ProSoundWeb Community

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7   Go Down

Author Topic: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use  (Read 5912 times)

Rick Powell

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 831
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2019, 07:31:22 pm »

As well as being ported, I believe the SM80M is also a slightly larger cabinet. I seem to remember Ivan mentioning that the sealed cabinet of the SM80 has some type of effect on the impedance of the cabinet when played at high volume.

Spec sheet says 30 ohms at 100 Hz (for a nominal 8 ohm cabinet), it's down to 7 ohms or so at 250 Hz. If you try to add low end, it will take it, but you'll need some amp muscle. And the 12" will start honking when it bottoms out in the sealed cabinet. I have only taken it that far once.

The SM80M being ported would have a much lower impedance down low. Spec sheet says 9 ohms at 100 Hz.
Logged

Mark Scrivener

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 195
    • My Recording Studio
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2019, 07:47:54 pm »

Please excuse my dumb question, but the passive SM80/SM80M appears to be about 2-3x the cost of the top powered box offerings from Yamaha, JBL, EV, etc, and that doesn't include the cost of a power amp. I realize Danley is more "real pro" gear and the others are more "prosumer", but what does one actually get for that money? Is the sound quality really that much better? Is the SPL significantly higher?

I certainly understand where companies like Danley come in for larger systems, installations, big touring rigs, etc. but I'm trying to understand the "value proposition" of these higher end offerings when it comes to small SOS over subs type systems.

Many thanks,
Mark

Steve Crump

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 371
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #12 on: September 02, 2019, 08:18:51 pm »

Thanks everyone for all the insight on the design differences between the two cabinets, it has been real enlightening. But, my question is simply, in a SOS situation is there any advantage in performance when using the SM80?

I am leaning toward the SM80M, but I had to ask.
Logged

Tim McCulloch

  • SR Forums
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 21800
  • Wichita, Kansas USA
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2019, 08:32:37 pm »

Thanks everyone for all the insight on the design differences between the two cabinets, it has been real enlightening. But, my question is simply, in a SOS situation is there any advantage in performance when using the SM80?

I am leaning toward the SM80M, but I had to ask.

The trade off is less output but more LF extension.  You get to pick the one that matters more to you.
Logged
"Practicing an art, no matter how well or badly, is a way to make your soul grow, for heaven's sake. Sing in the shower. Dance to the radio. Tell stories. Write a poem to a friend, even a lousy poem. Do it as well as you possible can. You will get an enormous reward. You will have created something."  - Kurt Vonnegut

Ivan Beaver

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 9102
  • Atlanta GA
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2019, 08:45:21 pm »

Danley measures their products as they will be used:  subs on the ground (half space) and top boxes in the air (free space).  I'm pretty sure that Ivan addressed this fairly recently.
You are correct. 

However the cabinets intended to be used as monitors are measured as sitting on the ground (intended usage), and measure at 2m (a rough listening position from the cabinet as a monitor).

The tuning the of SM80M is different than the SM80.  Same driver and xover.

The SM80 is a sealed cabinet (so that it can more easily be integrated into an alignment with a sub), while the SM80M is a ported cabinet (designed to be more full range by itself).

The internal volume of the SM80M is a good bit more than the SM80.

The SM80 has better control over its excursion (due to the smaller sealed cabinet) and has an impedance rise on the low end to further help control the excursion.

Hopefully this helps explain some things
Logged
A complex question is easily answered by a simple-easy to understand WRONG answer!

Ivan Beaver
Danley Sound Labs

PHYSICS- NOT FADS!

Mike Pyle

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1028
  • Santa Rosa, CA
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2019, 09:02:30 pm »

The SM80M also does not have fly points like the SM80 does, which may be something to consider for a multi-use cabinet.  The other main distinctions are the ported versus sealed cabinets and the bi-amp switch on the M.

Some photos I saw recently of SM80Ms had 4 fly points in each end of the cabinet. Maybe Ivan can confirm if they have added flyware to new production.
Logged
Mike Pyle  Audiopyle Sound  707-315-6204
Dealer For: JBL, Soundcraft, Crown, dbx, AKG, Yorkville, EV, QSC, RCF, FBT, Danley Sound Labs, Fulcrum Acoustic, Tannoy, Lab Gruppen, Powersoft, Linea Research, VTC, EAW, Allen & Heath, Ashly, APB, Audix, One Systems, OnPoint Audio, Presonus, K&M, Ultimate, Global Truss, Road Ready, SKB, Gator, Radial Engineering, Turbosound, Midas, dB Technologies, American DJ, Odyssey, ProCo, Rapco, CBI, Elation, Mipro, Chauvet, Blizzard, Shure, Whirlwind, Bassboss, Yamaha, Line 6, Behringer, Whirlwind, On-Stage, more...

Robert Lunceford

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 464
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2019, 09:09:44 pm »

Please excuse my dumb question, but the passive SM80/SM80M appears to be about 2-3x the cost of the top powered box offerings from Yamaha, JBL, EV, etc, and that doesn't include the cost of a power amp. I realize Danley is more "real pro" gear and the others are more "prosumer", but what does one actually get for that money? Is the sound quality really that much better? Is the SPL significantly higher?

