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Author Topic: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!  (Read 2390 times)

Roland Clarke

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2019, 09:48:19 am »

Recently using an X32 with the S32 rack.  Thrown into a KV2 rig.  Proof enough there really isn’t anything wrong with the sound of the worlds favourite cheap mixer.  My problems with the gear at this end is flexibility, fx and operational workflow.  The best desks do give you that.
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Mal Brown

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2019, 01:11:31 pm »

Agreed!  I have two Ui24R's.

To some extent, Soundcraft poisoned the well by introducing the Ui12 and Ui16 units before the Ui24.  The smaller units were built differently (don't ask me how), and they got a bit of a reputation for having a high noise floor and perilous WiFi.

The Ui24R still suffers on occasion from its passive cooling (there's a spot and connector for a fan, but it was omitted for $$$?) and underpowered USB ports.  Both are relatively easy to overcome and, as noted, I always run an ethernet connected PC and external WiFi router.

But, the clarity is excellent and the channel EQ section is as good, if not better, than the "conventional" digital consoles costing 4x as much.

I, personally, would love to see Soundcraft develop a control surface to drive the brains of the Ui24. Still like having physical faders, especially when riding several at once.  How many R&D resources Samsung is willing to stick into Soundcraft is uncertain.

Dave

Agreed.  Just added my second UI-24r.  About to list a pristine SI-1...
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dave briar

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2019, 03:49:01 pm »

You do that enough times, and show that you know your shit, you may get your own set of keys....
Cry and whine, and you get jack shit.
Reputation is EVERYTHING in this business.
Just sayin...
Agreed and in the vein of “what goes around comes around” I sent a very brief email to the owner of the sound co expressing my appreciation for his crew being so “friendly, accommodating, efficient, and professional” — the last adjective being essentially redundant.
[/end_thread_swerve]
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jon mccumber

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #23 on: September 03, 2019, 06:50:10 am »

I just ran the B stage of a fest last week using my X18. I had the choice of that or the providers Mackie 16 channel analog board. It worked flawlessly all day. 12 acts (6 of whom sound checked the previous day) without a hiccup. I use a cheap Walmart router and never lost connection. Roughly 2k in attendance. A few more channels would have been great. Mixed the whole day on my tablet but had my hardwired laptop on the side of the stage.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2019, 09:33:37 pm by jon mccumber »
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Alec Spence

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #24 on: September 03, 2019, 08:07:10 am »

Interesting to realise that Metallica using Behringer P16-M personal monitoring mixers in their tuning room for pre-show rehearsal/warm-up.  No idea whether there's further Behringer kit in that setup, but there may well be.
https://youtu.be/CEHlDvbTrx0

And Metallica are a "way down the bill" act.  I'm sure it's all handy promotion for Music Group, but they wouldn't use if it they weren't happy with it...
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John A Chiara

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #25 on: September 03, 2019, 09:27:20 am »

I was hired in June to mix an American Idol/The Voice contestant show at a 17,500 seat venue. I was given a choice of consoles..and our rehearsal/sound check day got bumped...so one day in/out with a bunch of inexperienced kids. I chose an M32 because of my familiarity with it. I got nothing but very positive reviews..confirmed by many videos.
As long as it met the routing requirements..I would do it again if time restrained.
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Robert Lofgren

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #26 on: September 03, 2019, 10:09:33 am »

I’ve seen videos with Dream Theatre using the p16m in the studio. I think that I saw a m32 as well, but I’m not 100% sure.

Interesting to realise that Metallica using Behringer P16-M personal monitoring mixers in their tuning room for pre-show rehearsal/warm-up.  No idea whether there's further Behringer kit in that setup, but there may well be.
https://youtu.be/CEHlDvbTrx0

And Metallica are a "way down the bill" act.  I'm sure it's all handy promotion for Music Group, but they wouldn't use if it they weren't happy with it...
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Branimir Bozak

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #27 on: September 13, 2019, 06:36:23 pm »

Now this is a topic I can relate to...

Fortunately or unfortunately. 😆

As the band I tour with got bigger I invested in everything, first the microphones, then the mixer, and last year, a "newer" mixer.

Frankly, for 90% of the time, the console I use is really enough, lugging anything of more fidelity would not yield noticable difference. Either smaller shows, crappier PA's, and also limited van space, foh space, and the fact that I'm doing it myself with 0 roadies or techs.

Two biggest shows were 80 000+ people.

