Itís a lovely sounding system but with everything flight cased it means many trips and that amp is a heavy sucker by the time I rack it with the controller and the mixer (Soundcraft ui24r).

So Iíve been looking to go down the powered route and there are two deals which have come up that I could do with some advice on.

The first is 2 x kv2 ex10ís along with a ex2.2 sub.  While I have faith in the sub Iím not sure the tops would have enough power to get over a full rock band but I like how portable this system would be and the ex10ís get great reviews.

The second system that Iíve can get a within my budget would be a pair of RCís tt22aís, the mk1 version.  Again these get great reviews and I have no concern over their output and being able to get above a full band.  The sub for these would be a líacoustics sb15p.

Both systems would cost around the same.  I really like the idea of the kv2ís but Iím just worried theyíre not going to cut it.  I play pubs so donít need something huge and outrageously loud, just enough to get over a loud drummer.

Thanks for your help

Phil
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Weogo Reed

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Re: PA upgrade advice
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2019, 11:25:01 pm »

Hi Phil,

Welcome to the forums!

How are you using the four PS8s, two per side, or
are you setting up delay-fills?
If two per side, am guessing you are getting some significant comb filtering, and
one box per side will sound better.

The EX10 and TT22A are both very good sounding boxes, and reliable/durable.
Of the two, for small/medium pub gigs, I would go with the EX10.
For bigger spaces, the TT22A goes louder.

Good health,  Weogo
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Phil Hatton

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Re: PA upgrade advice
« Reply #2 on: August 21, 2019, 02:28:48 am »

Thanks Weogo,

The ps8ís run two a side, Iíve not noticed and issues having them setup like that and the two together gives enough output to get vocals over the drummer.

Most of the time itís covering a 4 piece (two guitars, bass and drummer)  but everything runs through the pa with the drums having the kick miked up and occasionally an overhead if itís a bigger venue.

I really want to go down the kv2 route because itís more portable and I think they will be the better sounding system.  However Iím worried that Iíll be asking too much of them, ideally the ex12ís would be the answer but theyíre out of my price range.
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: PA upgrade advice
« Reply #3 on: August 21, 2019, 03:42:16 am »

Thanks Weogo,

The ps8ís run two a side, Iíve not noticed and issues having them setup like that and the two together gives enough output to get vocals over the drummer.

Most of the time itís covering a 4 piece (two guitars, bass and drummer)  but everything runs through the pa with the drums having the kick miked up and occasionally an overhead if itís a bigger venue.

I really want to go down the kv2 route because itís more portable and I think they will be the better sounding system.  However Iím worried that Iíll be asking too much of them, ideally the ex12ís would be the answer but theyíre out of my price range.

So you have the speakers splayed to cover a wider area?

Horizontal array should not make the vocals appear significantly louder.

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Scott AKA "Skyking" Holtzman

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Chris Grimshaw

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Re: PA upgrade advice
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2019, 03:51:29 am »

It's worth noting that more expensive speakers get more sound per cubic foot of cabinet.

You mentioned getting loud enough to get vocals over a loud drummer.
How loud is the drummer? Do they break their sticks regularly by playing too hard?


For pubs etc, I'd consider ditching the subs altogether and look at some good 15" 2-way boxes. By "good", I mean it needs to have a large-format compression driver (2.5-4" diaphragm).

Chris
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Luke Geis

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Re: PA upgrade advice
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2019, 02:41:40 pm »

Well if your beating a drummer with a speaker capable of 125db peak, you should have no issue with any other speaker capable of about that as well. The EX10 says it will do 129db peak and 126db all day long. At this caliber of a speaker, I would believe you can actually get 126db without too much issue. So, In theory, it should outperform the PS8.

Keep in mind that 2 x 8" speakers does not mean you have 16" worth of radiating area. I.E, having two 8" speakers per side isn't really taking any load off of them. Spec-wise the KV2 EX10 has a bigger driver and throat, so it should not be working as hard to deliver your needs. A 10" speaker doesn't have quite as much surface area as 2 x 8" speakers so it may not have as much woof and thump as the PS8's, but it won't be too far off. It should sound tighter, clearer and punchier than the 2 x 8" speakers but only because it has less woof and less comb filtering.

You may not have noticed any comb filtering, but there is for certain comb filtering going on. So another thing that should improve with the KV2 EX10 is increased clarity and intelligibility. This is due to less comb filtering and less low end build up or coupling that would occur with the PS8's. When you have two speakers close enough together they do couple at some frequencies at the very least. Typically below 250hz is where you get full coupling at. This is probably what made the PS8's work together well, they are small enough that they can get a pretty reasonable range of coupling and not as drastic comb filtering in the high end. A single 10" speaker that is technically more capable should, in theory, sound much better.

I prefer the idea of going with systems as opposed to hodgepodges. So I would opt for the KV2 rig myself. If I were to get the RCF, I would stick with an RCF sub too. If it were my money I would go with the newer TT22Aii version as opposed to the older one. Talk to Mike Pyle, he may be able to show you the light? Although I do feel the KV2 system would be a better all-around buy if you were set on that.

If the budget is locking you down to those options, I wouldn't overlook the JBL SRX line. While perhaps not as good overall, you can get a very good PA, that sounds pretty damn good and doesn't disappoint. It would be nice if they made a 10" version. Another up and coming speaker is the Yamaha DZR series. It doesn't have major traction yet, but its performance to size ratio is pretty huge. Worth a look again if you need to work into a budget.
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Phil Hatton

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Re: PA upgrade advice
« Reply #6 on: September 03, 2019, 10:56:07 am »

I thought Iíd share a quick update on this.  Firstly, thanks for all your input, it was much appreciated.

Iíve end up with a bit of a mix to my original post.  I ended up going with the RCF tt22aís purely down to the fact I simply couldnít afford the KV2ís.  I got a great price on the rcfís and tried them last night with some simple playback and theyíre very impressive, I didnít expect such a jump from the Nexoís and while weíre not comparing like for like the presence, level of detail and clarity of the RCFís has already won me over.

As for the sub, I couldnít really make my mind up on an RCF sub, I didnít want to go bigger than a 15 and theyíre quite limited in that department, my budget wouldnít stretch to the TTS15 and the 905 didnít seem to be in the same league as the tt22aís.  I ended up getting a KV2 EX2.2 which is currently making its way to me.  Iím looking forward to getting it all together, if the kv2 is as good as the rcf tops then itís going to be a lovely system plus if I am able to afford kv2 tops in the future I have a good upgrade path.

Thanks for your help!!
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Re: PA upgrade advice
¬ę Reply #6 on: September 03, 2019, 10:56:07 am ¬Ľ


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