I certainly understand where companies like Danley come in for larger systems, installations, big touring rigs, etc. but I'm trying to understand the "value proposition" of these higher end offerings when it comes to small SOS over subs type systems.

Many thanks,
Mark

Sound quality is subjective. With the FIR filters, a lot of the prosumer cabinets offer really nice sound quality. Their sound quality will not hold up as well at a distance or at SPL levels where the Danley's sound quality still holds together. The prosumer cabinets will start to sound strained and pushed whereas the Danleys will sound like they are still cruising along.
The build quality and components in the Danleys are top quality. Prosumer models are designed to stay within a price point in order to compete with their competitors. Danley designs and manufactures a speaker to accomplish a specific goal and uses the best materials and construction to do so - then they price the product accordingly.
I feel that the Danleys are fairly priced considering their build and performance. I have had no regrets with my purchase, I would recommend them, and I would buy them again.

Logged

Mark Scrivener

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 195
    • My Recording Studio
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2019, 10:48:03 pm »

Sound quality is subjective. With the FIR filters, a lot of the prosumer cabinets offer really nice sound quality. Their sound quality will not hold up as well at a distance or at SPL levels where the Danley's sound quality still holds together. The prosumer cabinets will start to sound strained and pushed whereas the Danleys will sound like they are still cruising along.
The build quality and components in the Danleys are top quality. Prosumer models are designed to stay within a price point in order to compete with their competitors. Danley designs and manufactures a speaker to accomplish a specific goal and uses the best materials and construction to do so - then they price the product accordingly.
I feel that the Danleys are fairly priced considering their build and performance. I have had no regrets with my purchase, I would recommend them, and I would buy them again.

Thanks Robert. So coverage at high quality appears to be the real difference - along with the quality and support one would expect at this level vs a mass market product. Makes sense. Now I just need gigs that justify the expense. :-)

Benjamin Gingerich

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 90
    • LifeSound AV
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #18 on: September 02, 2019, 11:11:37 pm »

Please excuse my dumb question, but the passive SM80/SM80M appears to be about 2-3x the cost of the top powered box offerings from Yamaha, JBL, EV, etc, and that doesn't include the cost of a power amp. I realize Danley is more "real pro" gear and the others are more "prosumer", but what does one actually get for that money? Is the sound quality really that much better? Is the SPL significantly higher?

I certainly understand where companies like Danley come in for larger systems, installations, big touring rigs, etc. but I'm trying to understand the "value proposition" of these higher end offerings when it comes to small SOS over subs type systems.

Many thanks,
Mark

Mark,
Where the value is to me is I can take out a pair of SM80s (SOS) and 2 BC 412s by myself and nearly replace the output of 2 kf850s and 8 sb 1000s with better quality and that throws farther (for a lack of a better term) now I can take bigger gigs than I would want to attempt with the prosumer boxes and dont need anyone there to help me if in a easy to get in and out location and the Danley line is becoming more scalable too.
Ben
Logged
Benjamin Gingerich
Project Manager - LifeSound Av - Macon, Georgia
Air Force Reserves- Electrical Power Production
AA Electrical & Mechanical Engineering

Tim McCulloch

  • SR Forums
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 21800
  • Wichita, Kansas USA
Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2019, 11:55:59 pm »

Thanks Robert. So coverage at high quality appears to be the real difference - along with the quality and support one would expect at this level vs a mass market product. Makes sense. Now I just need gigs that justify the expense. :-)

That plus the stuff Benjamin mentions.

It's not that one product is louder than another, nor how much electricity a product can turn into heat (rather than audible signals), but how well it covers an area and, also important, how it performs off-axis (pattern control).  Intelligibility is a result of phase coherence in the *acoustic crossover* and in the case of Danley's Synergy designs, making the pass bands into a single radiating source with enough horn to control the pattern.

What I did not realize much earlier in my career is how much easier it is to work with Nice Stuff.  Not in a snobby way but because those bigger price tags tend to reflect a significant difference in audible performance as well as a "system-oriented design" approach where all models are meant to work and play together in a complimentary way.

This is the difference between, say, JBL's PRX535, SRX835 and VP7315.  The form factor is almost identical but the Venue Precision model is audibly better than the SRX, which is better than the PRX535.  Each step up in price comes with improvements that do not show up as "single number" specifications, along with those improvement that are reflected in that way.

Part of the fun in selecting new gear is auditioning it to see/hear where those differences are.  One expects a change as one moves up/down the $$$ chain, but what is interesting is that most products in a given price bracket tend to have very similar components, packaging, processing needs - they tend to be more alike than different - but still can sound very different.  If other factors are similar, it's mostly a matter of taste and non-audio features that tip the balance in favor of a given product.
Logged
"Practicing an art, no matter how well or badly, is a way to make your soul grow, for heaven's sake. Sing in the shower. Dance to the radio. Tell stories. Write a poem to a friend, even a lousy poem. Do it as well as you possible can. You will get an enormous reward. You will have created something."  - Kurt Vonnegut

ProSoundWeb Community

Re: SM80M versus SM80...SOS use
« Reply #19 on: September 02, 2019, 11:55:59 pm »


Pages: 1 [2] 3 4 ... 7   Go Up
 



Page created in 0.045 seconds with 22 queries.