First time with Si Expression 3 with a Compact stagebox.

Second time with Allen & Heath GLD80.

Yes, I wish I could afford and own a dLive, or any of the SD Digicos, but that kind of investventment would not pay off in the next 10 years.

Having said that, last week the crowd spilt beer through the vents of my GLD, the console is now at the repair, cannot conect to DSP card.

The difference between top tier consoles and smaller ones is still there, but if the daily beater gets the job done, why not?

I also work at festivals and have seen many known bands coming with a couple of trucks of equipment, Digicos/Avids foh and mons, waves loaded, of course, no touring without waves, fancy mike setups, like Palmer pdi09 and two Heils per guitars, and with all that stuff going into nicely tuned Lacoustic PA, and still having crappy mixes, poorly eqed instrumemts, plugin overkills, and all sorts sub par things going on....

Here are two photos from the 80 000 show:


Yeah, the festival console was Digidesign, and it has more headroom and better instrument separation, and is sure of the right purpose unlike my GLD, but for most of the time I feel it would all sound much better if the drummer hit the kick with same intesity all the time, and the bass player would not miss the beats of the kick doing like flams on the drum beat... No console can play instead of the players on stage.
« Last Edit: September 13, 2019, 07:14:48 pm by Branimir Bozak »
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Scott Bolt

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2019, 12:42:25 pm »

Now this is a topic I can relate to...

Fortunately or unfortunately. 😆

As the band I tour with got bigger I invested in everything, first the microphones, then the mixer, and last year, a "newer" mixer.

Frankly, for 90% of the time, the console I use is really enough, lugging anything of more fidelity would not yield noticable difference. Either smaller shows, crappier PA's, and also limited van space, foh space, and the fact that I'm doing it myself with 0 roadies or techs.

Two biggest shows were 80 000+ people.

First time with Si Expression 3 with a Compact stagebox.

Second time with Allen & Heath GLD80.

Yes, I wish I could afford and own a dLive, or any of the SD Digicos, but that kind of investventment would not pay off in the next 10 years.

Having said that, last week the crowd spilt beer through the vents of my GLD, the console is now at the repair, cannot conect to DSP card.

The difference between top tier consoles and smaller ones is still there, but if the daily beater gets the job done, why not?

I also work at festivals and have seen many known bands coming with a couple of trucks of equipment, Digicos/Avids foh and mons, waves loaded, of course, no touring without waves, fancy mike setups, like Palmer pdi09 and two Heils per guitars, and with all that stuff going into nicely tuned Lacoustic PA, and still having crappy mixes, poorly eqed instrumemts, plugin overkills, and all sorts sub par things going on....

Here are two photos from the 80 000 show:


Yeah, the festival console was Digidesign, and it has more headroom and better instrument separation, and is sure of the right purpose unlike my GLD, but for most of the time I feel it would all sound much better if the drummer hit the kick with same intesity all the time, and the bass player would not miss the beats of the kick doing like flams on the drum beat... No console can play instead of the players on stage.

Nice gigs!  Looks like a blast.  Wish I could watch from behind some night at a large gig and see what kinds of stuff goes on behind the curtain :)

I agree with your sediments though.  The Expression series lacking DCA's and LCD scribble strips would certainly not be my first choice of "cheap mixers" to use.  The GLD (of course) is quite a nice mixer that is quite feature filled. 

I have heard some remarkably great sounding mixes on pretty average rigs.  If anything, the trend has been that those with better speaker systems seem to sound significant better than those with really cheep ones.

Like you, I have heard some really nice mixers churn out some really bad sounding mixes.

Of course, I suspect it is like anything else.  While Rafael Nadal may be able to beat me at tennis with any racket he picked up at Walmart, he may find things a little more challenging with that same racket in a match with Roger Federer.

So yes, a better mixer will make it easier to get a better mix, but many many other factors appear to have more overall effect on the sound than the mixer ..... not the least of which is the person running it.
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Scott Holtzman

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Re: "Cheap" digital mixers running FOH at big festivals!!! Wow!
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2019, 08:50:06 pm »

Quote
I agree with your sediments though.

Are they falling in line?

Seriously I worked a for AARP presents of all things,  imag, ligjting and sound.  The support act was Bruce Hornsby,  he got an x32 and sounded great through the db T8's

Our very own Bill Schmaky mixes Head East on an M32 and his mix sounded just as good as the dueling Digco's Styx and REO were out with.
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