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[Tim McCulloch]

FWIW I've finally seen an act using a TM30 (for monitors).  I've never touched one, but this was the first Touch Mix I've seen in the wild.

If it works for your needs go for it.

[Chris Grimshaw]

Not true. Run a Cat5/6 cable from the UI to your FOH position and connect to a computer with a large touch screen. People are running large multi day festivals this way with the UI (see the UI facebook page). And while there are ways to "rig" physical faders, nothing official from Soundcraft.

Mark, I'd like to reiterate that I'm currently running my FOH entirely wirelessly, and I intend to keep it that way. Some of the venues I work at don't have the option to run cables to/from FOH.

You could also simply skip the network entirely and connect a USB touchscreen directly to a Soundcraft UI-24, or use both a wifi tablet and the touchscreen for local control.

Adding a USB touchscreen to a UI24 feels like we're building a TM30 out of parts. Is there any advantage to going that way?


A lot of the gigs I work on are outdoor family festivals in a field or car park. Setup and tear down on the day, and I'm usually acting as stage manager, FOH, and monitor engineer, while also supplying the PA. Bands on for 45 mins, 15-minute changeover, usually from midday until well into the evening.
I've been doing that (with reasonable success - many bands have told me it's the best sound they've had, both on-stage and off) with a TM16. I can make it work, but having physical faders would make mixing much easier.

Most of the time, I can find a small table and chair to set up my small FOH with. Couple of iPads, log on to my WiFi, connect to the big USB battery, and that's my FOH build done.
Without running any cables to/from the stage, what I'd like to do is make it so I've got physical faders to mix on. The TM30 does that by connecting the faders to the iPad via USB, so it's really acting as a control surface for that iPad. This approach is straightforward and, usefully, modular: I could run 4x iPads with 4x fader banks, and have 24 channels plus subgroups at my fingertips.
I can't see anything on the market right now that can touch that.

Tim, there's a TM30 on eBay in basically-new condition at the moment, so I'm close to taking your advice.

Cheers, all
Chris

[Mark Scrivener]

Chris,

I'm sure the TM30 is a great unit, and if it works for you, go for it. I've never used the TM30 but if you are happy with the TM16, then I'm sure you would like the TM30 as much or more.

Now since your thread is titled "talk me out of a QSC TM30" I'm going to tell you two things that I personally find concerning about the design....which may or may not be factors for you.

1. Physical gain/trim knobs. Since they appear to be actual pots (not rotaries), it would not be possible to remotely adjust the gain on a channel. Granted you shouldn't be constantly adjusting channel gains, but I did find this aspect of the old Presonus Studio/Live mixers extremely annoying the few times I've had to use them.

2. The built in screen is small. Not a huge deal, but working on larger screens spoils you fast.

That said, the TM30 appears to have all the processing bells and whistles one would expect from a modern digital mixer. No idea about the workflow, but assuming they didn't make radical changes from the TM16 then that should be a non issue for you.

There, that's the best I can do talking you out of it.... :-)

[Taylor Hall]

Yeah, physical faders.

Here's a bit of the video: https://youtu.be/Yj6cke1DPw4?t=386
They've set up a small FOH with an iPad and a fader bank, and it's controlling the desk over WiFi.

I haven't seen anything that can rival that.

Chris

Your control surface would still need to be wired either to the console itself or a computer running a DAW which is then connected to the console. All the devices they showcase in that video are not wireless. Like I said in my other post, you can do the same thing with other consoles already. If anything, QSC is late to the game having only just added this feature in their latest firmware.

[Luke Geis]

If you know me, I'm not a fan of the TM series, but that is not important. The Behringer X-Touch does require an IEC power cord, but it certainly pulls little power and is compatible with just about every piece of gear known to man. You can get an X-32R ( rack unit ) that can be controlled from the front of the unit if need be if the network does go down, which should be rare seeing as you have to have your own external one anyway. The X-Touch can then do most all of your needed functions from layers, EQ, DCA's and whatnot. It is probably the best option if you need a small potent rig that checks almost every box of desired options. Low power consumption too. If the X32R and the X-Touch pull much more than 100 watts I would be surprised. As best as I can tell the two combined would pull about 90watts. You would have a nearly full working surface, the ability to run via iPad, and if shit hits the fan you can still control it from the front panel of the mixer box. It is expandable even. Want 32 channels, just get another 16 or 32 channel stagebox. Just my 2 pennies.

[Nathan Riddle]

If you REALLY want to keep mixing fully wirelessly but have physical faders. Seems to me your options are Behringer X-Touch like Luke is suggesting or midi control and a midi board in the DIY/cheap camp and dLive on the expensive route.

I got my dLive CDM32 earlier this year and really like it. Haven't mixed on it a ton, but it is absurdly powerful for what I do.
Combined with the IP8 I can mix a whole show completely wirelessly and have physical faders at my mix location if I wanted to.

[Dan Richardson]

SC has done something clever with their TM30 Pro, where you can connect a set of faders to the iPad via USB, and it's all taken care of. The faders usually require 12v DC power, which can still be done by battery.

Mixing Station Pro can do this with several brands of mixers. I've used it with X-Airs. I believe he has it working for X/M32 and Qu. SQ, Si, and GLD are all in various states of completion, so I'm not sure of the status of their MIDI support.

[Chris Grimshaw]

Mixing Station Pro can do this with several brands of mixers. I've used it with X-Airs. I believe he has it working for X/M32 and Qu. SQ, Si, and GLD are all in various states of completion, so I'm not sure of the status of their MIDI support.

Hi Dan,

That's really good info, thanks. I'll do some reading up.

Chris

[Jeff Lelko]

If you REALLY want to keep mixing fully wirelessly but have physical faders. Seems to me your options are Behringer X-Touch like Luke is suggesting or midi control and a midi board in the DIY/cheap camp and dLive on the expensive route.

This is what I do as well with my DM32 and IP8.  That option will set you back about $10K, but as Nathan said, it’s an extremely powerful and versatile solution.  Going with a CDM32 will shave a few thousand off the price.  You’re still going to want a tablet running MixPad at the very least, and preferably something running Director if you won’t have a larger surface on site.  There are going to be trade-offs for each option you consider, but my dLive has treated me very well.  Good luck!

[Chris Grimshaw]

Just a quick note to say that the TM30 arrived yesterday. A few came and went on the usual auction site, and then this one popped up. Very light use, case and tablet stand included. Put in a low-ish bid (around 40% off RRP for the caboodle) and got it.

Initial impressions are good. My only gripe so far is that it doesn't work with the USB WiFi dongle that comes with the TM16, so I had to fetch the amp rack (where the router lives) and run Cat5 in order to get the iPads connected.

I think I've got another USB dongle in a drawer somewhere, so I'll give that a try.


Some on-location work coming up this weekend, so I think that might be the first gig with it.

Cheers, all.

Chris

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